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Here is everything you need to know about the demand for autos and the psychology of the auto consumer in the United States. Also very instructive about attitu

by rsync 8y ago

Here is everything you need to know about the demand for autos and the psychology of the auto consumer in the United States. Also very instructive about attitudes toward public transportation in the US.[1] This video is worth one million words:[2] https://www.ispot.tv/ad/wy2O/state-farm-backstory-truck-song-by-john-taylor https://www.ispot.tv/ad/wy2O/state-farm-backstory-truck-song... What is depicted in the video is considered, by much of the United States population, to be their birthright. The tax or incentive regime that would be necessary to prevent every young male from buying a huge truck[3] would be a bigger political impossibility than banning firearms. I note that General Motors just reintroduced 0% financing for trucks. [1] ... which is well deserved. Bus transit in the United States is terrible. In most municipalities, there is no other option. [2] A state farm (insurance company in the US) commercial that was aired in the past year during American football (not soccer) games. [3] If you don't live in the US, you have no idea how enormous the vehicles are that individuals are using to drive their single persons to the grocery store. It is very common to see a 7 meter long vehicle that is rated to tow an 8 horse trailer (or a yacht) being driven, with no cargo, and a single occupant, to run errands around town.

jorblumesea 8y ago
This ad was specifically targeted towards rural communities which have poor public transit networks and where driving is a given. This doesn't represent the attitude of many Americans. Americans are pro transit in the cities. Not as much as Europe, but certainly not as bad as you make it out to be.
- goatlover 8y ago
  It all depends on the US city and what the public transportation options are. If it's mostly bus, then people will prefer to drive if they can.
  - rleigh 8y ago
    What's the reason for that though? I used to have a 30 min bus ride to work and back. I could have driven, but was more hassle and required getting an expensive parking permit. The bus gave me 30 mins to read a book or newspaper, relax, use the free wifi and not have to deal with rush hour commuting traffic both ways. It was better in all aspects except the fixed bus times; but every 30 mins isn't too bad. I can understand it when the public transportation options aren't great. But when they are readily available, why not use them. I've never really considered driving a desirable luxury in the current world; unless perhaps I had a chauffeur! It's a necessary and not particularly pleasant chore, and if I can avoid it, I will!
    - pm90 8y ago
      There are many reasons why Bus transportation in the US is usually terrible: * Lower classes i.e. poor tend to use the bus more, and in general the middle classes in the US avoid contact with this demographic group. * Infrequent routes means you have to plan your whole route in advance; if you miss your bus by a minute, you're whole days plan is fucked * Infrequent routes have the additional drawback of making you wait for long hours at the bus stop; more contact with said lower classes, more inconvenience etc. * Homeless folks tend to use the bus a lot, and they stink, and the whole bus will reek When I was in South Korea, I LOVED using their clean, on-time buses. They were an absolute breeze. But most American bus systems are pretty gross.
      - projektir 8y ago
        Using the bus in Seattle, can confirm. I'm still going to go for the bus in most cases, but it's not too infrequent that I have to surreptitiously dodge someone walking around with a beer bottle and shouting at people at the bus stop. I'm curious about South Korea, do they simply address homelessness better, or what's the reason for them not having this problem?
        pm90 8y ago
        There seems to be less inequality, or perhaps less poverty in SK. The streets are super clean and crime levels are very , very low, so you can see young school students walking around in their headphones late at night.
        goatlover 8y ago
        So typical big city problems don't have to exist, for the most part. Interesting.
rleigh 8y ago
I just don't get the huge-truck-owning mentality, even after reading about it. Unless it's serving its actual purpose of being a truck, it's a waste of a vast amount of money to purchase, and the poor fuel economy will cost a fortune to run as well. I'm sure they great to drive, with good riding position, powerful engine etc., but I don't understand why all the big negative factors of owning such a beast don't come into play more significantly. I know the USA has much lower fuel prices than here in the UK, but even so surely it's something to factor in? Also, it's a relatively recent-ish phenomenon even in the USA isn't it (i.e. marketed for lifestyle/personal use outside their original intended commercial purposes)? I was in the market for a new vehicle recently and went to test drive a few, even some bigger ones like the Nissan X-Trail. But even this had something like 60mpg fuel economy. The smaller stuff I tested was ~70mpg. I'll have to factor in the purchase cost, maintenance costs, fuel costs etc. They are all such significant expenses I couldn't afford not to. And I'll more than likely end up with an equivalent to the Ford Focus 1.6L I just sent to the scrapyard, because it's decent enough but affordable. Or a Transit Connect/Caddy minivan for moving all my biking gear around. I'd love a bigger and more luxurious car, but it's very hard to justify rationally. A truck would be way out of the question for both affordability and practicality. It's not really even there on the spectrum of desirability, and I think anyone who did get one would be roundly mocked for "compensating for something" and "not caring about the planet".
- dougmwne 8y ago
  Pickup trucks are a marketing success story. The missing links in your undstanding of this phenomenon are hours of commercials during your adolescence linking your masculinity to the truck and the judgement of your peer group of whether your vehicle is manly enough. That's why the bigger the better, why people lift the suspension to make them taller, why models with quieter engines secretly play engine revving sounds through the stereo, and why people hang fake testicles off the trailer hitch. When my friend bought his first car at 16, a compact sedan, everyone told him it was a college girl car. Poor guy.
  - Brakenshire 8y ago
    And what makes that possible is the difference in space. In Western Europe you just look like a massive knob making your life difficult squeezing through small lanes or into city parking spaces with your pointlessly oversized vehicle. But in a sprawling suburban or rural setting there are no such limits, and marketing can have its way.
martythemaniak 8y ago
Great link, that video really does pack quite a lot of cultural context in a short time. If you're not from the US and understand each second of that video, you'll understand quite a lot about other things that happen in America. I'm quite interested to see how Tesla's pickup truck does in this market. On one hand, it can be a total flop, because as you pointed out, huge swathes of this market exist because men need to acquire and exhibit their "masculinity" (as they understand the concept). Burning fuel and making noise seems to be one of the core components of this "masculinity". Coal Rollers simply take this to it's logical conclusion. On the other hand, maybe its other attributes (0-60 times, towing capacity, size, technology, price) can be sufficiently better to overwhelm this "burning fuel and making noise" aspect and become a well-selling truck. Maybe buying a ridiculous 6-seater, $80k+ EV pickup will be how you update this "masculinity" while distancing yourself form the coal rolling assholes.
- rsync 8y ago
  "I'm quite interested to see how Tesla's pickup truck does in this market." I wasn't aware that Tesla had a pickup truck in the pipeline... On the platform side, the skateboard chassis design and its low center of gravity along with AWD achieved with multiple engines, etc. - there's a lot to be excited about there. However, the UI/UX is getting weirder and weirder and I have a hard time imagining that serious workers/contractors/fleets are going to embrace a big touchscreen and no physical controls and no physical dials behind the wheel, etc. I think a much better outcome would be a Tesla licensee who could concentrate solely on the professional truck market.

by rsync 8y ago

jorblumesea 8y ago

This ad was specifically targeted towards rural communities which have poor public transit networks and where driving is a given. This doesn't represent the attitude of many Americans. Americans are pro transit in the cities. Not as much as Europe, but certainly not as bad as you make it out to be.

goatlover 8y ago
It all depends on the US city and what the public transportation options are. If it's mostly bus, then people will prefer to drive if they can.
- rleigh 8y ago
  What's the reason for that though? I used to have a 30 min bus ride to work and back. I could have driven, but was more hassle and required getting an expensive parking permit. The bus gave me 30 mins to read a book or newspaper, relax, use the free wifi and not have to deal with rush hour commuting traffic both ways. It was better in all aspects except the fixed bus times; but every 30 mins isn't too bad. I can understand it when the public transportation options aren't great. But when they are readily available, why not use them. I've never really considered driving a desirable luxury in the current world; unless perhaps I had a chauffeur! It's a necessary and not particularly pleasant chore, and if I can avoid it, I will!
  - pm90 8y ago
    There are many reasons why Bus transportation in the US is usually terrible: * Lower classes i.e. poor tend to use the bus more, and in general the middle classes in the US avoid contact with this demographic group. * Infrequent routes means you have to plan your whole route in advance; if you miss your bus by a minute, you're whole days plan is fucked * Infrequent routes have the additional drawback of making you wait for long hours at the bus stop; more contact with said lower classes, more inconvenience etc. * Homeless folks tend to use the bus a lot, and they stink, and the whole bus will reek When I was in South Korea, I LOVED using their clean, on-time buses. They were an absolute breeze. But most American bus systems are pretty gross.
    - projektir 8y ago
      Using the bus in Seattle, can confirm. I'm still going to go for the bus in most cases, but it's not too infrequent that I have to surreptitiously dodge someone walking around with a beer bottle and shouting at people at the bus stop. I'm curious about South Korea, do they simply address homelessness better, or what's the reason for them not having this problem?
      - pm90 8y ago
        There seems to be less inequality, or perhaps less poverty in SK. The streets are super clean and crime levels are very , very low, so you can see young school students walking around in their headphones late at night.
        goatlover 8y ago
        So typical big city problems don't have to exist, for the most part. Interesting.

rleigh 8y ago

I just don't get the huge-truck-owning mentality, even after reading about it. Unless it's serving its actual purpose of being a truck, it's a waste of a vast amount of money to purchase, and the poor fuel economy will cost a fortune to run as well. I'm sure they great to drive, with good riding position, powerful engine etc., but I don't understand why all the big negative factors of owning such a beast don't come into play more significantly. I know the USA has much lower fuel prices than here in the UK, but even so surely it's something to factor in? Also, it's a relatively recent-ish phenomenon even in the USA isn't it (i.e. marketed for lifestyle/personal use outside their original intended commercial purposes)? I was in the market for a new vehicle recently and went to test drive a few, even some bigger ones like the Nissan X-Trail. But even this had something like 60mpg fuel economy. The smaller stuff I tested was ~70mpg. I'll have to factor in the purchase cost, maintenance costs, fuel costs etc. They are all such significant expenses I couldn't afford not to. And I'll more than likely end up with an equivalent to the Ford Focus 1.6L I just sent to the scrapyard, because it's decent enough but affordable. Or a Transit Connect/Caddy minivan for moving all my biking gear around. I'd love a bigger and more luxurious car, but it's very hard to justify rationally. A truck would be way out of the question for both affordability and practicality. It's not really even there on the spectrum of desirability, and I think anyone who did get one would be roundly mocked for "compensating for something" and "not caring about the planet".

dougmwne 8y ago
Pickup trucks are a marketing success story. The missing links in your undstanding of this phenomenon are hours of commercials during your adolescence linking your masculinity to the truck and the judgement of your peer group of whether your vehicle is manly enough. That's why the bigger the better, why people lift the suspension to make them taller, why models with quieter engines secretly play engine revving sounds through the stereo, and why people hang fake testicles off the trailer hitch. When my friend bought his first car at 16, a compact sedan, everyone told him it was a college girl car. Poor guy.
- Brakenshire 8y ago
  And what makes that possible is the difference in space. In Western Europe you just look like a massive knob making your life difficult squeezing through small lanes or into city parking spaces with your pointlessly oversized vehicle. But in a sprawling suburban or rural setting there are no such limits, and marketing can have its way.

martythemaniak 8y ago

Great link, that video really does pack quite a lot of cultural context in a short time. If you're not from the US and understand each second of that video, you'll understand quite a lot about other things that happen in America. I'm quite interested to see how Tesla's pickup truck does in this market. On one hand, it can be a total flop, because as you pointed out, huge swathes of this market exist because men need to acquire and exhibit their "masculinity" (as they understand the concept). Burning fuel and making noise seems to be one of the core components of this "masculinity". Coal Rollers simply take this to it's logical conclusion. On the other hand, maybe its other attributes (0-60 times, towing capacity, size, technology, price) can be sufficiently better to overwhelm this "burning fuel and making noise" aspect and become a well-selling truck. Maybe buying a ridiculous 6-seater, $80k+ EV pickup will be how you update this "masculinity" while distancing yourself form the coal rolling assholes.

rsync 8y ago
"I'm quite interested to see how Tesla's pickup truck does in this market." I wasn't aware that Tesla had a pickup truck in the pipeline... On the platform side, the skateboard chassis design and its low center of gravity along with AWD achieved with multiple engines, etc. - there's a lot to be excited about there. However, the UI/UX is getting weirder and weirder and I have a hard time imagining that serious workers/contractors/fleets are going to embrace a big touchscreen and no physical controls and no physical dials behind the wheel, etc. I think a much better outcome would be a Tesla licensee who could concentrate solely on the professional truck market.