4 ms·

Not sure if your use case includes automatic rendering (new/delete/mods) when the underlying data changes. If it can be done automagically (via unique id in th

Not sure if your use case includes automatic rendering (new/delete/mods) when the underlying data changes. If it can be done automagically (via unique id in the data) that is a big win (aka, code I do not have to write). Things like shadow DOM et al, are not something I want to implement or maintain.

TekMol 8y ago
When the user triggers a change of the underlying data, I do a roundtrip to the server and re-render the current page. I keep the time needed to do so under a second. My users regularely express how WOWed they are by the snappyness of my sites. I guess what other sites save on re-rendering html, they lose multiple times on bloated code.
- j_jochem 8y ago
  „Under a second“ might be ok for websites, but doesn’t cut the mustard for web applications. People expect highly dynamic user interfaces which react almost instantaneously.
  - TekMol 8y ago
    If all websites would react within a second to user actions, this would be heaven. But the reality is different: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18476247 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18476247 While 30s is off the chart, I see bloat that needs multiple seconds everywhere. The new Reddit, AirBnB, the various Google tools etc etc.
- Illniyar 8y ago
  That literally means that you aren't doing SPAs. If you aren't doing SPA then yes using React or Vue is rather a waste. However the majority of sites these days use some form of SPAs. Also under a second is a very low bar to strive to. a fast round trip to the server is 100ms. A reasonable one is somewhere around 300ms. Displaying effects to changes is often under a millisecond in SPAs and is basically impossible to reach in Multi page applications.
  - GordonS 8y ago
    > However the majority of sites these days use some form of SPAs Do you have a reference for that claim? I very much doubt you are correct, but I'd be interested in seeing some stats either way, if they exist.
    - halfjoking 8y ago
      The claim might be true among YC companies or even startups... but the majority of websites by far don't use React/Vue: https://w3techs.com/technologies/history_overview/javascript_library/all https://w3techs.com/technologies/history_overview/javascript... I'm not saying that React/Vue aren't important and drastically changing what's thought of as best-practices in web development... but just because everyone on HN uses a front-end framework for their websites doesn't mean "all websites" do it.
      - GordonS 8y ago
        Thanks, these are exactly the kind of numbers I was looking for!
  - gbuk2013 8y ago
    > If you aren't doing SPA then yes using React or Vue is rather a waste. I disagree, based on my experience of writing a reasonably complex non-SPA application which very much benefits from Vue. I also think the fact that Vue Router ships as a separate app further suggests SPA is just one use case.

TekMol 8y ago

When the user triggers a change of the underlying data, I do a roundtrip to the server and re-render the current page. I keep the time needed to do so under a second. My users regularely express how WOWed they are by the snappyness of my sites. I guess what other sites save on re-rendering html, they lose multiple times on bloated code.

j_jochem 8y ago
„Under a second“ might be ok for websites, but doesn’t cut the mustard for web applications. People expect highly dynamic user interfaces which react almost instantaneously.
- TekMol 8y ago
  If all websites would react within a second to user actions, this would be heaven. But the reality is different: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18476247 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18476247 While 30s is off the chart, I see bloat that needs multiple seconds everywhere. The new Reddit, AirBnB, the various Google tools etc etc.
Illniyar 8y ago
That literally means that you aren't doing SPAs. If you aren't doing SPA then yes using React or Vue is rather a waste. However the majority of sites these days use some form of SPAs. Also under a second is a very low bar to strive to. a fast round trip to the server is 100ms. A reasonable one is somewhere around 300ms. Displaying effects to changes is often under a millisecond in SPAs and is basically impossible to reach in Multi page applications.
- GordonS 8y ago
  > However the majority of sites these days use some form of SPAs Do you have a reference for that claim? I very much doubt you are correct, but I'd be interested in seeing some stats either way, if they exist.
  - halfjoking 8y ago
    The claim might be true among YC companies or even startups... but the majority of websites by far don't use React/Vue: https://w3techs.com/technologies/history_overview/javascript_library/all https://w3techs.com/technologies/history_overview/javascript... I'm not saying that React/Vue aren't important and drastically changing what's thought of as best-practices in web development... but just because everyone on HN uses a front-end framework for their websites doesn't mean "all websites" do it.
    - GordonS 8y ago
      Thanks, these are exactly the kind of numbers I was looking for!
- gbuk2013 8y ago
  > If you aren't doing SPA then yes using React or Vue is rather a waste. I disagree, based on my experience of writing a reasonably complex non-SPA application which very much benefits from Vue. I also think the fact that Vue Router ships as a separate app further suggests SPA is just one use case.