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As a New Yorker, I am super disappointed that they chose Long Island City. There were contenders where this stimulus could have been a paradigm shift. Instead,

As a New Yorker, I am super disappointed that they chose Long Island City. There were contenders where this stimulus could have been a paradigm shift. Instead, it's just a drop in the bucket for a city that is already growing recklessly. My vote was for Newark, personally. Plenty of office space; access to NJIT, Rutgers, and Princeton; and good public transit that connects directly into NYC. Bezos and co. could have done some real good, but instead they will just be contributing to New York's biggest gripes (unsustainable subways, housing shortages, and an aggregation of labor into a few metropolitan areas).

notyourwork 8y ago
Seattle residents send their condolences.
patrickmay 8y ago
I was really hoping for Raleigh and/or Dallas. Instead, Amazon picked two places where the cost of living is worse than Seattle.
- tjbarkley 8y ago
  Yeah, but some of the CEO's houses are in these two areas.
- amyjess 8y ago
  As a Dallasite, I've been hoping we won't get it because it would send our housing prices through the stratosphere and ruin traffic for a generation. From what I've seen, the reaction to this news on /r/Dallas is very positive. We don't want Amazon here. (Though I figured it was going to be NoVa from the start. I was just terrified I'd be wrong.)
- akhilcacharya 8y ago
  I'm from Raleigh but I"m not convinced Raleigh-area schools have the talent required and willing.
  - electricslpnsld 8y ago
    The Triangle has a number of good schools: Duke and UNC are both in the top 25 CS programs in the US. I've worked with some NCSU CS grads in the past and they've also been great.
    - akhilcacharya 8y ago
      Duke and UNC are tiny CS programs. I went to NC State, and it's definitely not in the same tier for undergrad.
melling 8y ago
I was hoping for Newark too. They already have employees there. Perhaps they’ll eventually expand their offices. Let’s get the NJ Path to the airport (3 miles) and the 7 Subway to NJ then Newark, Jersey City become boroughs of NYC. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/7_Subway_Extension https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/7_Subway_Extension Currently, it looks like an hour from Newark Penn to Long Island City. Path to 1,2,3 Lines...
JumpCrisscross 8y ago
> I am super disappointed that they chose Long Island City Edward Glaeser's research on the economic and social benefits from density, summarized in Triumph of the City [1] and referenced in this guy's videos [2][3], is worth reviewing. Long story short, agglomeration breeds efficiencies which lead to further agglomeration. New York can uniquely offer things other cities can't because of its density. A few thousand people moving to Newark (assuming they're willing to move to Newark) won't bring those benefits there. Over centuries, despite population growth and political upheavals, the relative size of cities in almost every geographic region is remarkably stable. That hints at deeper mechanisms which can't be unseated by something as small as Amazon moving. Better policy: give people in Newark the support they need to move to wherever they like, whether that still be in Newark or somewhere else. [1] https://www.nytimes.com/2011/02/13/books/review/Silver-t.html https://www.nytimes.com/2011/02/13/books/review/Silver-t.htm... [2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3PWWtqfwacQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3PWWtqfwacQ [3] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IvAvHjYoLUU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IvAvHjYoLUU
- schnevets 8y ago
  Triumph of the City sounds like something right up my alley. I'll have to add it to my reading list. Thanks
  - dionidium 8y ago
    I've read a handful of books on this subject -- it's a popular one, right now -- and Triumph of the City is my favorite so far.
- claydavisss 8y ago
  If this were necessarily true - that all industries would naturally gravitate to the regions of highest density - then why is so much of the banking industry now in North Carolina?
  - JumpCrisscross 8y ago
    > all industries would naturally gravitate to the regions of highest density I used a bit of shorthand, above, in saying "the relative size of cities in almost every geographic region is remarkably stable." Let me expand on "geographic region," because it reveals the tension that keeps the world from collapsing into Chongqing [1]. The size of a "geographic region" for this purpose is best defined as the distance the average economically-productive person can commute in a day. Back when people walked, towns tended to be about 10 miles apart. As transport technology improved, Manhattan ate its neighboring boroughs. It is now consuming Northern New Jersey and Connecticut. Barring a quantum leap in transportation tech, Charlotte is safe. (On the seeds for dispersion: Certain economic activities, like mining and agriculture, occur somewhat independently of population centers. You go where the mineral veins and fertile land are. The fruits of those activities navigate the transportation geography, navigable waterways, flat areas across which rail lines can network and natural harbors, their wealth concentrating at the hubs. Thus, a fundamental industrial tension between distributed economic activity and the concentrating effects of transportation emerges. In the modern world, those industrial distribution factors remain. Added to them are activities that are cheaper away from population centers, e.g. large-scale manufacturing and nuclear-power generation. Nevertheless, technology so far appears to be increasing the concentrating factor faster than the dispersion term by making (a) the distributed economic activities less labor-intensive and (b) increasing profits to those organizing our social structures-whether in finance, logistics or government–who benefit from the chance encounters proximity promotes.) [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_largest_cities https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_largest_cities
merolish 8y ago
Newark would be a painful commute for anyone wanting to live in the boroughs, LI, or Westchester/CT, i.e. a ton of people. I do hope NYC deals with its growing pains -- I finally left last year, in part because of rising costs and aggravation.
- schnevets 8y ago
  After a decade in the city, I'll be moving to Westchester at the end of the year. When a "45 minute" subway commute started taking well over an hour and there's no possibility of owning your home, an hour on Metro North started looking a lot more viable.
notyourday 8y ago
I'm absolutely baffled why they did not select Newark as well. It is close enough to NYC via not only Amtrak and NJT but also via PATH, ripe for redevelopment ( already in progress ) but not yet so developed that the additional infrastructure is nearly impossible to add. Adding a subway line to NYC subway is like herding a multiple feral cat colonies.
epc 8y ago
I suspect the utter inability of the region to solve the Portal Bridge and Hudson River Tunnels problem doomed Newark.
murph-almighty 8y ago
I'm kind of relieved I wasn't the only pro-Newark HN reader (though I am based in central NJ so I'll admit bias). I honestly think it's close enough to the city for it to work as an "NY" office, rent is cheaper and home ownership isn't a pipe dream, and it's close to an Amtrak stop that would allow quick access to the DC HQ!

notyourwork 8y ago

Seattle residents send their condolences.

patrickmay 8y ago

I was really hoping for Raleigh and/or Dallas. Instead, Amazon picked two places where the cost of living is worse than Seattle.

tjbarkley 8y ago
Yeah, but some of the CEO's houses are in these two areas.
amyjess 8y ago
As a Dallasite, I've been hoping we won't get it because it would send our housing prices through the stratosphere and ruin traffic for a generation. From what I've seen, the reaction to this news on /r/Dallas is very positive. We don't want Amazon here. (Though I figured it was going to be NoVa from the start. I was just terrified I'd be wrong.)
akhilcacharya 8y ago
I'm from Raleigh but I"m not convinced Raleigh-area schools have the talent required and willing.
- electricslpnsld 8y ago
  The Triangle has a number of good schools: Duke and UNC are both in the top 25 CS programs in the US. I've worked with some NCSU CS grads in the past and they've also been great.
  - akhilcacharya 8y ago
    Duke and UNC are tiny CS programs. I went to NC State, and it's definitely not in the same tier for undergrad.

melling 8y ago

I was hoping for Newark too. They already have employees there. Perhaps they’ll eventually expand their offices. Let’s get the NJ Path to the airport (3 miles) and the 7 Subway to NJ then Newark, Jersey City become boroughs of NYC. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/7_Subway_Extension https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/7_Subway_Extension Currently, it looks like an hour from Newark Penn to Long Island City. Path to 1,2,3 Lines...

JumpCrisscross 8y ago

> I am super disappointed that they chose Long Island City Edward Glaeser's research on the economic and social benefits from density, summarized in Triumph of the City [1] and referenced in this guy's videos [2][3], is worth reviewing. Long story short, agglomeration breeds efficiencies which lead to further agglomeration. New York can uniquely offer things other cities can't because of its density. A few thousand people moving to Newark (assuming they're willing to move to Newark) won't bring those benefits there. Over centuries, despite population growth and political upheavals, the relative size of cities in almost every geographic region is remarkably stable. That hints at deeper mechanisms which can't be unseated by something as small as Amazon moving. Better policy: give people in Newark the support they need to move to wherever they like, whether that still be in Newark or somewhere else. [1] https://www.nytimes.com/2011/02/13/books/review/Silver-t.html https://www.nytimes.com/2011/02/13/books/review/Silver-t.htm... [2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3PWWtqfwacQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3PWWtqfwacQ [3] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IvAvHjYoLUU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IvAvHjYoLUU

schnevets 8y ago
Triumph of the City sounds like something right up my alley. I'll have to add it to my reading list. Thanks
- dionidium 8y ago
  I've read a handful of books on this subject -- it's a popular one, right now -- and Triumph of the City is my favorite so far.
claydavisss 8y ago
If this were necessarily true - that all industries would naturally gravitate to the regions of highest density - then why is so much of the banking industry now in North Carolina?
- JumpCrisscross 8y ago
  > all industries would naturally gravitate to the regions of highest density I used a bit of shorthand, above, in saying "the relative size of cities in almost every geographic region is remarkably stable." Let me expand on "geographic region," because it reveals the tension that keeps the world from collapsing into Chongqing [1]. The size of a "geographic region" for this purpose is best defined as the distance the average economically-productive person can commute in a day. Back when people walked, towns tended to be about 10 miles apart. As transport technology improved, Manhattan ate its neighboring boroughs. It is now consuming Northern New Jersey and Connecticut. Barring a quantum leap in transportation tech, Charlotte is safe. (On the seeds for dispersion: Certain economic activities, like mining and agriculture, occur somewhat independently of population centers. You go where the mineral veins and fertile land are. The fruits of those activities navigate the transportation geography, navigable waterways, flat areas across which rail lines can network and natural harbors, their wealth concentrating at the hubs. Thus, a fundamental industrial tension between distributed economic activity and the concentrating effects of transportation emerges. In the modern world, those industrial distribution factors remain. Added to them are activities that are cheaper away from population centers, e.g. large-scale manufacturing and nuclear-power generation. Nevertheless, technology so far appears to be increasing the concentrating factor faster than the dispersion term by making (a) the distributed economic activities less labor-intensive and (b) increasing profits to those organizing our social structures-whether in finance, logistics or government–who benefit from the chance encounters proximity promotes.) [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_largest_cities https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_largest_cities

merolish 8y ago

Newark would be a painful commute for anyone wanting to live in the boroughs, LI, or Westchester/CT, i.e. a ton of people. I do hope NYC deals with its growing pains -- I finally left last year, in part because of rising costs and aggravation.

schnevets 8y ago
After a decade in the city, I'll be moving to Westchester at the end of the year. When a "45 minute" subway commute started taking well over an hour and there's no possibility of owning your home, an hour on Metro North started looking a lot more viable.

notyourday 8y ago

I'm absolutely baffled why they did not select Newark as well. It is close enough to NYC via not only Amtrak and NJT but also via PATH, ripe for redevelopment ( already in progress ) but not yet so developed that the additional infrastructure is nearly impossible to add. Adding a subway line to NYC subway is like herding a multiple feral cat colonies.

epc 8y ago

I suspect the utter inability of the region to solve the Portal Bridge and Hudson River Tunnels problem doomed Newark.

murph-almighty 8y ago

I'm kind of relieved I wasn't the only pro-Newark HN reader (though I am based in central NJ so I'll admit bias). I honestly think it's close enough to the city for it to work as an "NY" office, rent is cheaper and home ownership isn't a pipe dream, and it's close to an Amtrak stop that would allow quick access to the DC HQ!