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That anyone would be shocked that packaged crap like Ramen has health risks is sad. This is not food. Of course it's going to kill you. I always hope that wh

That anyone would be shocked that packaged crap like Ramen has health risks is sad. This is not food. Of course it's going to kill you. I always hope that when startups say "eating ramen" that they mean it symbolically, in that they are being frugal. Eating crap like this is just dumb.

PStamatiou 16y ago
Eating crap like this is just dumb. Well said. The last time I ate ramen without thinking of the health risks was my freshman year in college when people in my dorm hall would group-buy it by the crate. That was some 5 years ago. Haven't touched that junk since. I'm frugal on things in my apartment, furniture, and all of that, but I don't skimp on what I put in my body. I always look forward to my Sunday afternoon trips to Trader Joes and/or Whole Foods. The latter is pricey but they have some good cuts of meat.
- larrywright 16y ago
  I'm frugal on things in my apartment, furniture, and all of that, but I don't skimp on what I put in my body. That's an excellent attitude. Too many people take the opposite approach.
  - araneae 16y ago
    I take the opposite approach. Why should I spend $10/lb on tenderloin beef when I can get tip steak for $3.50/lb? It goes in one end and out the other. At least a good office chair will last you years and possibly even save you back issues.
jambo 16y ago
I hope so too. pg put a footnote on his essay saying basically, don't eat just ramen with a recipe for beans & rice. http://www.paulgraham.com/ramenprofitable.html#f1n http://www.paulgraham.com/ramenprofitable.html#f1n
- araneae 16y ago
  The kids in South American countries that subsist only on beans and rice are malnourished. It's better, but don't forget the vegetables.
dekayed 16y ago
A friend of mine has said that he thinks the biggest problem in the US is that food is cheap. It is really that food that is bad for you is cheap and food that is good for you is expensive. Cheap + full usually wins against expensive + hungry with most people.
- silentbicycle 16y ago
  Mostly true, but it's more complicated than that - beans, garlic, and kale are cheap, for example. So is oatmeal. The cheap-but-nutritious ingredients take a bit of preparation, though, and generally aren't eaten as a single-ingredient convenience food. Don't get me wrong, though - there's definitely a lot of artificially cheap, nutritionally barren food.
- GHFigs 16y ago
  Convenience is another factor. Unless you live adjacent to a grocery store, you are almost always nearer to a source of junk food in the form of a convenience store or fast food restaurant. Neither are likely to be cheaper than what one can make easily from generally healthful ingredients. (Cheap comes into play e.g. with chain sit-down restaurants, who get around the problem of having mediocre food by serving it in comically huge portions slathered in some unhealthy flavorizing agent like butter or Ranch dressing. They can probably beat anything you can make at home in terms of price per calorie. The meal doesn't actually get cheaper, meanwhile the impact on your health is worse because you're buying a whole lot of calories you don't need.) In poor communities I've seen it's sometimes the case that shopping at an actual grocery store can be a two or three hour round trip due to bus schedules while the corner store is a five minute walk. Both also profit immensely from the wealthier car culture: fast food could not be what it is today without the drive-through window and people's eagerness to consume meals in their cars, and the typical convenience store is a convenient source of food because it also happens to sell gas, which every driver needs. Both allow the consumer to trade away money and health for immediate satiation.
  - silentbicycle 16y ago
    > In poor communities I've seen it's sometimes the case that shopping at an actual grocery store can be a two or three hour round trip due to bus schedules while the corner store is a five minute walk. These are usually called "food deserts".
araneae 16y ago
Some of us put vegetables and eggs in our ramen. Ramen in its true form is not just the noodles.
- silentbicycle 16y ago
  Right, but frying the noodles into a brick with palm kernel oil doesn't help. On the other hand, udon noodles are quite good. You need to refrigerate them, though - there's actually something left to spoil. Try them with egg, miso, green onion, and shredded carrots.
  - araneae 16y ago
    Spoilage has nothing to do with what's "left to spoil." Cooked ramen noodles will spoil just as readily as udon. Bacteria need moisture to grow. Udon is sometimes sold fresh (wet), and that will spoil. Dry udon does not spoil. As for palm oil... udon is also made with it.
- umjames 16y ago
  Agreed. If you've ever had ramen at a good Japanese restaurant (or better yet, in Japan), you know that what most Americans consider ramen does not compare. Udon and soba noodles are good too. The difference is mainly what accompanies the noodles (vegetables and broth).

PStamatiou 16y ago

Eating crap like this is just dumb. Well said. The last time I ate ramen without thinking of the health risks was my freshman year in college when people in my dorm hall would group-buy it by the crate. That was some 5 years ago. Haven't touched that junk since. I'm frugal on things in my apartment, furniture, and all of that, but I don't skimp on what I put in my body. I always look forward to my Sunday afternoon trips to Trader Joes and/or Whole Foods. The latter is pricey but they have some good cuts of meat.

larrywright 16y ago
I'm frugal on things in my apartment, furniture, and all of that, but I don't skimp on what I put in my body. That's an excellent attitude. Too many people take the opposite approach.
- araneae 16y ago
  I take the opposite approach. Why should I spend $10/lb on tenderloin beef when I can get tip steak for $3.50/lb? It goes in one end and out the other. At least a good office chair will last you years and possibly even save you back issues.

jambo 16y ago

I hope so too. pg put a footnote on his essay saying basically, don't eat just ramen with a recipe for beans & rice. http://www.paulgraham.com/ramenprofitable.html#f1n http://www.paulgraham.com/ramenprofitable.html#f1n

araneae 16y ago
The kids in South American countries that subsist only on beans and rice are malnourished. It's better, but don't forget the vegetables.

dekayed 16y ago

A friend of mine has said that he thinks the biggest problem in the US is that food is cheap. It is really that food that is bad for you is cheap and food that is good for you is expensive. Cheap + full usually wins against expensive + hungry with most people.

silentbicycle 16y ago
Mostly true, but it's more complicated than that - beans, garlic, and kale are cheap, for example. So is oatmeal. The cheap-but-nutritious ingredients take a bit of preparation, though, and generally aren't eaten as a single-ingredient convenience food. Don't get me wrong, though - there's definitely a lot of artificially cheap, nutritionally barren food.
GHFigs 16y ago
Convenience is another factor. Unless you live adjacent to a grocery store, you are almost always nearer to a source of junk food in the form of a convenience store or fast food restaurant. Neither are likely to be cheaper than what one can make easily from generally healthful ingredients. (Cheap comes into play e.g. with chain sit-down restaurants, who get around the problem of having mediocre food by serving it in comically huge portions slathered in some unhealthy flavorizing agent like butter or Ranch dressing. They can probably beat anything you can make at home in terms of price per calorie. The meal doesn't actually get cheaper, meanwhile the impact on your health is worse because you're buying a whole lot of calories you don't need.) In poor communities I've seen it's sometimes the case that shopping at an actual grocery store can be a two or three hour round trip due to bus schedules while the corner store is a five minute walk. Both also profit immensely from the wealthier car culture: fast food could not be what it is today without the drive-through window and people's eagerness to consume meals in their cars, and the typical convenience store is a convenient source of food because it also happens to sell gas, which every driver needs. Both allow the consumer to trade away money and health for immediate satiation.
- silentbicycle 16y ago
  > In poor communities I've seen it's sometimes the case that shopping at an actual grocery store can be a two or three hour round trip due to bus schedules while the corner store is a five minute walk. These are usually called "food deserts".

araneae 16y ago

Some of us put vegetables and eggs in our ramen. Ramen in its true form is not just the noodles.

silentbicycle 16y ago
Right, but frying the noodles into a brick with palm kernel oil doesn't help. On the other hand, udon noodles are quite good. You need to refrigerate them, though - there's actually something left to spoil. Try them with egg, miso, green onion, and shredded carrots.
- araneae 16y ago
  Spoilage has nothing to do with what's "left to spoil." Cooked ramen noodles will spoil just as readily as udon. Bacteria need moisture to grow. Udon is sometimes sold fresh (wet), and that will spoil. Dry udon does not spoil. As for palm oil... udon is also made with it.
umjames 16y ago
Agreed. If you've ever had ramen at a good Japanese restaurant (or better yet, in Japan), you know that what most Americans consider ramen does not compare. Udon and soba noodles are good too. The difference is mainly what accompanies the noodles (vegetables and broth).