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He can’t build it profitably, or at least without going through the environmental impact review that every other project of this scale must pass. Do you really

by danso 8y ago

He can’t build it profitably, or at least without going through the environmental impact review that every other project of this scale must pass. Do you really think the hole digging is the bottleneck for every other underground project?

quotemstr 8y ago
How much infrastructure is getting built under the current review process? The current process is just a fig leaf for everyone getting a NIMBY veto. California ought to be ashamed of its technological paralysis.
- danso 8y ago
  It's not a technological problem. If people get unhappy when Facebook "moves fast and breaks things" in its mission to "connect the world", then people should be just as cautious when it comes to construction projects that impact miles of public infrastructure and thousands of private homes.
  - mips_avatar 8y ago
    Sure I mean bad (insert bad thing) things are bad. And a risk to private homes should stop a project. But I can’t find any proof that there’s a risk here. Tunneling is really safe.
    - danso 8y ago
      Then why is Boring declining to take part in the EIR process?
      - mips_avatar 8y ago
        You’d probably have to ask Elon Musk. I also haven’t read the lawsuit so I don’t know what specifically the homeowners wanted investigated. California law basically gives veto power to any homeowner for anything, so why bother trying to be innovative there in the first place? I think the software industry only evolved there because nobody had figured out how to regulate a bit yet.
        danso 8y ago
        California software companies are still subject to the same taxes and standard of state employment laws. California's high speed rail has been subject to the same scrutiny and legal threats. Was Boring/Musk completely ignorant of well-known past precedent and hurdles when they claimed they could build a transportation project for much cheaper? As recently as 1 month ago, Musk still thought and publicly claimed that the tunnel "opens Dec 10": https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1054164838430064640 https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1054164838430064640
        mips_avatar 8y ago
        I think Elon Musk knows that if there's something big to be gained for society the laws can be modified. For instance Tesla only worked because the Obama administration kind of bent the laws of economics by securing a huge loan to the company.
        dragonwriter 8y ago
        > California law basically gives veto power to any homeowner for anything No, it doesn't.
    - dragonwriter 8y ago
      > But I can’t find any proof that there’s a risk here. Of course not, Boring pulled out rather than go through the process that would evaluate any risks. > Tunneling is really safe. Then there was no reason to avoid environmental review.
- mips_avatar 8y ago
  In theory there’s going to be a high speed train built between SF and LA. Not convinced it can happen, or should happen at the price these property owners have made the project incur.
- messick 8y ago
  9 miles of infrastructure is getting built right this second under the current review process. https://www.metro.net/projects/westside/ https://www.metro.net/projects/westside/
- dragonwriter 8y ago
  > How much infrastructure is getting built under the current review process? The environmental review process doesn't stop a lot of infrastructure getting built, people prioritizing public spending on other priorities does. > The current process is just a fig leaf for everyone getting a NIMBY veto. No, it's not. > California ought to be ashamed of its technological paralysis. Perhaps, but CEQA isn't the source of the problem, to the extent there is one.

by danso 8y ago

quotemstr 8y ago

How much infrastructure is getting built under the current review process? The current process is just a fig leaf for everyone getting a NIMBY veto. California ought to be ashamed of its technological paralysis.

danso 8y ago
It's not a technological problem. If people get unhappy when Facebook "moves fast and breaks things" in its mission to "connect the world", then people should be just as cautious when it comes to construction projects that impact miles of public infrastructure and thousands of private homes.
- mips_avatar 8y ago
  Sure I mean bad (insert bad thing) things are bad. And a risk to private homes should stop a project. But I can’t find any proof that there’s a risk here. Tunneling is really safe.
  - danso 8y ago
    Then why is Boring declining to take part in the EIR process?
    - mips_avatar 8y ago
      You’d probably have to ask Elon Musk. I also haven’t read the lawsuit so I don’t know what specifically the homeowners wanted investigated. California law basically gives veto power to any homeowner for anything, so why bother trying to be innovative there in the first place? I think the software industry only evolved there because nobody had figured out how to regulate a bit yet.
      - danso 8y ago
        California software companies are still subject to the same taxes and standard of state employment laws. California's high speed rail has been subject to the same scrutiny and legal threats. Was Boring/Musk completely ignorant of well-known past precedent and hurdles when they claimed they could build a transportation project for much cheaper? As recently as 1 month ago, Musk still thought and publicly claimed that the tunnel "opens Dec 10": https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1054164838430064640 https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1054164838430064640
        mips_avatar 8y ago
        I think Elon Musk knows that if there's something big to be gained for society the laws can be modified. For instance Tesla only worked because the Obama administration kind of bent the laws of economics by securing a huge loan to the company.
      - dragonwriter 8y ago
        > California law basically gives veto power to any homeowner for anything No, it doesn't.
  - dragonwriter 8y ago
    > But I can’t find any proof that there’s a risk here. Of course not, Boring pulled out rather than go through the process that would evaluate any risks. > Tunneling is really safe. Then there was no reason to avoid environmental review.
mips_avatar 8y ago
In theory there’s going to be a high speed train built between SF and LA. Not convinced it can happen, or should happen at the price these property owners have made the project incur.
messick 8y ago
9 miles of infrastructure is getting built right this second under the current review process. https://www.metro.net/projects/westside/ https://www.metro.net/projects/westside/
dragonwriter 8y ago
> How much infrastructure is getting built under the current review process? The environmental review process doesn't stop a lot of infrastructure getting built, people prioritizing public spending on other priorities does. > The current process is just a fig leaf for everyone getting a NIMBY veto. No, it's not. > California ought to be ashamed of its technological paralysis. Perhaps, but CEQA isn't the source of the problem, to the extent there is one.