4 ms·

Now, were these two Chinese companies state-run companies, or is that just a given based on the advanced technology involved?

outworlder 8y ago
> Now, were these two Chinese companies state-run companies Does the concept even apply?
MrTonyD 8y ago
I'm not even sure if its possible to tell ownership these days. Here in Silicon Valley I saw some contracts I wasn't supposed to see - all with labels saying "disclosure not required" and "not legally required to provide copies". Basically, ownership can be held by a company, and that can be a legal casino, so it can place bets which transfer ownership to anyone in the future (eg. if support costs over 10% then 50% is owned by China). These documents were used to arrange Russian ownership of several NSA "front" companies - all without any public disclosures since they were potential futures, not current reality. That is the world we live in. (And I don't claim to really understand those contracts. I just know somebody who knows somebody who was working on the contracts for foreign entities to secretly hold ownership of a bunch of Silicon Valley companies. I took a look, saw the list of famous companies involved, and happen to know a couple of NSA front companies which were also on the list.) And in a court of law I will claim that I made all this up.
sjroot 8y ago
Are there any Chinese companies that don’t operate under the influence (if not direct ownership) of their government?
- izacus 8y ago
  Are there any companies that don't operate under influence of their governments?
  - javajosh 8y ago
    Yes. In the US federal, state and local governments do not influence the decisions of business leaders. Occasionally there are exceptions at largest companies, like telecom and internet, but it is certainly true for small business. Note that I would make a distinction between "regulation" and "influence" in the following sense: 'don't dump waste into this lake' is a regulation. Hey Bob, why don't you dump your waste into Joe's backyard - I hate Joe and want to make his life miserable. That's influence. So are hiring/firing decisions, strategic partnerships, and such. The Communist Party in China is an authoritarian regime that accepts no legitimate limit on it's influence.

outworlder 8y ago

> Now, were these two Chinese companies state-run companies Does the concept even apply?

MrTonyD 8y ago

I'm not even sure if its possible to tell ownership these days. Here in Silicon Valley I saw some contracts I wasn't supposed to see - all with labels saying "disclosure not required" and "not legally required to provide copies". Basically, ownership can be held by a company, and that can be a legal casino, so it can place bets which transfer ownership to anyone in the future (eg. if support costs over 10% then 50% is owned by China). These documents were used to arrange Russian ownership of several NSA "front" companies - all without any public disclosures since they were potential futures, not current reality. That is the world we live in. (And I don't claim to really understand those contracts. I just know somebody who knows somebody who was working on the contracts for foreign entities to secretly hold ownership of a bunch of Silicon Valley companies. I took a look, saw the list of famous companies involved, and happen to know a couple of NSA front companies which were also on the list.) And in a court of law I will claim that I made all this up.

sjroot 8y ago

Are there any Chinese companies that don’t operate under the influence (if not direct ownership) of their government?

izacus 8y ago
Are there any companies that don't operate under influence of their governments?
- javajosh 8y ago
  Yes. In the US federal, state and local governments do not influence the decisions of business leaders. Occasionally there are exceptions at largest companies, like telecom and internet, but it is certainly true for small business. Note that I would make a distinction between "regulation" and "influence" in the following sense: 'don't dump waste into this lake' is a regulation. Hey Bob, why don't you dump your waste into Joe's backyard - I hate Joe and want to make his life miserable. That's influence. So are hiring/firing decisions, strategic partnerships, and such. The Communist Party in China is an authoritarian regime that accepts no legitimate limit on it's influence.