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I really hope that next time when somebody tries to paint Linus as an asshole and a toxic force for the community because of his rants, someone remembers to lin

I really hope that next time when somebody tries to paint Linus as an asshole and a toxic force for the community because of his rants, someone remembers to link this email too.

hyperman1 8y ago
It demonstrates how Linus is not only a good programmer, but also a good leader. I get the same idea as with the first Gordon Ramsey Kitchen-fixing programmes. Apparently, people said it was insane how he dared to swear on TV. But basically, he notices things are very wrong, makes sure he gets to the bottom of the mess, and hammers the ugly message very publicly into some owner who lost any connection with reality. If the cost is some swearing, that's the least of the problem. The failing businesses get fixed at least as much on a sociological level as on a cooking level. Linus does the same. A big software project's problems are more sociological than technical in nature. Sometimes, the ugly message has to get trough, an another famous rant is born. But most of the time, work gets done, probably with a reasonable amount of smiles.
- robin_reala 8y ago
  The US Kitchen Nightmares are completely faked up drama for US audiences. Watch some of the original UK ones and you’ll see how he tries to coach the chefs with comparatively minimal swearing and anger.
  - hyperman1 8y ago
    I am indeed mostly talking about the UK versions. The US versions had much more drama and much less cooking, but underlying it had the same theme.
- Andrex 8y ago
  Unrelated to the article, but the early British seasons of Kitchen Nightmares were so good. I still enjoy watching the Fox version (and his new show, 24 Hours), but I appreciate those original seasons much more.
  - vesrah 8y ago
    You might like The British Baking Show on Netflix. No yelling, everyone is super supportive of each other.
    - Andrex 8y ago
      It's definitely near the top of my list! And may be higher after your comment. :)
- yesenadam 8y ago
  Mitchell & Webb's take on Kitchen Nightmares, more criticism than comedy https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i1NfWIaYed8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i1NfWIaYed8
danharaj 8y ago
You don't have to be an asshole all the time to be an asshole.
dx87 8y ago
I also like this email where he explained to a CS student the difference between spinlocks and semaphores. https://yarchive.net/comp/linux/semaphores.html https://yarchive.net/comp/linux/semaphores.html
PhasmaFelis 8y ago
Someone can be an asshole and a great leader, at the same or different times. Linus himself, to his credit, recently admitted that he's been unreasonably abusive and is trying to learn better.[0] People are complicated. He needn't be either a saint or a demon. [0] https://lkml.org/lkml/2018/9/16/167 https://lkml.org/lkml/2018/9/16/167
- HarryHirsch 8y ago
  that he's been unreasonably abusive I have not heard of Linus taking credit for other people's work, or him getting into a fistfight at a conference or feeling up women's asses.
  - kbutler 8y ago
    And apples are not oranges, but they are both fruit.
  - PhasmaFelis 8y ago
    Good thing no one implied any of that, then!
- golergka 8y ago
  The thing is, all Linus rants that I've seen are entirely reasonable. Yes, calling someone stupid is rude, but rude things should be used in extreme circumstances. And when a single developer can negatively affect millions - wait, actually, billions - of people around the world with a stupid patch, that's exactly the case where being rude and aggressive is entirely reasonable.
  - chrisseaton 8y ago
    Being rude and aggressive would be reasonable if there was some imminent danger, but there isn't - he can calmly explain things and doesn't have to merge anything until he's ready.
  - core-questions 8y ago
    > all Linus rants that I've seen are entirely reasonable Spot on. I'd hate to be on the receiving side, but look at what we've all gotten from this effort - in a Machiavellian sense it really has been the correct choice.
Latty 8y ago
Linus admitted himself that his behavior was sometimes out of line. That doesn't mean he was always "an asshole", just that sometimes he was. He has accepted that and worked to change it. Stop trying to paint progress as a bad thing.
eridius 8y ago
Just because someone is frequently an asshole doesn't mean they're an asshole 100% of the time.
- yesenadam 8y ago
  Well, serial killers don't kill almost all the time also. Reminds me of that Monty Python sketch where the army guy tries to reassure the interviewer by saying there's "almost no cannibalism in the British Army."

I really hope that next time when somebody tries to paint Linus as an asshole and a toxic force for the community because of his rants, someone remembers to link this email too.

hyperman1 8y ago

It demonstrates how Linus is not only a good programmer, but also a good leader. I get the same idea as with the first Gordon Ramsey Kitchen-fixing programmes. Apparently, people said it was insane how he dared to swear on TV. But basically, he notices things are very wrong, makes sure he gets to the bottom of the mess, and hammers the ugly message very publicly into some owner who lost any connection with reality. If the cost is some swearing, that's the least of the problem. The failing businesses get fixed at least as much on a sociological level as on a cooking level. Linus does the same. A big software project's problems are more sociological than technical in nature. Sometimes, the ugly message has to get trough, an another famous rant is born. But most of the time, work gets done, probably with a reasonable amount of smiles.

robin_reala 8y ago
The US Kitchen Nightmares are completely faked up drama for US audiences. Watch some of the original UK ones and you’ll see how he tries to coach the chefs with comparatively minimal swearing and anger.
- hyperman1 8y ago
  I am indeed mostly talking about the UK versions. The US versions had much more drama and much less cooking, but underlying it had the same theme.
Andrex 8y ago
Unrelated to the article, but the early British seasons of Kitchen Nightmares were so good. I still enjoy watching the Fox version (and his new show, 24 Hours), but I appreciate those original seasons much more.
- vesrah 8y ago
  You might like The British Baking Show on Netflix. No yelling, everyone is super supportive of each other.
  - Andrex 8y ago
    It's definitely near the top of my list! And may be higher after your comment. :)
yesenadam 8y ago
Mitchell & Webb's take on Kitchen Nightmares, more criticism than comedy https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i1NfWIaYed8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i1NfWIaYed8

danharaj 8y ago

You don't have to be an asshole all the time to be an asshole.

dx87 8y ago

I also like this email where he explained to a CS student the difference between spinlocks and semaphores. https://yarchive.net/comp/linux/semaphores.html https://yarchive.net/comp/linux/semaphores.html

PhasmaFelis 8y ago

Someone can be an asshole and a great leader, at the same or different times. Linus himself, to his credit, recently admitted that he's been unreasonably abusive and is trying to learn better.[0] People are complicated. He needn't be either a saint or a demon. [0] https://lkml.org/lkml/2018/9/16/167 https://lkml.org/lkml/2018/9/16/167

HarryHirsch 8y ago
that he's been unreasonably abusive I have not heard of Linus taking credit for other people's work, or him getting into a fistfight at a conference or feeling up women's asses.
- kbutler 8y ago
  And apples are not oranges, but they are both fruit.
- PhasmaFelis 8y ago
  Good thing no one implied any of that, then!
golergka 8y ago
The thing is, all Linus rants that I've seen are entirely reasonable. Yes, calling someone stupid is rude, but rude things should be used in extreme circumstances. And when a single developer can negatively affect millions - wait, actually, billions - of people around the world with a stupid patch, that's exactly the case where being rude and aggressive is entirely reasonable.
- chrisseaton 8y ago
  Being rude and aggressive would be reasonable if there was some imminent danger, but there isn't - he can calmly explain things and doesn't have to merge anything until he's ready.
- core-questions 8y ago
  > all Linus rants that I've seen are entirely reasonable Spot on. I'd hate to be on the receiving side, but look at what we've all gotten from this effort - in a Machiavellian sense it really has been the correct choice.

Latty 8y ago

Linus admitted himself that his behavior was sometimes out of line. That doesn't mean he was always "an asshole", just that sometimes he was. He has accepted that and worked to change it. Stop trying to paint progress as a bad thing.

eridius 8y ago

Just because someone is frequently an asshole doesn't mean they're an asshole 100% of the time.

yesenadam 8y ago
Well, serial killers don't kill almost all the time also. Reminds me of that Monty Python sketch where the army guy tries to reassure the interviewer by saying there's "almost no cannibalism in the British Army."