3 ms·

Yes, but it's quite probable that (as Mvandenbergh claims) there is no way to make the equipment 100% safe. It occasionally fails. Humans have a response time

by x0x0 8y ago

Yes, but it's quite probable that (as Mvandenbergh claims) there is no way to make the equipment 100% safe. It occasionally fails. Humans have a response time. People make mistakes. Homeowners shriek if you cut their electricity off preventively. PG&E has 81k miles of overhead power lines and 26k miles of underground distribution lines. How can you operate a system where one screwup -- one decaying tree too close to a line, or one underground construction mistake -- anywhere in 100k miles of power lines can create a $15B bill? [1] http://www.pgecurrents.com/2017/10/31/facts-about-undergrounding-electric-lines/ http://www.pgecurrents.com/2017/10/31/facts-about-undergroun...

sgc 8y ago
PG&E is a joke.They have done next to nothing to mitigate risks in extremely high risk areas for decades. Of course you can't get to zero risk, but it is right to push heavy responsibility on them until they up there game to remotely modern standards. If their corporate culture can't handle it, then they should be absorbed into one that can.
onetimemanytime 8y ago
Insurance (expensive and a pain as they'll be checking on you but...) Honestly, if you cause economic harm, the minimum is that you should pay for it. People lost everything in these fires and insurance companies will pay but then sue the other person /entity responsible.
- conanbatt 8y ago
  Is the consumer responsible in this world of always finding someone to foot a bill for a disaster?
amluto 8y ago
With new technology? I see no inherent reason that a downed power line needs to cause several giant arcs. I don’t know exactly how big an arc is needed to start a fire, but ISTM it should be possible to make line-to-ground faults only arc a tiny bit and line-to-line faults make much smaller arcs. CA has a big head start here over the rest of the country: in CA, utilities cannot have current-carrying wires that are grounded at multiple points. That practice is widespread elsewhere and is rather dangerous for several reasons. And I think it would interfere with several potential technologies to reduce arcs. (I don’t really know, but I assume CA’s rule is related to the dairy industry. Utility-induced ground current turns out to be hazardous to cows being milked with metallic equipment.)
- Johnny555 8y ago
  I don’t know exactly how big an arc is needed to start a fire Not very big, sparks coming off a tow chain dragging behind a vehicle can start a fire. http://www.fox13news.com/news/local-news/officer-shows-how-small-spark-can-become-wildfire http://www.fox13news.com/news/local-news/officer-shows-how-s...
njarboe 8y ago
PG&E is now cutting off power preventively and homeowners should complain about it. Making everyone buy a generator for their house is not very cost effective and symptom of system collapse, but if they are going to get a $15B bill because of poor forest/land management by other entities, that's what they will need to do. Maybe this situation will progress like the toxic waste disposal business. Break down PG&E into small utility companies so that when the $15B bill comes due the $100 million company just disappears and someone else picks up the tab.

by x0x0 8y ago

sgc 8y ago

PG&E is a joke.They have done next to nothing to mitigate risks in extremely high risk areas for decades. Of course you can't get to zero risk, but it is right to push heavy responsibility on them until they up there game to remotely modern standards. If their corporate culture can't handle it, then they should be absorbed into one that can.

onetimemanytime 8y ago

Insurance (expensive and a pain as they'll be checking on you but...) Honestly, if you cause economic harm, the minimum is that you should pay for it. People lost everything in these fires and insurance companies will pay but then sue the other person /entity responsible.

conanbatt 8y ago
Is the consumer responsible in this world of always finding someone to foot a bill for a disaster?

amluto 8y ago

With new technology? I see no inherent reason that a downed power line needs to cause several giant arcs. I don’t know exactly how big an arc is needed to start a fire, but ISTM it should be possible to make line-to-ground faults only arc a tiny bit and line-to-line faults make much smaller arcs. CA has a big head start here over the rest of the country: in CA, utilities cannot have current-carrying wires that are grounded at multiple points. That practice is widespread elsewhere and is rather dangerous for several reasons. And I think it would interfere with several potential technologies to reduce arcs. (I don’t really know, but I assume CA’s rule is related to the dairy industry. Utility-induced ground current turns out to be hazardous to cows being milked with metallic equipment.)

Johnny555 8y ago
I don’t know exactly how big an arc is needed to start a fire Not very big, sparks coming off a tow chain dragging behind a vehicle can start a fire. http://www.fox13news.com/news/local-news/officer-shows-how-small-spark-can-become-wildfire http://www.fox13news.com/news/local-news/officer-shows-how-s...

njarboe 8y ago

PG&E is now cutting off power preventively and homeowners should complain about it. Making everyone buy a generator for their house is not very cost effective and symptom of system collapse, but if they are going to get a $15B bill because of poor forest/land management by other entities, that's what they will need to do. Maybe this situation will progress like the toxic waste disposal business. Break down PG&E into small utility companies so that when the $15B bill comes due the $100 million company just disappears and someone else picks up the tab.