5 ms·

Yes, that is exactly what I mean. The majority of people developing software are doing it inside of Visual Studio Code or similar tools, where their only expos

by koblas 8y ago

Yes, that is exactly what I mean. The majority of people developing software are doing it inside of Visual Studio Code or similar tools, where their only exposure to the command line is when they do "create-app"

deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
Meph504 8y ago
You keep using the unqualified term "majority" with no way to actually back that up. This would probably be less critized if you stated it as your opinion (which it is) and not as a definitive statement.
- dictum 8y ago
  Even a qualified appeal to the majority isn't a very good argument. There are many scenarios where the majority of events is caused by a minority of individuals. For instance, 20% of developers could be responsible for 80% of all software, or 80% of the most used software, or the software that generates 80% of GDP, etc.
asveikau 8y ago
I think there could be a generational difference or "how you learned" angle at play here. For me learning the command line and early computer use went hand in hand. And I simply could not possibly imagine using git or other source control through an IDE and not a CLI. (I know they offer it, but it just doesn't seem natural.)
- perl4ever 8y ago
  There may also be a factor in whether you learned to program as a child or at a university where Unix culture was dominant. I learned to program (in the sense of writing programs in a compiled language) around the time the Macintosh and Amiga came out, before free Unix-like OSes on your PC were much of a thing. So while the Amiga did have a command line, and so did Macintosh Programmer's Workshop, I mostly saw a command line as the obsolete interface associated with MS-DOS. Obviously source code control was not a thing for a kid programming in the 80s. Even though I have more recently used git than any other source control, I don't think the horrible interface has anything to do with its utility. You may like it, you may hate it, but it doesn't have to be like it is, it's just the personality it has. Kind of like Linus and his grouchiness.
  - loeg 8y ago
    Anecdotal, but I learned to program as a kid prior to college using free Ubuntu CDs[0], and became familiar with the command line sort of by necessity. [0]: Ubuntu used to mail you an install CD, for free, anywhere in the world. In the early 2000s. It was pretty cool.
    - perl4ever 8y ago
      I've been using Linux for roughly 20 years, and I prefer the command line. But that's only because it's Linux. There's no inherent need to do a lot of things with a command line except in a context where it's the simplest, most stable, predictable, and documented way purely because of historical and cultural reasons. Because of the long running Linux/Windows rivalry, hardly anybody can imagine something better than a Unix-clone any more. But the very name Unix was chosen because the original OS was not intended to be the be-all/end-all of OSes.
  - mixmastamyk 8y ago
    In the early 80's I started on a Commodore with a BASIC interpreter "command line," spent a few years later learning DOS, and did not encounter UNIX until about '93 when a teacher mentioned Minix as a way to learn it. At work I installed Slackware from floppies, and was exposed to Sun/SGI/and VAX, good times. Took to each like a duck to water. Liked GUIs and GUI programming as well. Never understood the folks that wanted to only use one or the other, not both, when they are complimentary. Avoiding either is doing yourself a disservice.
    - ddingus 8y ago
      This! My start was on an Apple, but the rest tracks well enough. did Slack, then RH 5.2. SGI handled the command line / gui matter particularly well. Most things had a GUI, and the GUI would issue the "--gui" or "-verbose" option to get the additional feedback needed for the GUI to behave more like one would expect, despite it basically being a wrapper for an otherwise CLI program. The time I spent on IRIX really solidified when and where the two paradigms make sense. And they both do. There is no one size fits all winner here.
Zarel 8y ago
For the record, I use VS Code, but the fastest way to _open_ VS Code is cd project-name code . It also lets me type Git commands directly into the terminal, which is way faster than doing it through VS Code. And there are still plenty of things, like rebasing, which VS Code doesn't have GUI support for.
- rjplatte 8y ago
  This is what I do. I use the command line fairly often.
Shish2k 8y ago
> The majority of people developing software are doing it inside of Visual Studio Code or similar tools I'm assuming this is an anecdote rather than data? Looking around my office, 19 out of 20 people are using the "xterm and chrome are the only two apps I run on my laptop" style of development; only one has a graphical IDE + chrome

by koblas 8y ago

deleted 8y ago

[deleted]

Meph504 8y ago

You keep using the unqualified term "majority" with no way to actually back that up. This would probably be less critized if you stated it as your opinion (which it is) and not as a definitive statement.

dictum 8y ago
Even a qualified appeal to the majority isn't a very good argument. There are many scenarios where the majority of events is caused by a minority of individuals. For instance, 20% of developers could be responsible for 80% of all software, or 80% of the most used software, or the software that generates 80% of GDP, etc.

asveikau 8y ago

I think there could be a generational difference or "how you learned" angle at play here. For me learning the command line and early computer use went hand in hand. And I simply could not possibly imagine using git or other source control through an IDE and not a CLI. (I know they offer it, but it just doesn't seem natural.)

perl4ever 8y ago
There may also be a factor in whether you learned to program as a child or at a university where Unix culture was dominant. I learned to program (in the sense of writing programs in a compiled language) around the time the Macintosh and Amiga came out, before free Unix-like OSes on your PC were much of a thing. So while the Amiga did have a command line, and so did Macintosh Programmer's Workshop, I mostly saw a command line as the obsolete interface associated with MS-DOS. Obviously source code control was not a thing for a kid programming in the 80s. Even though I have more recently used git than any other source control, I don't think the horrible interface has anything to do with its utility. You may like it, you may hate it, but it doesn't have to be like it is, it's just the personality it has. Kind of like Linus and his grouchiness.
- loeg 8y ago
  Anecdotal, but I learned to program as a kid prior to college using free Ubuntu CDs[0], and became familiar with the command line sort of by necessity. [0]: Ubuntu used to mail you an install CD, for free, anywhere in the world. In the early 2000s. It was pretty cool.
  - perl4ever 8y ago
    I've been using Linux for roughly 20 years, and I prefer the command line. But that's only because it's Linux. There's no inherent need to do a lot of things with a command line except in a context where it's the simplest, most stable, predictable, and documented way purely because of historical and cultural reasons. Because of the long running Linux/Windows rivalry, hardly anybody can imagine something better than a Unix-clone any more. But the very name Unix was chosen because the original OS was not intended to be the be-all/end-all of OSes.
- mixmastamyk 8y ago
  In the early 80's I started on a Commodore with a BASIC interpreter "command line," spent a few years later learning DOS, and did not encounter UNIX until about '93 when a teacher mentioned Minix as a way to learn it. At work I installed Slackware from floppies, and was exposed to Sun/SGI/and VAX, good times. Took to each like a duck to water. Liked GUIs and GUI programming as well. Never understood the folks that wanted to only use one or the other, not both, when they are complimentary. Avoiding either is doing yourself a disservice.
  - ddingus 8y ago
    This! My start was on an Apple, but the rest tracks well enough. did Slack, then RH 5.2. SGI handled the command line / gui matter particularly well. Most things had a GUI, and the GUI would issue the "--gui" or "-verbose" option to get the additional feedback needed for the GUI to behave more like one would expect, despite it basically being a wrapper for an otherwise CLI program. The time I spent on IRIX really solidified when and where the two paradigms make sense. And they both do. There is no one size fits all winner here.

Zarel 8y ago

For the record, I use VS Code, but the fastest way to _open_ VS Code is cd project-name code . It also lets me type Git commands directly into the terminal, which is way faster than doing it through VS Code. And there are still plenty of things, like rebasing, which VS Code doesn't have GUI support for.

rjplatte 8y ago
This is what I do. I use the command line fairly often.

Shish2k 8y ago

> The majority of people developing software are doing it inside of Visual Studio Code or similar tools I'm assuming this is an anecdote rather than data? Looking around my office, 19 out of 20 people are using the "xterm and chrome are the only two apps I run on my laptop" style of development; only one has a graphical IDE + chrome