14 ms·

The Social Security Number wasn't created for census purposes, nor was it ever meant (and still isn't) to be fraud-proof. It was created, for _Social Security_

by laken 8y ago

The Social Security Number wasn't created for census purposes, nor was it ever meant (and still isn't) to be fraud-proof. It was created, for _Social Security_ benefits. It wasn't meant to be truly secure, as the worst you can do with someone else's Social Security Number with the Social Security Administration is paying more into their Social Security account. It is true the IRS used it for their own purposes too, and thus broke the original purpose, but it'd be ridiculous to make the Social Security card more secure and turn it into a national ID because of that. In most government applications anyway, your driver's license number has taken the place of the SSN. Your SSN isn't supposed to be sensitive. Furthermore, it sounds like you're advocating for the creation of a "National ID" of sorts, which is quite the slippery slope.

lgregg 8y ago
I think everyone should have easy and free access to personal identification that is valid for voting, air travel, opening a bank account, etc. I don't think it should be mandatory. I think if the government is going to require it, they should provide it. I'm confidant that the census bureau created those numbers which was soon taken over by SSA or for SSA. That also isn't really the point I'm trying to make which is becoming a tangent.
- poulsbohemian 8y ago
  A passport / passport card comes pretty close to your stated goal.
  - lgregg 8y ago
    Far as I know, a passport card does exactly what I want it to do except be free. There are people that are at the poverty level or below, and some right above the cut-off, who can't afford $100+ dollars in fees.
    - laken 8y ago
      In most states, all state-issued IDs (State IDs, Learner's Permits, Driver Licenses) meet all the requirements to vote, travel by air, etc. as they follow the "REAL ID" act. Many states also have an assistance program for people below the poverty line for them. California though is one of the particular lagging states in this area, as they are opposed to the REAL ID act, among several other states. REAL ID is basically standardized state IDs to allow the things you wanted. Yes, it's not free, but most people have one already anyway (if they drive).
      - lgregg 8y ago
        I wasn't aware of the assistance programs. I'll have to look that up and see if my state has that and pass along that info, if the service is available.
        laken 8y ago
        It just so happened that I had to replace my driver's license (I'm in Florida) today, which now uses REAL ID. The fee is $25 for a new license, which I was somewhat surprised at, and believe to be rather reasonable (though it is probably unreasonable for many below the poverty line still). Furthermore, it appears that if someone is on SSI benefits, they get a significant discount. It depends on the state level through what kind of discounts are available of course. I also know in Florida there are several homeless assistance non-profits who will pay and assist with getting photo IDs for the homeless, and with the fee being only $25, it seems relatively "cheap" as a method of helping someone who is homeless; it'd be hard to find a better return on investment with $25 to help assist the homeless to take the steps needed to get themselves off the street. I recall when I first got my license paying more than $40, so I was very happy to see the lower price.
    - poulsbohemian 8y ago
      I've got mixed feelings on this as well. It feels like a passport should be a service received on the basis of being a citizen, but I also accept that ~$100 is a nominal processing fee and that government doesn't offer any services for free. As another poster pointed out, it's still cheaper overall than the cost of a driver's license, which potentially brings with it the cost of training, insurance, not to mention an actual vehicle and its costs assuming that was the reason for getting a license in the first place.

by laken 8y ago

lgregg 8y ago

I think everyone should have easy and free access to personal identification that is valid for voting, air travel, opening a bank account, etc. I don't think it should be mandatory. I think if the government is going to require it, they should provide it. I'm confidant that the census bureau created those numbers which was soon taken over by SSA or for SSA. That also isn't really the point I'm trying to make which is becoming a tangent.

poulsbohemian 8y ago
A passport / passport card comes pretty close to your stated goal.
- lgregg 8y ago
  Far as I know, a passport card does exactly what I want it to do except be free. There are people that are at the poverty level or below, and some right above the cut-off, who can't afford $100+ dollars in fees.
  - laken 8y ago
    In most states, all state-issued IDs (State IDs, Learner's Permits, Driver Licenses) meet all the requirements to vote, travel by air, etc. as they follow the "REAL ID" act. Many states also have an assistance program for people below the poverty line for them. California though is one of the particular lagging states in this area, as they are opposed to the REAL ID act, among several other states. REAL ID is basically standardized state IDs to allow the things you wanted. Yes, it's not free, but most people have one already anyway (if they drive).
    - lgregg 8y ago
      I wasn't aware of the assistance programs. I'll have to look that up and see if my state has that and pass along that info, if the service is available.
      - laken 8y ago
        It just so happened that I had to replace my driver's license (I'm in Florida) today, which now uses REAL ID. The fee is $25 for a new license, which I was somewhat surprised at, and believe to be rather reasonable (though it is probably unreasonable for many below the poverty line still). Furthermore, it appears that if someone is on SSI benefits, they get a significant discount. It depends on the state level through what kind of discounts are available of course. I also know in Florida there are several homeless assistance non-profits who will pay and assist with getting photo IDs for the homeless, and with the fee being only $25, it seems relatively "cheap" as a method of helping someone who is homeless; it'd be hard to find a better return on investment with $25 to help assist the homeless to take the steps needed to get themselves off the street. I recall when I first got my license paying more than $40, so I was very happy to see the lower price.
  - poulsbohemian 8y ago
    I've got mixed feelings on this as well. It feels like a passport should be a service received on the basis of being a citizen, but I also accept that ~$100 is a nominal processing fee and that government doesn't offer any services for free. As another poster pointed out, it's still cheaper overall than the cost of a driver's license, which potentially brings with it the cost of training, insurance, not to mention an actual vehicle and its costs assuming that was the reason for getting a license in the first place.