11 ms·

Simply because electric buses are the superior technology right now. Metro bus services is actually an ideal application for electric vehicles: The needed rang

by D_Alex 8y ago

Simply because electric buses are the superior technology right now. Metro bus services is actually an ideal application for electric vehicles: The needed range is short, charging facilities can be in one place (depot), stop-start driving suits the propulsion system, and low noise and no emissions are a bonus in the highly populated areas.

Xylakant 8y ago
Trolleybusses are electric, they just get their electricity from overhead wires, similar to a railway. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trolleybus https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trolleybus
- ollie87 8y ago
  They are but they need more infrastructure than battery vehicles.
  - Reason077 8y ago
    Exactly. The high cost, inflexibility, and maintenance requirements of overhead wires all make them unattractive for new installations. Battery electric buses, on the other hand, can operate anywhere that diesel buses can, and a fault with one bus or one section of wire will not break the whole route. Many cities also consider overhead wires to be visually unattractive. Birmingham's new tram network is being built to use overhead wires on suburban tracks, but switch to battery power in the city centre to avoid having to install overhead wires there.
    - v_lisivka 8y ago
      Hybrid electric+battery transport and sharing of wires with trucks makes them sexy again. See https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SJO4g_D4jow https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SJO4g_D4jow
  - agsdfgsd 8y ago
    Are a few overhead wires actually more expensive than the massive batteries electric buses require? They are certainly less damaging to the environment.
    - dsfyu404ed 8y ago
      Batteries are a commodity. Production can get outsourced to whoever can deliver the best value. Up front costs are smaller and you never have to worry about infrastructure upgrades because there's no special infrastructure. You can just replace your diesel buses with electric as they come due. You automatically get upgrades buses every few years because buses don't last 40+ like trains do and you aren't ever forced to upgrade your overhead electric infrastructure The wires are planned and owned by an (intentionally) inefficient government bureaucracy and installed and maintained by expensive local labor and you can't just change routes on a whim, you may be forced to do a full system upgrade in the future, etc, etc. In somewhere like China where the government can just tell people where the trams are going to be and that's that the wires are probably the better solution in more cases. In the west where have to work with the public to get their approval for infrastructure it's generally a better all around solution to buy electric buses to replace your diesel ones even if it is less environmentally efficient on paper. Edit: Some of you are appear to be taking my factual statement about the efficiency of government poorly. The inefficiency of government is a feature, not a bug. Government that can do good things (like install wires for trams) quickly and fairly unilaterally can also do bad things (like waste money installing wires for trams where nobody wants them) fairly unilaterally. You can't have it both ways and sometimes you just have to work around the system and if that means buying the buses with batteries then that's fine.
      - shaki-dora 8y ago
        Maybe phrase it better in the future, in a way that does not buy into the widespread, tiresome cynicism of “goveerment waste/incompetence/beaurocacry/corruption”. I.e. “Stringing wires in a dense urban environment requires co-ordination with many stakeholders and balancing of interests, such as the preservation of the visual appeal of historical landmarks, local shopkeepers’ interest in preserving parking spaces possibly occupied by the support structures, the disruption by construction crews...”
- ekianjo 8y ago
  Good luck rerouting them when you change their path thru the city.
  - iguy 8y ago
    Not so obvious this is a downside. Apartments with good transport links often earn higher rents, and the builder cares about rents decades into the future... and an immovable tram line is a stronger indication than just a bus stop.
Nasrudith 8y ago
Not to mention infastructutal redundancy - trolleys are a bit worst of both worlds in that they require roads, tracks, and overhead wires while often causing manuevering and congestion issues. They are kind of awkward road sharing wise. They are a way of dodging the battery expenses but unfortunately have their own set of issues. If you already have a great cable car infastructure by all means keep on doing it but they are rare and often more curiosities or secondary transit components.
- jbay808 8y ago
  Trolleybuses don't need tracks, they just need overhead cables. We use them in Vancouver. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trolley_buses_in_Vancouver https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trolley_buses_in_Vancouver
- omnimus 8y ago
  I am from city with trams and trolley buses as main public transport. Trams are often deployed on roads (rails are in roads) and when there is car accident trams just have to stop trolley bus can atleast partialy manuever around obstacles.
- Reason077 8y ago
  You are confusing your terminology here. Trolley busses, trams, and cable cars are all different things.
- dragonwriter 8y ago
  > Not to mention infastructutal redundancy - trolleys are a bit worst of both worlds in that they require roads, tracks, and overhead wires Streetcars (one kind of trolley) require tracks but not roads (though they often share space with roads for convenience purposes, hence the name, but this is not required, and is often for only for portions of their route.) Trolley coaches (aka, trolley busses) require roads, but not tracks.
woodandsteel 8y ago
>Simply because electric buses are the superior technology right now. Trolleybuses were invented because at the time electric storage technology wasn't good enough.

by D_Alex 8y ago

Xylakant 8y ago

Trolleybusses are electric, they just get their electricity from overhead wires, similar to a railway. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trolleybus https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trolleybus

ollie87 8y ago
They are but they need more infrastructure than battery vehicles.
- Reason077 8y ago
  Exactly. The high cost, inflexibility, and maintenance requirements of overhead wires all make them unattractive for new installations. Battery electric buses, on the other hand, can operate anywhere that diesel buses can, and a fault with one bus or one section of wire will not break the whole route. Many cities also consider overhead wires to be visually unattractive. Birmingham's new tram network is being built to use overhead wires on suburban tracks, but switch to battery power in the city centre to avoid having to install overhead wires there.
  - v_lisivka 8y ago
    Hybrid electric+battery transport and sharing of wires with trucks makes them sexy again. See https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SJO4g_D4jow https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SJO4g_D4jow
- agsdfgsd 8y ago
  Are a few overhead wires actually more expensive than the massive batteries electric buses require? They are certainly less damaging to the environment.
  - dsfyu404ed 8y ago
    Batteries are a commodity. Production can get outsourced to whoever can deliver the best value. Up front costs are smaller and you never have to worry about infrastructure upgrades because there's no special infrastructure. You can just replace your diesel buses with electric as they come due. You automatically get upgrades buses every few years because buses don't last 40+ like trains do and you aren't ever forced to upgrade your overhead electric infrastructure The wires are planned and owned by an (intentionally) inefficient government bureaucracy and installed and maintained by expensive local labor and you can't just change routes on a whim, you may be forced to do a full system upgrade in the future, etc, etc. In somewhere like China where the government can just tell people where the trams are going to be and that's that the wires are probably the better solution in more cases. In the west where have to work with the public to get their approval for infrastructure it's generally a better all around solution to buy electric buses to replace your diesel ones even if it is less environmentally efficient on paper. Edit: Some of you are appear to be taking my factual statement about the efficiency of government poorly. The inefficiency of government is a feature, not a bug. Government that can do good things (like install wires for trams) quickly and fairly unilaterally can also do bad things (like waste money installing wires for trams where nobody wants them) fairly unilaterally. You can't have it both ways and sometimes you just have to work around the system and if that means buying the buses with batteries then that's fine.
    - shaki-dora 8y ago
      Maybe phrase it better in the future, in a way that does not buy into the widespread, tiresome cynicism of “goveerment waste/incompetence/beaurocacry/corruption”. I.e. “Stringing wires in a dense urban environment requires co-ordination with many stakeholders and balancing of interests, such as the preservation of the visual appeal of historical landmarks, local shopkeepers’ interest in preserving parking spaces possibly occupied by the support structures, the disruption by construction crews...”
ekianjo 8y ago
Good luck rerouting them when you change their path thru the city.
- iguy 8y ago
  Not so obvious this is a downside. Apartments with good transport links often earn higher rents, and the builder cares about rents decades into the future... and an immovable tram line is a stronger indication than just a bus stop.

Nasrudith 8y ago

Not to mention infastructutal redundancy - trolleys are a bit worst of both worlds in that they require roads, tracks, and overhead wires while often causing manuevering and congestion issues. They are kind of awkward road sharing wise. They are a way of dodging the battery expenses but unfortunately have their own set of issues. If you already have a great cable car infastructure by all means keep on doing it but they are rare and often more curiosities or secondary transit components.

jbay808 8y ago
Trolleybuses don't need tracks, they just need overhead cables. We use them in Vancouver. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trolley_buses_in_Vancouver https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trolley_buses_in_Vancouver
omnimus 8y ago
I am from city with trams and trolley buses as main public transport. Trams are often deployed on roads (rails are in roads) and when there is car accident trams just have to stop trolley bus can atleast partialy manuever around obstacles.
Reason077 8y ago
You are confusing your terminology here. Trolley busses, trams, and cable cars are all different things.
dragonwriter 8y ago
> Not to mention infastructutal redundancy - trolleys are a bit worst of both worlds in that they require roads, tracks, and overhead wires Streetcars (one kind of trolley) require tracks but not roads (though they often share space with roads for convenience purposes, hence the name, but this is not required, and is often for only for portions of their route.) Trolley coaches (aka, trolley busses) require roads, but not tracks.

woodandsteel 8y ago

>Simply because electric buses are the superior technology right now. Trolleybuses were invented because at the time electric storage technology wasn't good enough.