5 ms·

So if somebody comes up with the greatest script on earth, but doesn't work 17 hours a day as a slave for some TV producer, his script will never be made?

by Tichy 16y ago

sbarre 16y ago
Correct.
rick888 16y ago
similarly. if you create the best web app on earth, but don't spend any time marketing it and nobody sees it, chances are it will fail.
- Tichy 16y ago
  And marketing is making coffee for Michael Arrington?
  - apl 16y ago
    Wrong analogy. If you build a web app, you need paying customers. If you write a script, you need to get a producer to read it, like it and finance it. Different aims require different kinds of marketing - for writers it's networking on the producer-level.
    - chegra84 16y ago
      Which doesn't necessitates serving coffee.
frederickcook 16y ago
The amount of time and effort put into something is inversely proportional to how likely it is to fail. This isn't just because of the actual time and effort, but because as others observe this time and effort, they take the thing more seriously. For a startup, this is important because it not only means they're more likely to take it seriously, but that others are more likely to contribute their own time and effort.
jrockway 16y ago
It will probably be made. I am not sure how true this article is; I know people in college that majored in English or Journalism and got a TV writing job straight out of school. You probably aren't working on your own show at that point, but you aren't spending 18 hour days getting coffee for people either.
apl 16y ago
Correct, correct, correct. Television (and music and film, for that matter) are hardly a meritocracy. What ends up on screens and CDs isn't determined by quality, at least not primarily. There are fantastic scripts out there, masterpieces that will never get made. Crap gets turned into two-hundred million dollar blockbusters. [EDIT: This gets voted down why exactly?]
- mbateman 16y ago
  Because I don't believe that there are fantastic scripts out there not getting made. The crap we see is the best there is, sadly. (I have several friends in the movie industry.)
  - jamesbritt 16y ago
    I read this in the article, " You have to be an amazing writer, the best writer people have ever read… and you have to have a large Rolodex of personal/professional contacts who will hire you, rehire you, support you, recommend you." Based on what I see on TV I have to believe that the Rolodex counts for far more than the writing skill because there's a ton of crap getting produced. On the bright side, there's way more stuff than I can reasonably keep up with, so the relatively small amount of good stuff is maybe about enough.
    - dkarl 16y ago
      I agree that there's a lot of terrible stuff being produced, and you can go to any indie film festival and see movies with great scripts. But when you drop below the A list and look at the marginal, non-blockbuster movies, do you really need a good script to make money? Do producers and directors need a good writer? Is a good script or a good writer an asset to them at all? To put it another way, what is a "good" script from the point of view of the movie industry, and how many people actually want to write one, and would be willing to put their real name on it? If you look outside the blockbusters, and even at many blockbusters themselves, most scripts aren't that good. I know a few people who watch a lot of terrible movies who are kind of allergic to quality, or at least allergic to the aspiration to quality. They are tolerant of crap and want their movies to be tolerant, too. A friend of mine is a huge fan of horror and action movies, and the only movie he has ever walked out of was "The Thin Red Line." Why did that movie offend him, out of all the movies he's seen? It wasn't because it was bad. (He and I saw "Deuce Bigalo: European Gigolo" in the theater.) It offended him because it insulted his taste. It aspired to be better than the movies he liked. That's what I'm guessing, anyway. So if you're in the movie industry and trying to get a non-A-list movie made, you have to think about who's going to go see it. Writing a "good" script by your own standards may be a mistake. Maybe writing a "good" script only proves you don't understand the business and won't be an asset to the people who can help you. Maybe showing some hustle, some talent at getting noticed, and some crass instincts is necessary, not to draw attention to your good writing -- nobody gives a shit about your writing -- but because hustle, self-promotion, and crassness is how you prove you can succeed in the industry and help them make money in the future.
bialecki 16y ago
Maybe, maybe not. The point is you make your own luck. Work hard == more chances to get lucky.

So if somebody comes up with the greatest script on earth, but doesn't work 17 hours a day as a slave for some TV producer, his script will never be made?

by Tichy 16y ago

So if somebody comes up with the greatest script on earth, but doesn't work 17 hours a day as a slave for some TV producer, his script will never be made?

sbarre 16y ago

Correct.

rick888 16y ago

similarly. if you create the best web app on earth, but don't spend any time marketing it and nobody sees it, chances are it will fail.

Tichy 16y ago
And marketing is making coffee for Michael Arrington?
- apl 16y ago
  Wrong analogy. If you build a web app, you need paying customers. If you write a script, you need to get a producer to read it, like it and finance it. Different aims require different kinds of marketing - for writers it's networking on the producer-level.
  - chegra84 16y ago
    Which doesn't necessitates serving coffee.

frederickcook 16y ago

The amount of time and effort put into something is inversely proportional to how likely it is to fail. This isn't just because of the actual time and effort, but because as others observe this time and effort, they take the thing more seriously. For a startup, this is important because it not only means they're more likely to take it seriously, but that others are more likely to contribute their own time and effort.

jrockway 16y ago

It will probably be made. I am not sure how true this article is; I know people in college that majored in English or Journalism and got a TV writing job straight out of school. You probably aren't working on your own show at that point, but you aren't spending 18 hour days getting coffee for people either.

apl 16y ago

Correct, correct, correct. Television (and music and film, for that matter) are hardly a meritocracy. What ends up on screens and CDs isn't determined by quality, at least not primarily. There are fantastic scripts out there, masterpieces that will never get made. Crap gets turned into two-hundred million dollar blockbusters. [EDIT: This gets voted down why exactly?]

mbateman 16y ago
Because I don't believe that there are fantastic scripts out there not getting made. The crap we see is the best there is, sadly. (I have several friends in the movie industry.)
- jamesbritt 16y ago
  I read this in the article, " You have to be an amazing writer, the best writer people have ever read… and you have to have a large Rolodex of personal/professional contacts who will hire you, rehire you, support you, recommend you." Based on what I see on TV I have to believe that the Rolodex counts for far more than the writing skill because there's a ton of crap getting produced. On the bright side, there's way more stuff than I can reasonably keep up with, so the relatively small amount of good stuff is maybe about enough.
  - dkarl 16y ago
    I agree that there's a lot of terrible stuff being produced, and you can go to any indie film festival and see movies with great scripts. But when you drop below the A list and look at the marginal, non-blockbuster movies, do you really need a good script to make money? Do producers and directors need a good writer? Is a good script or a good writer an asset to them at all? To put it another way, what is a "good" script from the point of view of the movie industry, and how many people actually want to write one, and would be willing to put their real name on it? If you look outside the blockbusters, and even at many blockbusters themselves, most scripts aren't that good. I know a few people who watch a lot of terrible movies who are kind of allergic to quality, or at least allergic to the aspiration to quality. They are tolerant of crap and want their movies to be tolerant, too. A friend of mine is a huge fan of horror and action movies, and the only movie he has ever walked out of was "The Thin Red Line." Why did that movie offend him, out of all the movies he's seen? It wasn't because it was bad. (He and I saw "Deuce Bigalo: European Gigolo" in the theater.) It offended him because it insulted his taste. It aspired to be better than the movies he liked. That's what I'm guessing, anyway. So if you're in the movie industry and trying to get a non-A-list movie made, you have to think about who's going to go see it. Writing a "good" script by your own standards may be a mistake. Maybe writing a "good" script only proves you don't understand the business and won't be an asset to the people who can help you. Maybe showing some hustle, some talent at getting noticed, and some crass instincts is necessary, not to draw attention to your good writing -- nobody gives a shit about your writing -- but because hustle, self-promotion, and crassness is how you prove you can succeed in the industry and help them make money in the future.

bialecki 16y ago

Maybe, maybe not. The point is you make your own luck. Work hard == more chances to get lucky.