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> So just stop giving them the public street for free! Yes, did I argue otherwise? > What's disturbing to many here is making us buy parking we don't need so

by varjag 8y ago

> So just stop giving them the public street for free! Yes, did I argue otherwise? > What's disturbing to many here is making us buy parking we don't need so that _you_ can continue to get parking welfare for free from the state (aka taxpayers). What are you on about? What "parking welfare" is requiring garages/spots on private property? Are you trying to dispute that people do own cars in real life? For every X apartments there are Y vehicles, and build codes attempt to balance real life needs by requiring developers ensure certain amount of parking available. Not building the parking garage under the building won't make people car free, they'll just park it on public property.

PeterisP 8y ago
If currently there are Y vehicles for every X apartments, and you want (and expect) there to be Y/2 vehicles for every X apartments, then having developers build Y parking spaces is both wasteful (since in the long run that building won't need Y parking spaces) and counterproductive. You want to build an amount of parking spaces that's in line with your goals, not what's needed to enable things you're trying to change.
CalRobert 8y ago
Yes, you did inasmuch as you said people should be required to build parking. Person A lives in a nice old house in a quaint neighborhood built before cars. They park their car on the street. Time goes by. More people buy cars, and more people move in. The street parking becomes full. Person A is outraged that their ability to park on the street is gone. They demand all new homes have off-street parking. Newcomer to the neighborhood, say some weird hippie cyclist who doesn't own a car (like me), has to pay more for their home because the land that could have held 8 homes now holds 5. Their property taxes help pay for person A's parking. Of course, it doesn't work that well. Off-street parking _still_ takes up street space for access. If people want parking they will demand it and pay more for it. Some people want helipads but we don't force everyone to have a private helipad in case they run out of space on the street for your helicopter. Why do people demand parking minimums? Because the street parking is full.
- TomMarius 8y ago
  Thank you for putting my thoughts into words much better that I could. I'd just like to add that the "personal car" era might be coming to its end and we should work with that as well - underground garages are hard to convert to anything useful. > has to pay more for their home because the land that could have held 8 homes now holds 5. Yes, and the parking space itself costs a non-trivial amount of money (40-50k USD - if it has to be underground), especially for people in Eastern European metropolises.

by varjag 8y ago

PeterisP 8y ago

If currently there are Y vehicles for every X apartments, and you want (and expect) there to be Y/2 vehicles for every X apartments, then having developers build Y parking spaces is both wasteful (since in the long run that building won't need Y parking spaces) and counterproductive. You want to build an amount of parking spaces that's in line with your goals, not what's needed to enable things you're trying to change.

CalRobert 8y ago

Yes, you did inasmuch as you said people should be required to build parking. Person A lives in a nice old house in a quaint neighborhood built before cars. They park their car on the street. Time goes by. More people buy cars, and more people move in. The street parking becomes full. Person A is outraged that their ability to park on the street is gone. They demand all new homes have off-street parking. Newcomer to the neighborhood, say some weird hippie cyclist who doesn't own a car (like me), has to pay more for their home because the land that could have held 8 homes now holds 5. Their property taxes help pay for person A's parking. Of course, it doesn't work that well. Off-street parking _still_ takes up street space for access. If people want parking they will demand it and pay more for it. Some people want helipads but we don't force everyone to have a private helipad in case they run out of space on the street for your helicopter. Why do people demand parking minimums? Because the street parking is full.

TomMarius 8y ago
Thank you for putting my thoughts into words much better that I could. I'd just like to add that the "personal car" era might be coming to its end and we should work with that as well - underground garages are hard to convert to anything useful. > has to pay more for their home because the land that could have held 8 homes now holds 5. Yes, and the parking space itself costs a non-trivial amount of money (40-50k USD - if it has to be underground), especially for people in Eastern European metropolises.