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Wouldn't you call two new offices that are smaller than the headquarters "satellite offices"? It really does feel like Amazon successfully played a lot of muni

Wouldn't you call two new offices that are smaller than the headquarters "satellite offices"? It really does feel like Amazon successfully played a lot of municipalities against each other to try and extract the biggest concessions, knowing all along that it didn't make sense to try and hire 50000 people in a decade in any one location. I know that's how the game is played, but it's still feels a little disingenuous.

tomschlick 8y ago
> Wouldn't you call two new offices that are smaller than the headquarters "satellite offices"? They could be divisional HQs, as in Alexa HQ'd in NYC and AWS in DC.
- fooker 8y ago
  If they do that, that is eventually going to be used as ammunition for dismantling them.
  - pc86 8y ago
    Fine, I'll bite. How?
    - fooker 8y ago
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breakup_of_the_Bell_System#Post-breakup_structure https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breakup_of_the_Bell_System#Pos... Note the geographically oriented split.
- dunpeal 8y ago
  But they won't be. Can you imagine Amazon hiring 25k employees for just one project like Alexa? Also, the whole point of the new offices is to aid recruitment. Limiting particular offices to just one skillset goes totally against that. No, these offices will be smaller than the Seattle HQ, but at half the size, you can expect them to be quite diverse. They will not be a "single project" office.
  - virtuallynathan 8y ago
    Actually, there's already ~10k people working on Alexa
    - count 8y ago
      Manual QA is a bitch.
      - Rychard 8y ago
        You're sitting in a small room at a table. In front of you, a stack of paper containing a nearly-endless list of words. An Alexa device sits in a nearby corner. Clearing your throat in preparation, you reach for the first sheet of paper and begin to read the list of words: "Alacksah... Alicksah... Alorksah... Alucksah" You think to yourself: for $15/hour, you've had worse jobs.
j0hnml 8y ago
I agree, but I wonder if it’s instead not that disingenuous since most of the tech community, and likely all the city candidates, knew Amazon’s true MO from the start.
screye 8y ago
> Wouldn't you call two new offices that are smaller than the headquarters "satellite offices"? Not quite. Amazon has satellite offices, that employ an order of magnitude fewer employees. At 25k/branch, the term "regional headquarters" can be considered justified. They did game the system though. Feels like they negotiated tax benefits with 50k employees in mind, and kept the same benefits while only giving locations 25k each. This is good for tech in the east coast. Fin-tech firms WILL HAVE TO compete against Amazon for (supposed) west coast wages, and could help build a much stronger tech industry than NYC has atm. Cornell tech much be so happy with their choice to open office on Roosevelt island. I can see them being the biggest winners out of this whole set of events. NYU is probably also happy, having acquired NYU poly a few years ago.
- burger_moon 8y ago
  > Fin-tech firms WILL HAVE TO compete against Amazon for (supposed) west coast wages, and could help build a much stronger tech industry than NYC has atm. Those fin-tech companies almost certainly pay more than Amazon already. IIRC amazon has a cap of 275k for base pay, which means even if you're James Gosling that's the most you're getting, the rest has to come from RSUs which amazon also has a terrible vesting structure for. Amazon is regarded as a top-tier tech company, but their pay is not on par with any of the other companies (Google, FB, Uber, etc). More tech presence is good, but I don't think big name companies are going to be too worried about their employees leaving to get paid less and have fewer benefits.
  - dunpeal 8y ago
    Very true. It's amusing to see people talk about "west coast wages" comparing favorably to wages in NYC. The reason top tech generally kept out of NYC until recently is that they had trouble competing against investment bank salaries. This only changed as top tech (especially FAANG) comp increased to catch up. The less charitable interpretation is that top tech found itself compelled to pay more and more due to the talent crunch, until after all the increases it finally caught up with average NYC pay. Now, since it already pays at NYC-competitive levels, it might as well open offices in NYC and enjoy the talent pool there.
dmode 8y ago
This is exactly right. It is a sattelite office. And I am very skeptical of the 25k jobs number they are putting out. Especially if these are technical roles. This would amount to hiring 2k engineers a year.
ourmandave 8y ago
Are VA or NY considered union friendly states? Just wondering out loud...
- jatsign 8y ago
  VA is definitely not.
quicklime 8y ago
It feels like false advertising to me, and I'm surprised that people aren't making much noise about it. When Amazon first announced HQ2 they said that it would "be a full equal to our current campus in Seattle". I'm not sure how this can still be true given that it's half the size.
siruncledrew 8y ago
I'm skeptical Amazon will actually "create" 25k jobs. Hiring != Creating jobs. My assumption is that many currently employed individuals already living in NYC/DC will apply to Amazon for a salary and/or résumé boost. In such case, this is less about new jobs being created and more a reshuffling of the current labor pool.

tomschlick 8y ago

> Wouldn't you call two new offices that are smaller than the headquarters "satellite offices"? They could be divisional HQs, as in Alexa HQ'd in NYC and AWS in DC.

fooker 8y ago
If they do that, that is eventually going to be used as ammunition for dismantling them.
- pc86 8y ago
  Fine, I'll bite. How?
  - fooker 8y ago
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breakup_of_the_Bell_System#Post-breakup_structure https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breakup_of_the_Bell_System#Pos... Note the geographically oriented split.
dunpeal 8y ago
But they won't be. Can you imagine Amazon hiring 25k employees for just one project like Alexa? Also, the whole point of the new offices is to aid recruitment. Limiting particular offices to just one skillset goes totally against that. No, these offices will be smaller than the Seattle HQ, but at half the size, you can expect them to be quite diverse. They will not be a "single project" office.
- virtuallynathan 8y ago
  Actually, there's already ~10k people working on Alexa
  - count 8y ago
    Manual QA is a bitch.
    - Rychard 8y ago
      You're sitting in a small room at a table. In front of you, a stack of paper containing a nearly-endless list of words. An Alexa device sits in a nearby corner. Clearing your throat in preparation, you reach for the first sheet of paper and begin to read the list of words: "Alacksah... Alicksah... Alorksah... Alucksah" You think to yourself: for $15/hour, you've had worse jobs.

j0hnml 8y ago

I agree, but I wonder if it’s instead not that disingenuous since most of the tech community, and likely all the city candidates, knew Amazon’s true MO from the start.

screye 8y ago

> Wouldn't you call two new offices that are smaller than the headquarters "satellite offices"? Not quite. Amazon has satellite offices, that employ an order of magnitude fewer employees. At 25k/branch, the term "regional headquarters" can be considered justified. They did game the system though. Feels like they negotiated tax benefits with 50k employees in mind, and kept the same benefits while only giving locations 25k each. This is good for tech in the east coast. Fin-tech firms WILL HAVE TO compete against Amazon for (supposed) west coast wages, and could help build a much stronger tech industry than NYC has atm. Cornell tech much be so happy with their choice to open office on Roosevelt island. I can see them being the biggest winners out of this whole set of events. NYU is probably also happy, having acquired NYU poly a few years ago.

burger_moon 8y ago
> Fin-tech firms WILL HAVE TO compete against Amazon for (supposed) west coast wages, and could help build a much stronger tech industry than NYC has atm. Those fin-tech companies almost certainly pay more than Amazon already. IIRC amazon has a cap of 275k for base pay, which means even if you're James Gosling that's the most you're getting, the rest has to come from RSUs which amazon also has a terrible vesting structure for. Amazon is regarded as a top-tier tech company, but their pay is not on par with any of the other companies (Google, FB, Uber, etc). More tech presence is good, but I don't think big name companies are going to be too worried about their employees leaving to get paid less and have fewer benefits.
- dunpeal 8y ago
  Very true. It's amusing to see people talk about "west coast wages" comparing favorably to wages in NYC. The reason top tech generally kept out of NYC until recently is that they had trouble competing against investment bank salaries. This only changed as top tech (especially FAANG) comp increased to catch up. The less charitable interpretation is that top tech found itself compelled to pay more and more due to the talent crunch, until after all the increases it finally caught up with average NYC pay. Now, since it already pays at NYC-competitive levels, it might as well open offices in NYC and enjoy the talent pool there.

dmode 8y ago

This is exactly right. It is a sattelite office. And I am very skeptical of the 25k jobs number they are putting out. Especially if these are technical roles. This would amount to hiring 2k engineers a year.

ourmandave 8y ago

Are VA or NY considered union friendly states? Just wondering out loud...

jatsign 8y ago
VA is definitely not.

quicklime 8y ago

It feels like false advertising to me, and I'm surprised that people aren't making much noise about it. When Amazon first announced HQ2 they said that it would "be a full equal to our current campus in Seattle". I'm not sure how this can still be true given that it's half the size.

siruncledrew 8y ago

I'm skeptical Amazon will actually "create" 25k jobs. Hiring != Creating jobs. My assumption is that many currently employed individuals already living in NYC/DC will apply to Amazon for a salary and/or résumé boost. In such case, this is less about new jobs being created and more a reshuffling of the current labor pool.