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But dampening happens differently in different parts of the frame. For example, thinner & curved seat stays vs a suspension fork, or round 853 steel tubing vs

But dampening happens differently in different parts of the frame. For example, thinner & curved seat stays vs a suspension fork, or round 853 steel tubing vs highly aero-optimized low profile carbon, or deep dish carbon wheels vs traditional aluminum. Your statement is technically accurate, but that doesn't mean the feel of the ride will be equivalent.

modzu 8y ago
for real -- is an aluminum wire stiffer than a steel rod? no. bike tubes are made very differently depending on the materials; any model of stifness that you feel at your BODY needs to compensate for all of that
gameswithgo 8y ago
Professional level riders are absolutely certain they can feel the difference between deep carbon wheels vs aluminum when they test them. Then if you disguise the wheels such that they cannot tell which is which, they are completely unable to discern them. The same is true with frame types typically believed to be vastly different. A professional triathlete and ex cat 1 road racer I know was sure he could tell the difference between Cervelo's comfort, round tube frame (The R series) and their aerodynamic frame (the S series). He devised a helmet with an obscuring screen so he could test the two in blind fashion, and he was unable to discern which was which, by riding them. Its all just nonsense, really, imho. There are dozens of examples like these I've seen through the years. People with high degrees of expertise, certain of these feeling differences, blind them, and they can't tell.
- eitally 8y ago
  Perhaps I unreasonable assumed we were comparing a Cervelo (any) to a wood frame, not two high-tech carbon Cervelos (fwiw, I ride an S3). There absolutely are differences and the gamut is broad, but the differences are subtle when comparing two very similar products. As an aside, the placebo effect is real, and I attribute a lot of strong product opinions re: fitness equipment (doesn't matter if bikes or running shoes) to how they make people feel, not how they objectively perform.

modzu 8y ago

for real -- is an aluminum wire stiffer than a steel rod? no. bike tubes are made very differently depending on the materials; any model of stifness that you feel at your BODY needs to compensate for all of that

gameswithgo 8y ago

Professional level riders are absolutely certain they can feel the difference between deep carbon wheels vs aluminum when they test them. Then if you disguise the wheels such that they cannot tell which is which, they are completely unable to discern them. The same is true with frame types typically believed to be vastly different. A professional triathlete and ex cat 1 road racer I know was sure he could tell the difference between Cervelo's comfort, round tube frame (The R series) and their aerodynamic frame (the S series). He devised a helmet with an obscuring screen so he could test the two in blind fashion, and he was unable to discern which was which, by riding them. Its all just nonsense, really, imho. There are dozens of examples like these I've seen through the years. People with high degrees of expertise, certain of these feeling differences, blind them, and they can't tell.

eitally 8y ago
Perhaps I unreasonable assumed we were comparing a Cervelo (any) to a wood frame, not two high-tech carbon Cervelos (fwiw, I ride an S3). There absolutely are differences and the gamut is broad, but the differences are subtle when comparing two very similar products. As an aside, the placebo effect is real, and I attribute a lot of strong product opinions re: fitness equipment (doesn't matter if bikes or running shoes) to how they make people feel, not how they objectively perform.