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Torpedoing peace talks in order to win an election. Such a despicable act, I don't know any words fitting for it. I know it was not the first or last time in hi

Torpedoing peace talks in order to win an election. Such a despicable act, I don't know any words fitting for it. I know it was not the first or last time in history this has been done, but since this instance can be proven I would suggest that some choice sites such as Nixon's birthplace should be torn down, the ground burned and it left permanently in ashes as a reminder.

TheOtherHobbes 8y ago
SOP in Washington. LBJ's escalation of the Vietnam War made his corporate sponsors an absolute fortune. More recently, Theresa May's backing for military action in Syria pumped the stock price of British Aerospace, which happens to be part-owned by a capital fund that employ's Theresa May's husband. The real problem with politics is that very few people understand how absolutely amoral and cynical it is. LBJ still had some interest in public service, but for a terrifying number of modern politicians the public service ethos is a fig leaf. The real morality is narcissism and greed. As long as money keeps rolling in no one cares how it's made or who gets damaged in the process.
- ThomPete 8y ago
  One has to be extra careful with distinguishing correlation from causation. For anyone in top of politics they are likely going to be connected to people who are top in either corporations or organisations. Theresa May isn't a dictator and can't just decide what she wants to without being in agreement with the rest of her politicians. Insinuating that there is some causational relationship here is just as much part of the problem. That said, there definitely are cases where the relationship seems very suspicious, but it's not a rule and I wish people would be more careful to prove their claims rather than just putting them out there. But maybe I am missing something here.
  - claudiawerner 8y ago
    >Theresa May isn't a dictator and can't just decide what she wants to without being in agreement with the rest of her politicians. This is true, to the extent where I wish people would stop individualizing problems that are obviously endemic to the entire system. The damage caused by individual conspiracies isolated in history is negligible to the scale of systemic issues in modern political economy. Applying some abstract thinking would help us understand that May isn't a dictator, but capital is.
    - profalseidol 8y ago
      What do you think of going for worker-owned-and-directed-cooperatives replacing traditional corporations as a first step in combating capitalism? I think the idea is, to distribute power to the people. These cooperatives would generally make decisions that benefit the majority. Unlike what we have today where mega corporations (dictated by a handful few) keep doing whatever they can for 'growth' even if that means destroying people's lives and our planet.
  - zipwitch 8y ago
    You are right that "dictatorship" or "conspiracy" are the wrong ways to look at this sort of corrupting influence. The actuality is far more pernicious - it doesn't take Bond-villain plotting, just people making decisions that are shaded by their own social connections. They don't need to be doing it deliberately or conciously, but even indirect connections to, for example, the defense industry or certain players in the finance industry will lead to decisions that benefit those to whom the decider is biased.
- Cacti 8y ago
  The older I get the more stunningly obvious and apparent the corruption is. It is endemic.
- Mvandenbergh 8y ago
  Philip May is a relationship manager for a company that among other things, manages mutual funds. While I don't doubt that some of those funds own BAE (as it's a component of the FTSE100, more funds will own it than not) this is a very silly link to make.
arethuza 8y ago
"I don't know any words fitting for it" I believe the relevant word is actually "treason" at least according to "The Vietnam War: An Intimate History".
moron4hire 8y ago
Perhaps we should coin a new term, "Nixonian".
otras 8y ago
Perhaps you'll find the words in Hunter Thompson's obituary of Nixon [0] fitting: "Richard Nixon is gone now, and I am poorer for it. He was the real thing -- a political monster straight out of Grendel and a very dangerous enemy. He could shake your hand and stab you in the back at the same time. He lied to his friends and betrayed the trust of his family. Not even Gerald Ford, the unhappy ex-president who pardoned Nixon and kept him out of prison, was immune to the evil fallout. Ford, who believes strongly in Heaven and Hell, has told more than one of his celebrity golf partners that 'I know I will go to hell, because I pardoned Richard Nixon.'" [0]: https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/1994/07/he-was-a-crook/308699/ https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/1994/07/he-was-...
- slededit 8y ago
  I recommend watching Frost/Nixon, or the contemporary interviews. Nixon was a human and not devil incarnate. Its important we understand that potential for Nixon's evils lies within all of us. In the grand scheme of tyrants he wasn't even that bad - barely deserving of the label.
  - erikpukinskis 8y ago
    Who said he was the devil incarnate? You seem to be making a logical fallacy here.
    - slededit 8y ago
      I disagree with Hunter S. Thompson's portrayal. You'll have to forgive me for paraphrasing, "a political monster straight out of Grendel and a very dangerous enemy". Which I find extreme. But Thompson was great at grandiose phrasing which is also why I like his writing.
ohiovr 8y ago
Nixon delenda est! and sow in the salt

TheOtherHobbes 8y ago

SOP in Washington. LBJ's escalation of the Vietnam War made his corporate sponsors an absolute fortune. More recently, Theresa May's backing for military action in Syria pumped the stock price of British Aerospace, which happens to be part-owned by a capital fund that employ's Theresa May's husband. The real problem with politics is that very few people understand how absolutely amoral and cynical it is. LBJ still had some interest in public service, but for a terrifying number of modern politicians the public service ethos is a fig leaf. The real morality is narcissism and greed. As long as money keeps rolling in no one cares how it's made or who gets damaged in the process.

ThomPete 8y ago
One has to be extra careful with distinguishing correlation from causation. For anyone in top of politics they are likely going to be connected to people who are top in either corporations or organisations. Theresa May isn't a dictator and can't just decide what she wants to without being in agreement with the rest of her politicians. Insinuating that there is some causational relationship here is just as much part of the problem. That said, there definitely are cases where the relationship seems very suspicious, but it's not a rule and I wish people would be more careful to prove their claims rather than just putting them out there. But maybe I am missing something here.
- claudiawerner 8y ago
  >Theresa May isn't a dictator and can't just decide what she wants to without being in agreement with the rest of her politicians. This is true, to the extent where I wish people would stop individualizing problems that are obviously endemic to the entire system. The damage caused by individual conspiracies isolated in history is negligible to the scale of systemic issues in modern political economy. Applying some abstract thinking would help us understand that May isn't a dictator, but capital is.
  - profalseidol 8y ago
    What do you think of going for worker-owned-and-directed-cooperatives replacing traditional corporations as a first step in combating capitalism? I think the idea is, to distribute power to the people. These cooperatives would generally make decisions that benefit the majority. Unlike what we have today where mega corporations (dictated by a handful few) keep doing whatever they can for 'growth' even if that means destroying people's lives and our planet.
- zipwitch 8y ago
  You are right that "dictatorship" or "conspiracy" are the wrong ways to look at this sort of corrupting influence. The actuality is far more pernicious - it doesn't take Bond-villain plotting, just people making decisions that are shaded by their own social connections. They don't need to be doing it deliberately or conciously, but even indirect connections to, for example, the defense industry or certain players in the finance industry will lead to decisions that benefit those to whom the decider is biased.
Cacti 8y ago
The older I get the more stunningly obvious and apparent the corruption is. It is endemic.
Mvandenbergh 8y ago
Philip May is a relationship manager for a company that among other things, manages mutual funds. While I don't doubt that some of those funds own BAE (as it's a component of the FTSE100, more funds will own it than not) this is a very silly link to make.

arethuza 8y ago

"I don't know any words fitting for it" I believe the relevant word is actually "treason" at least according to "The Vietnam War: An Intimate History".

moron4hire 8y ago

Perhaps we should coin a new term, "Nixonian".

otras 8y ago

Perhaps you'll find the words in Hunter Thompson's obituary of Nixon [0] fitting: "Richard Nixon is gone now, and I am poorer for it. He was the real thing -- a political monster straight out of Grendel and a very dangerous enemy. He could shake your hand and stab you in the back at the same time. He lied to his friends and betrayed the trust of his family. Not even Gerald Ford, the unhappy ex-president who pardoned Nixon and kept him out of prison, was immune to the evil fallout. Ford, who believes strongly in Heaven and Hell, has told more than one of his celebrity golf partners that 'I know I will go to hell, because I pardoned Richard Nixon.'" [0]: https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/1994/07/he-was-a-crook/308699/ https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/1994/07/he-was-...

slededit 8y ago
I recommend watching Frost/Nixon, or the contemporary interviews. Nixon was a human and not devil incarnate. Its important we understand that potential for Nixon's evils lies within all of us. In the grand scheme of tyrants he wasn't even that bad - barely deserving of the label.
- erikpukinskis 8y ago
  Who said he was the devil incarnate? You seem to be making a logical fallacy here.
  - slededit 8y ago
    I disagree with Hunter S. Thompson's portrayal. You'll have to forgive me for paraphrasing, "a political monster straight out of Grendel and a very dangerous enemy". Which I find extreme. But Thompson was great at grandiose phrasing which is also why I like his writing.

ohiovr 8y ago

Nixon delenda est! and sow in the salt