4 ms·

> Eventually, Google will do something that is an abuse of their monopoly power. This is one of Mozilla's problems: they constantly advertise privacy, etc. and

> Eventually, Google will do something that is an abuse of their monopoly power. This is one of Mozilla's problems: they constantly advertise privacy, etc. and while I agree their views in general, most users don't care. If you position yourself as the privacy respecting web browser, you will only ever get the tiny niche of people who care and everyone else who sees your marketing will just roll their eyes and makes jokes about tinfoil hats. That's not to say that Mozilla should do all the anti-competitive things Google does, just that they need to stop advertising themselves this way if they ever want to get any reasonable market share back (unless they want to be a niche browser for people who don't like Google, which is fine if that's all they want to do). That being said, I don't see how any amount of marketing can fix Mozilla's problem for the same reasons the article pointed out.

organsnyder 8y ago
During the IE-6 dark ages of the early 2000s, Mozilla's browser (the Mozilla suite, then standalone Firebird, finally renamed to Firefox) was positioned in a similar way: it was the niche browser for people who cared about an open web. It stayed that way for quite a few years, slowly gaining traction by implementing features—tabbed browsing, popup blocking—not found in the dominant IE browser. I could see a similar approach working again. Mozilla could focus on user-centric features, while Chrome has to also serve the needs of Google's business interests.
- laumars 8y ago
  > the Mozilla suite, then standalone Firebird, finally renamed to Firefox I believe it was originally called Phoenix. Though you're right it was then called Firebird and renamed again to Firefox afterwards. I think each time was due to trademark disputes? Going to your point though, I hope you're right but I'm a bit more sceptical. Chromium, being open source, means anyone who doesn't like the stagnation of Chrome would just fork Blink and create their own modern browser while still enforcing the Chrome mono-culture. I'd love to see Gecko take off in the same way kHTML, webkit and blink have done. In fact I'm surprised it hasn't. I don't suppose anyone more familiarity with the code base of these rendering engines are able to offer possible reasons why?
  - newscracker 8y ago
    > I'd love to see Gecko take off in the same way kHTML, webkit and blink have done. In fact I'm surprised it hasn't. I don't suppose anyone more familiarity with the code base of these rendering engines are able to offer possible reasons why? Not familiar with the code base of the engines, but one factor that distinguishes Gecko vs. the other engines is that Mozilla killed the ability to embed Gecko in other applications in 2011. Read about the detailed reasoning in this mailing list thread. [1] This effectively tied Gecko solely to Firefox, and has made using it with other applications or browser chrome (lowercase, not Chrome the browser) impossible (AFAIK). So it cannot take off like the other engines unless Mozilla puts in work to allow that to happen. [1]: https://groups.google.com/forum/m/#!topic/mozilla.dev.embedding/c_NMcO-N8wo/discussion https://groups.google.com/forum/m/#!topic/mozilla.dev.embedd...
- Izkata 8y ago
  And they already have (at least) one they could use as a starting point: Containers
  - skykooler 8y ago
    Which is an excellent feature. Another one is WebVR.
    - SamWhited 8y ago
      I love containers, and I'm sure webvr is great, but I can't see the majority of people caring at all about either one. Their existing niche of privacy aware people who don't like Chrome and are tech people who like to play with trendy new technology will be happy about both of those, but random people off the street probably won't.
      - Izkata 8y ago
        Then don't talk about it from a privacy angle; I use containers so I can be logged in to my home and work accounts at the same time.
        kiriakasis 8y ago
        For most uses they are a long-lived incognito session.

organsnyder 8y ago

During the IE-6 dark ages of the early 2000s, Mozilla's browser (the Mozilla suite, then standalone Firebird, finally renamed to Firefox) was positioned in a similar way: it was the niche browser for people who cared about an open web. It stayed that way for quite a few years, slowly gaining traction by implementing features—tabbed browsing, popup blocking—not found in the dominant IE browser. I could see a similar approach working again. Mozilla could focus on user-centric features, while Chrome has to also serve the needs of Google's business interests.

laumars 8y ago
> the Mozilla suite, then standalone Firebird, finally renamed to Firefox I believe it was originally called Phoenix. Though you're right it was then called Firebird and renamed again to Firefox afterwards. I think each time was due to trademark disputes? Going to your point though, I hope you're right but I'm a bit more sceptical. Chromium, being open source, means anyone who doesn't like the stagnation of Chrome would just fork Blink and create their own modern browser while still enforcing the Chrome mono-culture. I'd love to see Gecko take off in the same way kHTML, webkit and blink have done. In fact I'm surprised it hasn't. I don't suppose anyone more familiarity with the code base of these rendering engines are able to offer possible reasons why?
- newscracker 8y ago
  > I'd love to see Gecko take off in the same way kHTML, webkit and blink have done. In fact I'm surprised it hasn't. I don't suppose anyone more familiarity with the code base of these rendering engines are able to offer possible reasons why? Not familiar with the code base of the engines, but one factor that distinguishes Gecko vs. the other engines is that Mozilla killed the ability to embed Gecko in other applications in 2011. Read about the detailed reasoning in this mailing list thread. [1] This effectively tied Gecko solely to Firefox, and has made using it with other applications or browser chrome (lowercase, not Chrome the browser) impossible (AFAIK). So it cannot take off like the other engines unless Mozilla puts in work to allow that to happen. [1]: https://groups.google.com/forum/m/#!topic/mozilla.dev.embedding/c_NMcO-N8wo/discussion https://groups.google.com/forum/m/#!topic/mozilla.dev.embedd...
Izkata 8y ago
And they already have (at least) one they could use as a starting point: Containers
- skykooler 8y ago
  Which is an excellent feature. Another one is WebVR.
  - SamWhited 8y ago
    I love containers, and I'm sure webvr is great, but I can't see the majority of people caring at all about either one. Their existing niche of privacy aware people who don't like Chrome and are tech people who like to play with trendy new technology will be happy about both of those, but random people off the street probably won't.
    - Izkata 8y ago
      Then don't talk about it from a privacy angle; I use containers so I can be logged in to my home and work accounts at the same time.
      - kiriakasis 8y ago
        For most uses they are a long-lived incognito session.