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Why aren't they? They're not doing it from altruistic reasons, they've just found people willing to work for less pay. Surely a king upon conquering even worse

by jahaja 8y ago

Why aren't they? They're not doing it from altruistic reasons, they've just found people willing to work for less pay. Surely a king upon conquering even worse off subjects, which enables him to maintain and expand his wealthy lifestyle cheaper, can still be charged as an exploiter?

conanbatt 8y ago
> Why aren't they? They're not doing it from altruistic reasons, they've just found people willing to work for less pay. The middle class is not asking for progressive taxation of the rich for altruistic reasons either: they want the benefit of that taxation: access to housing, health, government jobs, college education, etc. Its a much more morally and factually confusing narrative to say that the middle 50% wants to take fro mthe top 25% and bottom 25%, than the top 50% is taking from the bottom 50%. Particularly because in the utilitarian view, taking from the middle and giving to the bottom is still redistribution of wealth the 'right direction'. The case in the united states is a lot simpler than people think tho. I believe the single most important reversal of real wages stagnation is to fix healthcare. If insurance cost half of what it costs today (or even less), then real wages would get a massive bump, specially at the lower echelons, where insurance costs disproportionately more than at the top.
- jahaja 8y ago
  > The middle class is not asking for progressive taxation of the rich for altruistic reasons either: they want the benefit of that taxation: access to housing, health, government jobs, college education, etc. This needs a change of perspective. The workers are the ones that needs to sell their labour to the rich. It's their work that's the base of the rich's gains. The rich are unable to get rich without them. The benefits funded by taxes are capitalist societies fundamental palliative to prevent a Bastille day - especially when livable wages are seemingly also up for discussion. It's interesting to see how they're undermining themselves.
  - conanbatt 8y ago
    But the poor are getting richer, thats working perfectly well. Its just the middle class isnt benefitting of it as much as the richest.
    - jahaja 8y ago
      Uhm, this goes back to my first reply? Furthermore it's in general a terrible argument since it can be more or less claimed by every despotic regime in history.

by jahaja 8y ago

conanbatt 8y ago

> Why aren't they? They're not doing it from altruistic reasons, they've just found people willing to work for less pay. The middle class is not asking for progressive taxation of the rich for altruistic reasons either: they want the benefit of that taxation: access to housing, health, government jobs, college education, etc. Its a much more morally and factually confusing narrative to say that the middle 50% wants to take fro mthe top 25% and bottom 25%, than the top 50% is taking from the bottom 50%. Particularly because in the utilitarian view, taking from the middle and giving to the bottom is still redistribution of wealth the 'right direction'. The case in the united states is a lot simpler than people think tho. I believe the single most important reversal of real wages stagnation is to fix healthcare. If insurance cost half of what it costs today (or even less), then real wages would get a massive bump, specially at the lower echelons, where insurance costs disproportionately more than at the top.

jahaja 8y ago
> The middle class is not asking for progressive taxation of the rich for altruistic reasons either: they want the benefit of that taxation: access to housing, health, government jobs, college education, etc. This needs a change of perspective. The workers are the ones that needs to sell their labour to the rich. It's their work that's the base of the rich's gains. The rich are unable to get rich without them. The benefits funded by taxes are capitalist societies fundamental palliative to prevent a Bastille day - especially when livable wages are seemingly also up for discussion. It's interesting to see how they're undermining themselves.
- conanbatt 8y ago
  But the poor are getting richer, thats working perfectly well. Its just the middle class isnt benefitting of it as much as the richest.
  - jahaja 8y ago
    Uhm, this goes back to my first reply? Furthermore it's in general a terrible argument since it can be more or less claimed by every despotic regime in history.