3 ms·

Very much disagree. If you pay attention at all to security you'll always hear stories of that one client who hasn't done security updates in 3 months (or 3 day

Very much disagree. If you pay attention at all to security you'll always hear stories of that one client who hasn't done security updates in 3 months (or 3 days) and gets taken out by the inevitable "exploit Wednesday" shenanigans. On top of that if you're in an enterprise environment when you update you've already had months of home users beta testing the stuff (if you've chosen the semi-annual channel), haven't you? From my experience as someone who has had 0 problems since beta (that weren't caused by me doing something stupid like uninstalling Windows Store) people mess with windows, usually by running a script or 2 because "omg Microsoft is spying on me!111!" then the update comes and throws them an error or 2. Choose any other OS. Any OS at all that is sufficiently complicated as to compete with Windows (maybe as a starting point anything a tiny bit more complicated than ChromeOS). Then name a problem that's happened with Windows 10. I'll show something similar if not worse happening on the other OS you've chosen. The problem, IMO, isn't the OS. It's the freedom the OS allows and the billions of different configurations you'll find out there. Of course any 1 update isn't going to account for all of that. Hell Apple can't even do it on iphones/imacs and they have a very tiny number of SKUs to deal with.

BurnGpuBurn 8y ago
> someone who has had 0 problems since beta Well, you really must be the only one then. Or perhaps the rebooting every other week for updates, sending around privacy sensitive telemetry information to the entire world and having Cortana use the most CPU cycles of all the apps installed is not a problem for you. Some people just accept whatever buggy stuff is thrown over the fence, and that's fine, but don't say there's nothing wrong with it.
- ragequitta 8y ago
  I use O&O shutup 10 to shut down cortana, telemetry, and other minor annoyances (mostly because I like video games). Maybe that's why it's been so smooth? And rebooting every other week? You mean on a very regular and predictable monthly schedule that was around for years prior to Windows 10's release? Not really a problem in my eyes. On my personal computer I shut it down nightly because it takes roughly 5 seconds to boot a computer these days. I can't even remember the last time I was aware an update happened. The one problem I DID have that I was about to hate on Microsoft for was a flashing taskbar. Turns out it was entirely my fault for using a 3rd party junk program.
AnIdiotOnTheNet 8y ago
> Very much disagree. If you pay attention at all to security you'll always hear stories of that one client who hasn't done security updates in 3 months (or 3 days) and gets taken out by the inevitable "exploit Wednesday" shenanigans. And if you read past the headline you find out that they had numerous other problems with their security practices that were actually responsible for them being compromised, because if "keep it up to date" is the extent of your security policy then you don't have a security policy. There are always exploitable issues in an OS, sometimes updates even introduce them (remember heartbleed? or that time Debian broke key gen?). > From my experience as someone who has had 0 problems since beta From your experience as someone with no experience dealing with issues caused by Windows Update, got it. > Choose any other OS. Any OS at all that is sufficiently complicated as to compete with Windows (maybe as a starting point anything a tiny bit more complicated than ChromeOS). Then name a problem that's happened with Windows 10. I'll show something similar if not worse happening on the other OS you've chosen. This doesn't mean that Windows 10 isn't bad, it just means that everything is bad. > The problem, IMO, isn't the OS. It's the freedom the OS allows and the billions of different configurations you'll find out there. The problem is the OS. If you have designed your OS in such a way as to make updating it a pain in the ass that's prone to breaking things, and turning updates off also a pain in the ass, then the problem is the OS.
- ragequitta 8y ago
  I agree with the sentiment that "everything is bad". Computers are still in their birthing stage and full of problems. But Windows 10 feels like an improvement over any previous version of Windows at least. Which is really all we can ask for. A little too transitional/work in progress for some, I can see that (2 control panels? madness!), but otherwise pretty smooth. But maybe it's also because I left computer support type roles and I haven't seen the nightmares like I did with XP/2000/Vista/7. But as an end user/casual security and IT watcher I can't complain too much (yet). And as an anecdote the only problem I've had updating was the one large change to the audio stack they did (and needed to do-it's so much better). The huge issue that arose was I needed to unmute my headphones. Other than that I seriously have not noticed any update other than maybe seeing the % when I boot up in the morning. I keep track of when the big ones come so I can run O&O after those, but I really haven't even skipped a beat due to an update.
Spooky23 8y ago
I respect your position here and don't intend to be on the attack. Usually that one client also lacks other compensating controls, particularly around privilege managemetn and internet access, and the lack of patching is a convenient excuse. If "exploit Wednesday" is an issue for you, something is wrong. In any non-trivial enterprise, Windows 10 has an operational model that's being rebuilt in flight. You need to exert a level of testing every six months that previous Windows versions required every 2 years, and you have to deal with the rubix cube of servicing editions of when a random feature that you care about is twiddled or taken away in Office or Windows. Alot of the hard work and creative engineering that gives a near-legendary and seldom mentioned track record of backward compatibility in Windows is being squashed by poor release management. End of the day, we have computers to use as tools to do things, business comes first. The philosophy within Microsoft has changed in recent years, and now there seems to be an attitude that running Windows v.now is the primary mission of every Windows PC. That's truly an unfortunate thing in my eyes that makes me sad -- Windows is an amazing platform that could be so much better.

BurnGpuBurn 8y ago

> someone who has had 0 problems since beta Well, you really must be the only one then. Or perhaps the rebooting every other week for updates, sending around privacy sensitive telemetry information to the entire world and having Cortana use the most CPU cycles of all the apps installed is not a problem for you. Some people just accept whatever buggy stuff is thrown over the fence, and that's fine, but don't say there's nothing wrong with it.

ragequitta 8y ago
I use O&O shutup 10 to shut down cortana, telemetry, and other minor annoyances (mostly because I like video games). Maybe that's why it's been so smooth? And rebooting every other week? You mean on a very regular and predictable monthly schedule that was around for years prior to Windows 10's release? Not really a problem in my eyes. On my personal computer I shut it down nightly because it takes roughly 5 seconds to boot a computer these days. I can't even remember the last time I was aware an update happened. The one problem I DID have that I was about to hate on Microsoft for was a flashing taskbar. Turns out it was entirely my fault for using a 3rd party junk program.

AnIdiotOnTheNet 8y ago

> Very much disagree. If you pay attention at all to security you'll always hear stories of that one client who hasn't done security updates in 3 months (or 3 days) and gets taken out by the inevitable "exploit Wednesday" shenanigans. And if you read past the headline you find out that they had numerous other problems with their security practices that were actually responsible for them being compromised, because if "keep it up to date" is the extent of your security policy then you don't have a security policy. There are always exploitable issues in an OS, sometimes updates even introduce them (remember heartbleed? or that time Debian broke key gen?). > From my experience as someone who has had 0 problems since beta From your experience as someone with no experience dealing with issues caused by Windows Update, got it. > Choose any other OS. Any OS at all that is sufficiently complicated as to compete with Windows (maybe as a starting point anything a tiny bit more complicated than ChromeOS). Then name a problem that's happened with Windows 10. I'll show something similar if not worse happening on the other OS you've chosen. This doesn't mean that Windows 10 isn't bad, it just means that everything is bad. > The problem, IMO, isn't the OS. It's the freedom the OS allows and the billions of different configurations you'll find out there. The problem is the OS. If you have designed your OS in such a way as to make updating it a pain in the ass that's prone to breaking things, and turning updates off also a pain in the ass, then the problem is the OS.

ragequitta 8y ago
I agree with the sentiment that "everything is bad". Computers are still in their birthing stage and full of problems. But Windows 10 feels like an improvement over any previous version of Windows at least. Which is really all we can ask for. A little too transitional/work in progress for some, I can see that (2 control panels? madness!), but otherwise pretty smooth. But maybe it's also because I left computer support type roles and I haven't seen the nightmares like I did with XP/2000/Vista/7. But as an end user/casual security and IT watcher I can't complain too much (yet). And as an anecdote the only problem I've had updating was the one large change to the audio stack they did (and needed to do-it's so much better). The huge issue that arose was I needed to unmute my headphones. Other than that I seriously have not noticed any update other than maybe seeing the % when I boot up in the morning. I keep track of when the big ones come so I can run O&O after those, but I really haven't even skipped a beat due to an update.

Spooky23 8y ago

I respect your position here and don't intend to be on the attack. Usually that one client also lacks other compensating controls, particularly around privilege managemetn and internet access, and the lack of patching is a convenient excuse. If "exploit Wednesday" is an issue for you, something is wrong. In any non-trivial enterprise, Windows 10 has an operational model that's being rebuilt in flight. You need to exert a level of testing every six months that previous Windows versions required every 2 years, and you have to deal with the rubix cube of servicing editions of when a random feature that you care about is twiddled or taken away in Office or Windows. Alot of the hard work and creative engineering that gives a near-legendary and seldom mentioned track record of backward compatibility in Windows is being squashed by poor release management. End of the day, we have computers to use as tools to do things, business comes first. The philosophy within Microsoft has changed in recent years, and now there seems to be an attitude that running Windows v.now is the primary mission of every Windows PC. That's truly an unfortunate thing in my eyes that makes me sad -- Windows is an amazing platform that could be so much better.