9 ms·

Windows Phone 7 doesnt yet support copy and paste. I would not look at a lack of 'HTML5 support' as strategic.

rbanffy 16y ago
As windsurfer pointed out, lack of HTML5 support is a strategic decision. The lack of copy and paste is... well... "stragedic".
- confuzatron 16y ago
  IMO, windsurfer didn't 'point out' anything - he/she speculated as to why WP7 didn't emerge from the womb with HTML5 support, and expressed the speculation more as an assertion of fact.
  - rbanffy 16y ago
    Here: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1848070 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1848070
deleted 16y ago
[deleted]
InclinedPlane 16y ago
The fact that Windows Phone 7 doesn't support HTML5 may not be intentionally strategic, but it affects Windows Phone 7's strategic future nonetheless.
- confuzatron 16y ago
  Does it however strategically affect WP7's strategic future? Look, the way I see it, WP7 is barely months (weeks?) old. To expect HTML5 support when 'HTML5' is in still flux is silly. MS are still working on their desktop support for goodness sake. Lack of copy-and-paste demonstrates clearly that MS couldn't get everything in to v1.0. And to impute strategic motives is reaching.
  - glhaynes 16y ago
    The fact that Microsoft is still working on desktop HTML5 doesn't mean a thing to a smartphone customer when every other popular smartphone has it already. For the same reason, it's hard to convince myself that I'm being "silly" for having an expectation as a web developer that a new mobile OS platform in 2010 would have decent HTML5 support. What a step backwards for the mobile web.
  - alanh 16y ago
    > To expect HTML5 support when 'HTML5' is in still flux is silly. Er… their competitors’ phones support a lot more HTML5, CSS3, and related APIs than they do. Who’s silly, exactly?
- jawee 16y ago
  Won't everyone just end up using Opera Mobile/Mini or whatever other mobile browsers become available for Windows Phone 7 instead of the default if it doesn't meet expectations? None of the serious users of the current types of Windows Mobile phones I know use the crippled versions of IE they contain. I know this is supposedly an entirely new idea, I still see this happening.. especially when customers will expect browsers as nice as iOS, Android, WebOS, Maemo, and even newer Blackberries...
sukuriant 16y ago
Has everyone forgotten that the iPhone didn't support copy-paste, at first? Edit: [completing my thought] Apple was ridiculed for it, though; however, it's more evidence that the phone isn't 100% complete, and that Microsoft wants a tool out there to show the world what they've made. Perhaps then, as requests are made concerning the phone, they'll incorporate those, not to mention adding features they, themselves want. (It won't take long to want copy-paste). As a second thought I had while extending this post. Startups are encouraged to release early and release often. Releasing early, I imagine, comes with "releasing a not 100% complete and not even completely polished" subtext to it), why are large corporations slammed for it? I thought we praise companies like Google because they similar to a startup, and yet we scoff at companies like Microsoft when they may very well be doing something similar. Admittedly, I've not followed Windows Phone 7 very closely, as I'm pleased with my current smart phone (Droid original), so perhaps they've not alluded to this being the end-all, be-all for their phone. Given how XP came to be, though, we really should be prepared for their original version to not be perfect, and it take a few (free) updates to get it up to something very good. So long as I'm rambling, I should add that, if carriers start modding the heck out of the operating system to the point that a user can't download the patches that Microsoft comes out with, producing an incomplete product is a very, very bad idea for them (or maybe for the carriers) -- but I don't want to start the carriers versus phone-makers versus software-developers war, again. End my two cents on things related to the subject. [edit 2: some grammar-o's fixed]
- treeface 16y ago
  I feel bad for the MS devs, but from a consumer perspective, this is how it works: It's 2010. If you start a television production company today, you won't come out with a black and white CRT using the excuse "has everyone forgotten that Panasonic didn't support color HD TVs at first?"
  - sukuriant 16y ago
    You have a point, though I would liken this lack of a feature to something more like "this blu ray player can't connect to the internet via WPA2." It's not entirely essential to its operation, and an upgrade could be around the corner. [Hacker News bug report: I had to come to treeface's comment page to reply to this message. I wasn't allowed to on the main thread]
auxbuss 16y ago
I'm not following Phone7 closely enough to have noticed that. So, if the absence of HTML5 is not a "strategic" decision what is it? I don't mean to be inflammatory, but it strikes me as being a completely barking decision. The world and its developers' army is writing for HTML5, especially in the mobile space. Folk are openly talking about dedicated apps going the way of the dodo, and that's because of what HTML5 brings. Sure it may not all be here today, but get the weight of the World's developers behind you and, frankly, nothing is going to stop it. I do expect WP7 to support HTML5. I'm utterly amazed that it doesn't. Does Microsoft really believe that it is bigger than the Internet, the mobile space, and all those that develop for it? Has it lost its way so totally and utterly? Has it lost its marbles?
- rbanffy 16y ago
  > Does Microsoft really believe that it is bigger than the Internet, the mobile space, and all those that develop for it? Has it lost its way so totally and utterly? Has it lost its marbles? I will assume this is a rhetorical question.

As windsurfer pointed out, lack of HTML5 support is a strategic decision. The lack of copy and paste is... well... "stragedic".

confuzatron 16y ago
IMO, windsurfer didn't 'point out' anything - he/she speculated as to why WP7 didn't emerge from the womb with HTML5 support, and expressed the speculation more as an assertion of fact.
- rbanffy 16y ago
  Here: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1848070 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1848070

deleted 16y ago

[deleted]

InclinedPlane 16y ago

The fact that Windows Phone 7 doesn't support HTML5 may not be intentionally strategic, but it affects Windows Phone 7's strategic future nonetheless.

confuzatron 16y ago
Does it however strategically affect WP7's strategic future? Look, the way I see it, WP7 is barely months (weeks?) old. To expect HTML5 support when 'HTML5' is in still flux is silly. MS are still working on their desktop support for goodness sake. Lack of copy-and-paste demonstrates clearly that MS couldn't get everything in to v1.0. And to impute strategic motives is reaching.
- glhaynes 16y ago
  The fact that Microsoft is still working on desktop HTML5 doesn't mean a thing to a smartphone customer when every other popular smartphone has it already. For the same reason, it's hard to convince myself that I'm being "silly" for having an expectation as a web developer that a new mobile OS platform in 2010 would have decent HTML5 support. What a step backwards for the mobile web.
- alanh 16y ago
  > To expect HTML5 support when 'HTML5' is in still flux is silly. Er… their competitors’ phones support a lot more HTML5, CSS3, and related APIs than they do. Who’s silly, exactly?
jawee 16y ago
Won't everyone just end up using Opera Mobile/Mini or whatever other mobile browsers become available for Windows Phone 7 instead of the default if it doesn't meet expectations? None of the serious users of the current types of Windows Mobile phones I know use the crippled versions of IE they contain. I know this is supposedly an entirely new idea, I still see this happening.. especially when customers will expect browsers as nice as iOS, Android, WebOS, Maemo, and even newer Blackberries...

sukuriant 16y ago

Has everyone forgotten that the iPhone didn't support copy-paste, at first? Edit: [completing my thought] Apple was ridiculed for it, though; however, it's more evidence that the phone isn't 100% complete, and that Microsoft wants a tool out there to show the world what they've made. Perhaps then, as requests are made concerning the phone, they'll incorporate those, not to mention adding features they, themselves want. (It won't take long to want copy-paste). As a second thought I had while extending this post. Startups are encouraged to release early and release often. Releasing early, I imagine, comes with "releasing a not 100% complete and not even completely polished" subtext to it), why are large corporations slammed for it? I thought we praise companies like Google because they similar to a startup, and yet we scoff at companies like Microsoft when they may very well be doing something similar. Admittedly, I've not followed Windows Phone 7 very closely, as I'm pleased with my current smart phone (Droid original), so perhaps they've not alluded to this being the end-all, be-all for their phone. Given how XP came to be, though, we really should be prepared for their original version to not be perfect, and it take a few (free) updates to get it up to something very good. So long as I'm rambling, I should add that, if carriers start modding the heck out of the operating system to the point that a user can't download the patches that Microsoft comes out with, producing an incomplete product is a very, very bad idea for them (or maybe for the carriers) -- but I don't want to start the carriers versus phone-makers versus software-developers war, again. End my two cents on things related to the subject. [edit 2: some grammar-o's fixed]

treeface 16y ago
I feel bad for the MS devs, but from a consumer perspective, this is how it works: It's 2010. If you start a television production company today, you won't come out with a black and white CRT using the excuse "has everyone forgotten that Panasonic didn't support color HD TVs at first?"
- sukuriant 16y ago
  You have a point, though I would liken this lack of a feature to something more like "this blu ray player can't connect to the internet via WPA2." It's not entirely essential to its operation, and an upgrade could be around the corner. [Hacker News bug report: I had to come to treeface's comment page to reply to this message. I wasn't allowed to on the main thread]

auxbuss 16y ago

I'm not following Phone7 closely enough to have noticed that. So, if the absence of HTML5 is not a "strategic" decision what is it? I don't mean to be inflammatory, but it strikes me as being a completely barking decision. The world and its developers' army is writing for HTML5, especially in the mobile space. Folk are openly talking about dedicated apps going the way of the dodo, and that's because of what HTML5 brings. Sure it may not all be here today, but get the weight of the World's developers behind you and, frankly, nothing is going to stop it. I do expect WP7 to support HTML5. I'm utterly amazed that it doesn't. Does Microsoft really believe that it is bigger than the Internet, the mobile space, and all those that develop for it? Has it lost its way so totally and utterly? Has it lost its marbles?

rbanffy 16y ago
> Does Microsoft really believe that it is bigger than the Internet, the mobile space, and all those that develop for it? Has it lost its way so totally and utterly? Has it lost its marbles? I will assume this is a rhetorical question.