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I'm more surprised by the fact that no Python is installed by default on a Red Hat distribution https://access.redhat.com/documentation/en-us/red_hat_enterpris

I'm more surprised by the fact that no Python is installed by default on a Red Hat distribution https://access.redhat.com/documentation/en-us/red_hat_enterprise_linux/8-beta/html-single/8.0_beta_release_notes/#web_servers_databases_dynamic_languages https://access.redhat.com/documentation/en-us/red_hat_enterp...

kbenson 8y ago
I think Perl and Python were only ever installed by default because there were management utilities (GUI and console) written in them, so they were prerequisites for what was considered a minimal system. RHEL has been pretty good the last few years at paring down the base minimal install to actual essentials. I view getting to the point that Python is not required for a base install an achievement.
- pjmlp 8y ago
  Me as well, since someone had the clever idea to create GUI distribution management tools in Python, it is a pain to use them, given how slow some of them are.
  - mixmastamyk 8y ago
    It's unlikely Python is to blame for that, unless they implemented something very CPU bound in it. I wrote wxPython apps in 2000 or so and they were very responsive.
    - pjmlp 8y ago
      Well the previous generations written in C used to perform quite well.
    - eikenberry 8y ago
      It is likely a combo of Python + someone not good at using Python with networking. When working with anything that talks a lot over networks you need to use threads or separate processes to keep things feeling responsive during network delays. Python doesn't make this easy, so lots of devs skip it and it makes the programs feel sluggish.
      - mixmastamyk 8y ago
        Hmm, that might make sense on a server, but this is talking about a GUI client. Also, Python has trouble with CPU-bound threads but not those IO-bound.
rwmj 8y ago
A huge amount of work was done to minimize the base set of packages (called "BaseOS"). Including rewriting parts of dnf from Python to C++.
robohoe 8y ago
Wasn't python required for YUM to function correctly? Or has DNF been written in something other than python?
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
- awill 8y ago
  yes. https://rpm-software-management.github.io/page4/ https://rpm-software-management.github.io/page4/ (some of the specific posts seem to be unavilable)
- recentdarkness 8y ago
  Platform python see comment above
recentdarkness 8y ago
Actually there is a default python and it’s called platform python. That one lives on purpose in /usr/libexec however is mainly supposed to be used by platform tooling like dnf/yum etc

kbenson 8y ago

I think Perl and Python were only ever installed by default because there were management utilities (GUI and console) written in them, so they were prerequisites for what was considered a minimal system. RHEL has been pretty good the last few years at paring down the base minimal install to actual essentials. I view getting to the point that Python is not required for a base install an achievement.

pjmlp 8y ago
Me as well, since someone had the clever idea to create GUI distribution management tools in Python, it is a pain to use them, given how slow some of them are.
- mixmastamyk 8y ago
  It's unlikely Python is to blame for that, unless they implemented something very CPU bound in it. I wrote wxPython apps in 2000 or so and they were very responsive.
  - pjmlp 8y ago
    Well the previous generations written in C used to perform quite well.
  - eikenberry 8y ago
    It is likely a combo of Python + someone not good at using Python with networking. When working with anything that talks a lot over networks you need to use threads or separate processes to keep things feeling responsive during network delays. Python doesn't make this easy, so lots of devs skip it and it makes the programs feel sluggish.
    - mixmastamyk 8y ago
      Hmm, that might make sense on a server, but this is talking about a GUI client. Also, Python has trouble with CPU-bound threads but not those IO-bound.

rwmj 8y ago

A huge amount of work was done to minimize the base set of packages (called "BaseOS"). Including rewriting parts of dnf from Python to C++.

robohoe 8y ago

Wasn't python required for YUM to function correctly? Or has DNF been written in something other than python?

deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
awill 8y ago
yes. https://rpm-software-management.github.io/page4/ https://rpm-software-management.github.io/page4/ (some of the specific posts seem to be unavilable)
recentdarkness 8y ago
Platform python see comment above

recentdarkness 8y ago

Actually there is a default python and it’s called platform python. That one lives on purpose in /usr/libexec however is mainly supposed to be used by platform tooling like dnf/yum etc