4 ms·

Save $200. Keep your genome to yourself. You won't regret it.

busterarm 8y ago
In the future you're (rightfully) afraid of, people will either collect your DNA from you without consent or as a condition of service. It's most unfortunate.
- davchana 8y ago
  Some countries like Bahrain or others collect it for residents, & few others might be thinking about the same for tourists too.
- whatshisface 8y ago
  That happens in one of the futures we're trying to avoid. In the rest it's just a bunch of opportunistic bad actors. Today there are a few heavy-handed government issues but the vast majority of the problems we face day to day are a result of smaller players who behave badly. So while it's always nice to secure against a joint CIA/NSA attack, if you can't then it's still OK to secure against identity theft.
- nosuchthing 8y ago
  http://deweyhagborg.com/projects/stranger-visions http://deweyhagborg.com/projects/stranger-visions https://vimeo.com/257272785 https://vimeo.com/257272785 In Stranger Visions I collected hairs, chewed up gum, and cigarette butts from the streets, public bathrooms and waiting rooms of New York City. I extracted DNA from them and analyzed it to computationally generate 3d printed life size full color portraits representing what those individuals might look like, based on genomic research. Working with the traces strangers unwittingly left behind, the project was meant to call attention to the developing technology of forensic DNA phenotyping, the potential for a culture of biological surveillance, and the impulse towards genetic determinism. The forecast of Stranger Visions came true. Just 2 years later Parabon NanoLabs launched a service they called DNA "snapshot" to police around the US. For more examples see Identitas and read about their collaboration with the Toronto police. http://www.identitascorp.com/ http://www.identitascorp.com/ http://www.theverge.com/2014/7/20/5916661/the-most-advanced-police-sketch-ever-might-solve-cold-cases http://www.theverge.com/2014/7/20/5916661/the-most-advanced-...
  - busterarm 8y ago
    If you want a good sci-fi thriller to really stoke the ol' paranoia, Change Agent is actually a pretty decent read. https://www.amazon.com/Change-Agent-Daniel-Suarez/dp/110198466X https://www.amazon.com/Change-Agent-Daniel-Suarez/dp/1101984...
    - TeMPOraL 8y ago
      Seconding the recommendation, it's a great read, well worth the time if you're into biotech and sci-fi in general. I thank whoever it was that recommended this book to me some years ago, here on HN. Also, if anyone knows of other books like these, please share!
  - jammygit 8y ago
    I had really hoped we were still 5-10 years away from this
    - baseten 8y ago
      I had really hoped we'd always be 5-10 years away from this.
- dorchadas 8y ago
  I had this conversation with my uncle tonight. He's super interested in finding out where he's from, but he steadfastly refuses to do so because of his fear of insurance hikes and how it will be abused in the future. I'm right there with him, and it's horrible to think that it'll be done without consent (cough Credit Scores cough)
  - deleted 8y ago
    [deleted]
  - ben_w 8y ago
    Insurance, if not the rest, could be solved if you have a system like the UK (public) or Germany (private) where it’s a fixed percentage of income and mandatory for all. I recommend campaigning for it, assuming you’re in the USA.
    - TeMPOraL 8y ago
      That solves basic health insurance, but doesn't help with mortgage or even car insurance, where I'd expect DNA to become an influencing factor too.
    - krrrh 8y ago
      The US actually passed federal legislation a decade ago that prohibits insurance discrimination on the basis of genetic information. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genetic_Information_Nondiscrimination_Act https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genetic_Information_Nondiscr... As I recall from purchasing health insurance in Germany (mandated, and the public option wasn’t available to me as a freelancer), there was price discrimination based on pre-existing conditions, which is currently illegal in the US. The monthly cost was capped at over 600€ Basispreis per individual (this was a couple of years ago), and if you hadn’t visited a hospital for a couple of years and were a healthy man in your 30s and chose to conceal any persitant issues you had been diagnosed with, you could find an offering for closer to 200€. The determination of how pre-existing conditions would affect the price was completely arbitrary and unreasonable, and a significant deterrent to seeking timely care. I’m not aware whether you could choose to not disclose genetic conditions and have your insurance be valid.
- TeMPOraL 8y ago
  In folk lore, you'd use your blood to sign a contract with the Devil. (I find it interesting how a lot of folk and religious stories about supernatural sound like memories of civilization with technology comparable to ours.)
  - spraak 8y ago
    > I find it interesting how a lot of folk and religious stories about supernatural sound like memories of civilization with technology comparable to ours. I think about this a lot. It has led me to see that level of technology doesn't always linearly increase. At times there appear to have been great regressions proceeding from times of incredible technology. An easy example for my mind are the pyramids in Egypt, or the countless and nauseatinly intricate temples of India. I feel like there have existed technologies that we haven't yet been able to detect or understand.
nosuchthing 8y ago
http://biononymous.me/ http://biononymous.me/ Biological surveillance is the means by which biological science is used to track, monitor, analyze, and turn bodies into data. It is the extraction of DNA and microbes from our skin, nails, hair and body fluids. It is the analysis of identifying body parts like faces, fingerprints and irises. It is the tracking of life itself by body heat, pulse, perspiration, and involuntary movement. It is the vulnerability we each face every day by the very situation of being human, by simply having a body. Biononymous.me fosters molecular resistance through the creation of a community to openly discuss, research, and develop potential solutions through art, science, technology, policy, and theory.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
buboard 8y ago
To play devil's advocate: On the other hand, maybe you get a chance to do this now, before it becomes regulated or completely illegal. Like, how you can no longer see health analyses in 23andme (in europe).
- shard972 8y ago
  I thought that was mainly in France due to their laws around biological fathers not necessarily being the "true father".
  - buboard 8y ago
    https://int.customercare.23andme.com/hc/en-us/articles/217696258-Will-I-receive-health-reports- https://int.customercare.23andme.com/hc/en-us/articles/21769...

In the future you're (rightfully) afraid of, people will either collect your DNA from you without consent or as a condition of service. It's most unfortunate.

davchana 8y ago
Some countries like Bahrain or others collect it for residents, & few others might be thinking about the same for tourists too.
whatshisface 8y ago
That happens in one of the futures we're trying to avoid. In the rest it's just a bunch of opportunistic bad actors. Today there are a few heavy-handed government issues but the vast majority of the problems we face day to day are a result of smaller players who behave badly. So while it's always nice to secure against a joint CIA/NSA attack, if you can't then it's still OK to secure against identity theft.
nosuchthing 8y ago
http://deweyhagborg.com/projects/stranger-visions http://deweyhagborg.com/projects/stranger-visions https://vimeo.com/257272785 https://vimeo.com/257272785 In Stranger Visions I collected hairs, chewed up gum, and cigarette butts from the streets, public bathrooms and waiting rooms of New York City. I extracted DNA from them and analyzed it to computationally generate 3d printed life size full color portraits representing what those individuals might look like, based on genomic research. Working with the traces strangers unwittingly left behind, the project was meant to call attention to the developing technology of forensic DNA phenotyping, the potential for a culture of biological surveillance, and the impulse towards genetic determinism. The forecast of Stranger Visions came true. Just 2 years later Parabon NanoLabs launched a service they called DNA "snapshot" to police around the US. For more examples see Identitas and read about their collaboration with the Toronto police. http://www.identitascorp.com/ http://www.identitascorp.com/ http://www.theverge.com/2014/7/20/5916661/the-most-advanced-police-sketch-ever-might-solve-cold-cases http://www.theverge.com/2014/7/20/5916661/the-most-advanced-...
- busterarm 8y ago
  If you want a good sci-fi thriller to really stoke the ol' paranoia, Change Agent is actually a pretty decent read. https://www.amazon.com/Change-Agent-Daniel-Suarez/dp/110198466X https://www.amazon.com/Change-Agent-Daniel-Suarez/dp/1101984...
  - TeMPOraL 8y ago
    Seconding the recommendation, it's a great read, well worth the time if you're into biotech and sci-fi in general. I thank whoever it was that recommended this book to me some years ago, here on HN. Also, if anyone knows of other books like these, please share!
- jammygit 8y ago
  I had really hoped we were still 5-10 years away from this
  - baseten 8y ago
    I had really hoped we'd always be 5-10 years away from this.
dorchadas 8y ago
I had this conversation with my uncle tonight. He's super interested in finding out where he's from, but he steadfastly refuses to do so because of his fear of insurance hikes and how it will be abused in the future. I'm right there with him, and it's horrible to think that it'll be done without consent (cough Credit Scores cough)
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
- ben_w 8y ago
  Insurance, if not the rest, could be solved if you have a system like the UK (public) or Germany (private) where it’s a fixed percentage of income and mandatory for all. I recommend campaigning for it, assuming you’re in the USA.
  - TeMPOraL 8y ago
    That solves basic health insurance, but doesn't help with mortgage or even car insurance, where I'd expect DNA to become an influencing factor too.
  - krrrh 8y ago
    The US actually passed federal legislation a decade ago that prohibits insurance discrimination on the basis of genetic information. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genetic_Information_Nondiscrimination_Act https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genetic_Information_Nondiscr... As I recall from purchasing health insurance in Germany (mandated, and the public option wasn’t available to me as a freelancer), there was price discrimination based on pre-existing conditions, which is currently illegal in the US. The monthly cost was capped at over 600€ Basispreis per individual (this was a couple of years ago), and if you hadn’t visited a hospital for a couple of years and were a healthy man in your 30s and chose to conceal any persitant issues you had been diagnosed with, you could find an offering for closer to 200€. The determination of how pre-existing conditions would affect the price was completely arbitrary and unreasonable, and a significant deterrent to seeking timely care. I’m not aware whether you could choose to not disclose genetic conditions and have your insurance be valid.
TeMPOraL 8y ago
In folk lore, you'd use your blood to sign a contract with the Devil. (I find it interesting how a lot of folk and religious stories about supernatural sound like memories of civilization with technology comparable to ours.)
- spraak 8y ago
  > I find it interesting how a lot of folk and religious stories about supernatural sound like memories of civilization with technology comparable to ours. I think about this a lot. It has led me to see that level of technology doesn't always linearly increase. At times there appear to have been great regressions proceeding from times of incredible technology. An easy example for my mind are the pyramids in Egypt, or the countless and nauseatinly intricate temples of India. I feel like there have existed technologies that we haven't yet been able to detect or understand.

nosuchthing 8y ago

http://biononymous.me/ http://biononymous.me/ Biological surveillance is the means by which biological science is used to track, monitor, analyze, and turn bodies into data. It is the extraction of DNA and microbes from our skin, nails, hair and body fluids. It is the analysis of identifying body parts like faces, fingerprints and irises. It is the tracking of life itself by body heat, pulse, perspiration, and involuntary movement. It is the vulnerability we each face every day by the very situation of being human, by simply having a body. Biononymous.me fosters molecular resistance through the creation of a community to openly discuss, research, and develop potential solutions through art, science, technology, policy, and theory.

deleted 8y ago
[deleted]

buboard 8y ago

To play devil's advocate: On the other hand, maybe you get a chance to do this now, before it becomes regulated or completely illegal. Like, how you can no longer see health analyses in 23andme (in europe).

shard972 8y ago
I thought that was mainly in France due to their laws around biological fathers not necessarily being the "true father".
- buboard 8y ago
  https://int.customercare.23andme.com/hc/en-us/articles/217696258-Will-I-receive-health-reports- https://int.customercare.23andme.com/hc/en-us/articles/21769...