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That's assuming you don't do any server side rendering right? I can send completely readable html over the wire that becomes interactive once the JS finishes l

That's assuming you don't do any server side rendering right? I can send completely readable html over the wire that becomes interactive once the JS finishes loading. What am I missing.

dancek 8y ago
The days of work needed to set up server-side rendering? I realize I must look stupid saying this, because when you know your tech stack inside out the setup might be 15 minutes instead of days. But a large proportion of developers only learn to do things when they have to, and so you learn server side rendering the first time you have a customer willing to pay for the time it takes you to learn.
- EpicEng 8y ago
  And conversely they would also have to learn these JS frameworks, right? Something like Angular is far harder to master (and debug) then server side rendering.
  - dancek 8y ago
    Of course, but time is limited and there's a huge number of things to learn. So my point about a customer paying the cost of learning SSR may be moot, but someone has to pay it. I also assume the ease of implementing SSR is highly dependent on the backend tech stack. My guess is that only Node.js makes it relatively easy.
- tboyd47 8y ago
  "SSR" is the default behavior of most pre-2016 web frameworks. Only when ReactJS became hip did it appear on lists of nice-to-haves that people weigh the pros and cons of.
  - dancek 8y ago
    Yes, I'm talking in the context of SPA frameworks (which the article referred to).
abhisuri97 8y ago
Well yeah it assumes you don't have SSR. But that isn't a useful metric for this "study" since SSR just gives the bare html. This person is just measuring time to interactivity/fully loaded JS and costs from the JS perspective.
robin_reala 8y ago
Nothing, apart from you’re thinking of users instead of current dev fashions.
haburka 8y ago
Additionally the author of this article used time to download the bundle as a metric rather than time to first interactive, or the speed index metric which are actually indicative of UX. I think that if you’re not very serious about front end then ignoring ssr is fine, but if UX or increasing conversions is a concern of yours then it’s vital.

That's assuming you don't do any server side rendering right? I can send completely readable html over the wire that becomes interactive once the JS finishes loading. What am I missing.

dancek 8y ago

The days of work needed to set up server-side rendering? I realize I must look stupid saying this, because when you know your tech stack inside out the setup might be 15 minutes instead of days. But a large proportion of developers only learn to do things when they have to, and so you learn server side rendering the first time you have a customer willing to pay for the time it takes you to learn.

EpicEng 8y ago
And conversely they would also have to learn these JS frameworks, right? Something like Angular is far harder to master (and debug) then server side rendering.
- dancek 8y ago
  Of course, but time is limited and there's a huge number of things to learn. So my point about a customer paying the cost of learning SSR may be moot, but someone has to pay it. I also assume the ease of implementing SSR is highly dependent on the backend tech stack. My guess is that only Node.js makes it relatively easy.
tboyd47 8y ago
"SSR" is the default behavior of most pre-2016 web frameworks. Only when ReactJS became hip did it appear on lists of nice-to-haves that people weigh the pros and cons of.
- dancek 8y ago
  Yes, I'm talking in the context of SPA frameworks (which the article referred to).

abhisuri97 8y ago

Well yeah it assumes you don't have SSR. But that isn't a useful metric for this "study" since SSR just gives the bare html. This person is just measuring time to interactivity/fully loaded JS and costs from the JS perspective.

robin_reala 8y ago

Nothing, apart from you’re thinking of users instead of current dev fashions.

haburka 8y ago

Additionally the author of this article used time to download the bundle as a metric rather than time to first interactive, or the speed index metric which are actually indicative of UX. I think that if you’re not very serious about front end then ignoring ssr is fine, but if UX or increasing conversions is a concern of yours then it’s vital.