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Apple iPhone sales fears rock Wall Street

43 points by osrec 8y ago

crb002 8y ago
So Apple prices themselves out of the market and now they are shocked the market reacted with lower sales.
- SlowRobotAhead 8y ago
  Aren’t the new iPhones approximately the same price as the premium android phones? Edit: Note to self, don’t ask questions here. I had thought the top of the line Samsungs were close. Good points below about cost per supported year.
  - osrec 8y ago
    Not really, there is a fairly significant drop when you compare top end Android phones to top end iPhones.
  - bsder 8y ago
    The Pixel 3 and S9 are about $300 cheaper. That's a big chunk.
    - foobiekr 8y ago
      How long will they be supported? What is the cost per supported year?
      - scarface74 8y ago
        This. If history is any guide and seeing the iPhone 5s is going into its 5th year of being supported. Someone with an this years phone should be getting updates until 2023.
      - bsder 8y ago
        Don't know about Samsung, but Google has been quite good about supporting their phones over longer time periods and has been making specific changes to Android because they can't count on the carriers to do the upgrades. The Nexus 6 is a 2014 phone and is upgradeable to Nougat/7.1.1--which was basically top end until just this year. The original Pixel is a 2013 phone and actually has Android 9 support.
        matteblack13 8y ago
        The original Pixel isn't a 2013 phone. It's a 2016 phone. That's a pretty big difference from 2013.
    - paulcole 8y ago
      Try selling them both 3 years from now. You’ll get that chunk back.
  - Jtsummers 8y ago
    Unlocked Pixel 3: $799-899 (64GB-128GB) Unlocked Pixel 3XL: $899-999 (64GB-128GB) Unlocked iPhone Xs: $999-1349 (64GB-512GB) Unlocked iPhone Xs Max: $1099-1449 (64GB-512GB) I don't know if Google's Pixel phones are really premium, but by the price I'm assuming so. It seems Apple is adding about $200 over Google's price for the similar size and storage points.
    - alttab 8y ago
      Depth sensor? Other meaningful specs? Plthe difference between $800 and $1000 is abstract when you're financing or renting month to month
      - Jtsummers 8y ago
        No doubt there are more spec differences between the two. I don't know Android hardware well enough to find a proper Android-to-Apples comparison, so I went with a current flagship from Google and the two specs that (I suspect) most users care about: size and storage.
    - jama211 8y ago
      Yes, and when you sell them in 2 years time the iPhone will be worth $300 more than the Pixel.
  - puranjay 8y ago
    In my market, the Google Pixel 2 XL is literally half the price of the iPhone X
  - sien 8y ago
    As others have said the difference is a few hundred dollars. The other thing is that the premimum phones offer less than they used to over medium priced phones and that is where Android phones are much cheaper. Apple devices hold their value better, but still the price differences between very good mid-range phones and iPhones are pretty big.
  - kccqzy 8y ago
    iPhone XS: $999 iPhone XS Max: $1,099 Pixel 3: $799 Pixel 3 XL: $899 So the new iPhones are now more expensive than the new premium Android phones. Historically, yes it seems like iPhones cost as much as the best-of-the-breed Android phones.
    - Alex3917 8y ago
      A big part of the issue is that there is no iPhone XS with 128gb storage, and no iPhone XR with 4x4 MIMO. If those were the real prices then that would be one thing, but they're purposely making their base models all but unusable.
      - kalleboo 8y ago
        When they still sold 16 GB phones sure, but 64 GB is perfectly fine for most users, especially if you use music and photo services in the cloud. As for 4x4 MIMO, I saw benchmarks on a real-world network, and the differences were pretty much negligible (under 10%) The base models are nowhere near "unusable", they're actually better than they have ever been for Apple.
- macintux 8y ago
  You mean, analysts who typically claim sales are down based on hints and rumors are once again claiming sales are down based on hints and rumors.
  - partiallypro 8y ago
    No one is claiming sales are falling outright, but that they are slowing...and that is definitely the case. There is a reason why Apple has an incredibly low F P/E. Wall Street loves growth, cash cows usually get less love. That's why Microsoft was flat for ages despite having solid profits but no real growth arm. Then Azure happened and suddenly it's a growth stock. Apple will be just fine, obviously, I actually think the market's overreaction has more to do with overall jitters of the Trump trade war.
    - codyb 8y ago
      Isn't it possible by supporting their own devices for so long they've slowed sales for themselves? If Androids get three years of updates and Apple's get six, and there are fewer and fewer emerging markets you're obviously going to have slow down at some point. If anything, it might point to increased satisfaction with Apple products which retain their value and work securely for longer. iOS 12 made iPhone 5's faster than they were with iOS 11 didn't it? That to me is worth a premium but it also means I probably won't upgrade my 7 for a while. Apple will have to continue pushing their watches, Apple TVs, and air pods and maybe new products to perpetually have people buying more and more of their products if their products consistently last a long time.
- 6nf 8y ago
  Last time we got actual numbers from Apple (only a few weeks ago btw) the iPhone was selling just fine even at the record setting price points.
  - adrr 8y ago
    Apple just stopped releasing unit shipped data only revenue. Revenue grew but we don't know how many phones were sold.
    - scarface74 8y ago
      Apple announced that they were going to stop releasing numbers this coming quarter. Apple announced numbers during the quarter that just passed.
- oscilloscope 8y ago
  I'm not sure the largest company by market cap has priced itself out of the market just yet.
  - protomyth 8y ago
    Blackberry’s highest stock price was one year after the iPhone was introduced. Market Cap is not a leading indicator.
    - Jtsummers 8y ago
      In fairness to RIM: https://www.statista.com/statistics/266240/global-revenue-of-rim-since-2004/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/266240/global-revenue-of... Their revenue continued to grow in the early iPhone days. Blackberry was still the mobile for business users until iOS (and Android) caught up on application and service support that those users wanted/needed. I don't think we've seen (yet) a situation where people will, en masse, depart the iOS platform. RIM failed to recognize (until too late) the desire for an iPhone-style device amongst business users, and ended up losing out to both Android and iOS devices. Android devices aren't offering anything (with regard to hardware and software capabilities) that is substantially different than what iOS devices offer. The primary differentiator today is the pricing, which it seems many Apple customers don't care about (enough to jump ship).
      - protomyth 8y ago
        RIM failed to recognize (until too late) the desire for an iPhone-style device amongst business users, and ended up losing out to both Android and iOS devices. After listening to the book Losing the Signal, I'm starting to think they rushed into the iPhone clone market too fast at the insistence of Verizon. I actually think they would have better off getting their ducks in a row and getting their software strategy correct before challenging Apple. It really seems like they were rushed badly.
nihonde 8y ago
The endless cycle of analysts manipulating AAPL with spurious reporting about supply chain shifts continues apace.
- partiallypro 8y ago
  How is this spurious? The maker of the components used to make FaceID cut their outlook. Since Apple is their largest (if only) customer that's a good indication that sales are slowing. Apple also recently said it will no longer make public the exact unit sales numbers.
  - eridius 8y ago
    A maker. Are they the only supplier of these particular components?
    - microtherion 8y ago
      The last paragraph in this article implies otherwise: https://www.ped30.com/2018/11/12/lumentum-wells-fargo-apple/ https://www.ped30.com/2018/11/12/lumentum-wells-fargo-apple/ > UPDATE: A friend of the blog dug up this press release from last December, when Apple invested a few hundred million in one of Lementum’s chief competitors: Apple awards Finisar $390 million from its Advanced Manufacturing Fund Now, this is an Apple friendly blog; I don't know whether the two companies are truly in the same business, or whether or not Apple sales are actually slowing down, but there is a perennial pattern of analysts interpreting order cuts at a single supplier as evidence of a slowdown, and being mistaken.
      - eridius 8y ago
        > but there is a perennial pattern of analysts interpreting order cuts at a single supplier as evidence of a slowdown, and being mistaken. Exactly this. I didn't say it before because I didn't feel like trying to dig up sources on this, but I feel like we've had several instances already where "analysts" predict a slow quarter for Apple based on news coming out of a supplier of Apple cutting inventory orders, and then it turns out that Apple had a great quarter and presumably just used a different supplier instead.
askaboutit 8y ago
Been on an Apple binge recently. The prices are out of reach. I’ve watched Steve on stage reducing prices! Whilst increasing speed. Steve talked about speed, ram, students constantly.
- puranjay 8y ago
  Same here. The prices in my local market are absurdly high. They're literally more expensive than a 2017 Macbook Pro, and more expensive than every Macbook Air on the market. My OnePlus 5T was less than 1/4th the price. The latest iterations turned me off the brand. Apple is still my go to for laptops, but the phone prices are a ripoff
  - askaboutit 8y ago
    It was kind of inspiring to see Steve talk about the power PC CPU’s in a technical way. He would say “these things scream” and would compare constantly. He would talk about students and creatives. Professionals and home users in detail. Watching him bring down the prices was cool to see. The event in NY was a slap in the face. The new air might be great. But they increased the price by $100 without making it anything innovative.
    - saagarjha 8y ago
      What do you define to be "innovative"? They added a new screen, Touch ID, new trackpad, faster processor…for a $100 more. Compared to the computer it was replacing, this is a steal.
  - n1231231231234 8y ago
    the new macbook air starts at €1349 (ca $1500) in Belgium and you really want the one for €1599 (ca $1800). for the same money, you get other laptops that are really nice with a cost/return ratio that is a lot better. sure, apple products are good products. but the premium is getting absurdly high
    - 8y ago
tehlike 8y ago
apple is becoming a services company, selling high margin services. This seems to be what the market is missing.
- askaboutit 8y ago
  Without devices to compliment its services. Why would someone use Apple Music over Spotify on android? Or appleflix over disneyflix or Netflix. Services are growing because of an established user base. Take away the hardware and they need to compete with many other companies. It’s a mistake I feel.
  - MekaiGS 8y ago
    Apple services are also not very good outside of Apple's platform: Apple Music - Only major service which requires you to install iTunes to play with all kinds of funky issues. (ex: try to play an Apple music video fullscreen on a multi-screen system and all other screens goes to BLANK, I mean seriously??) Apple Maps - Not available on non Apple devices iCloud - You only pay for this when you are heavily invested on iOS ecosystem. Apple services works best on Apple products today; the real question is whether the price increase just forces your average consumers to buy/keep used/older products or they would switch to alternatives.
- Someone1234 8y ago
  It is possible they missed that, it is also possible that that assumption is already built into APPL's $194.17 share price. A lot of Apple stock holders are speculators who have bet big on Apple continuing to grow and expand their device and service business to even larger heights, stopping or slowing won't recoup the current bets.
  - millstone 8y ago
    AAPL's P/E of 16.36 does not reflect speculation on a growth company. Compare to Google at 40, MSFT at 44, f'ing Oracle at 52...
- partiallypro 8y ago
Zelphyr 8y ago
A lot of people keep complaining about Apple raising their prices without considering that a) Apple knows people will pay it and b) they're making really solid machines that last longer. The MacBook Pro that I'm typing this on is closer to a decade old than is it new and is showing no signs of stopping. A friend of mine has had three name-brand PC laptops in that time. I acknowledge the current prices are a hard pill to swallow, but the tool I use to generate my income isn't something I want to skimp on.
- amvalo 8y ago
  > b) they're making really solid machines that last longer. The MacBook Pro that I'm typing this on is closer to a decade old Erm... We can certainly conclude that a decade ago, they made long-lasting machines. The newer MBP are apparently defeated by a grain of sand.
  - baxtr 8y ago
    Which is not true. One of my worst apple products was a white MB I bought 10 yrs ago that just disintegrated, the white plastic broke gradually of.
- protomyth 8y ago
  b) they're making really solid machines that last longer. The concern is their products are no longer lasting longer, they deny there are problems for long periods of time, and make it very hard to fix independently. The higher prices are worth it for quality, but they are cutting corners in places they shouldn’t for quality products.
  - stevenjohns 8y ago
    In all honesty iOS 12 rolling out to the iPhone 5s - a five year old device - showed their commitment to that. It will be supported at least until iOS 13 which is next year, giving the device six years of software updates. And the iOS 12 update was actually quite good and breathed life into older phones. I don't think there was ever much concern about MacBooks not lasting long - they definitely hold up. The concerns lay with iPads and iPhones, and they're most certainly holding up now. This shift is actually the reason why I moved back to Apple after leaving the ecosystem back in 2011 or so.
taytus 8y ago
I saw a video on youtube saying that the bump in prices is because sales are slowing down year over year. I have a bunch of Apple devices but haven't updated them in a couple of years. Prices are just prohibited for me.
- jama211 8y ago
  They're also probably reaching market saturation of who will likely buy their devices - there's a limit at some point. It's analogous to Facebook, which isn't growing it's user base much anymore because they have already have just about everyone on the social internet outside of China with an account. At some point, there just isn't more humans in your market sector. Wall street cares about growth, and Apple knows they're growth in device numbers is going to slow - so the way you make more money is to make your devices more expensive. They did this, and that's why their revenue and profit is still rising even though the sales numbers are not. They don't want to report the sales numbers of iPhones anymore because they know they won't go up, so they'll just show revenue and profit instead because they're confident there's still growth there. Other manufacturers such as Samsung and Google already don't release sales numbers, it was actually outside of the norm that Apple used to share these.
tinkerteller 8y ago
AAPL will survive, not because they are doing great but the fact that Android just can't pick up the slack. I was completely mind boggled when top Android phones decided to get rid of headphone jack in order to copy iPhone's mistake. When Apple introduced notch, most Android phones followed up to also have that ugly thing. Funny thing is that none had FaceID to justify it! As long as Android is determined to chase tail lights, Apple is safe and will keep leading the segment. Wall street will come around back in few days.
- jama211 8y ago
  There were android phones without a headphone jack prior to Apple removing theirs, such as the Motorola Z.
GeekyBear 8y ago
There is a long history of these sorts of rumors making the rounds shortly after the yearly iPhone announcement, only to later turn out to be complete nonsense. The most recent example was in January 2018: >Apple has reportedly slashed production orders for its iPhone X… sending shares in the world’s biggest company down on Monday. The US giant has told Asian suppliers to halve manufacturing targets for the first three months of the year, from 40m units to 20m, according to the Japanese newspaper Nikkei. The news sent Apple shares falling by as much as 2.3pc in early trading https://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/2018/01/29/apple-slows-iphone-x-production-causing-shares-fall/ https://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/2018/01/29/apple-slow... The reality turned out to be quite different. >According to the latest estimates from IHS Markit, the iPhone X was the world’s most sold smartphone in the first 3 months of 2018, with 12.7 million units, while the iPhone 8 ranked second with 8.5 million units. https://www.forbes.com/sites/jeanbaptiste/2018/06/13/the-iphone-x-was-the-worlds-best-selling-smartphone-in-q1-2018/ https://www.forbes.com/sites/jeanbaptiste/2018/06/13/the-iph...
- codyb 8y ago
  That is 21 million units though. Unless there were other models in production that brought it up to 40 million seems like it could still be the best selling models and about 20 million units total, no? Ope, clicked your link before posting thankfully. Looks like with the 7 and 6 and 8 plus it gets up to 40 million units on the nose pretty much. Impressive.
xhruso00 8y ago
I still have hopes for SE 2. Wish there was XR mini.

43 points by osrec 8y ago

crb002 8y ago

So Apple prices themselves out of the market and now they are shocked the market reacted with lower sales.

SlowRobotAhead 8y ago
Aren’t the new iPhones approximately the same price as the premium android phones? Edit: Note to self, don’t ask questions here. I had thought the top of the line Samsungs were close. Good points below about cost per supported year.
- osrec 8y ago
  Not really, there is a fairly significant drop when you compare top end Android phones to top end iPhones.
- bsder 8y ago
  The Pixel 3 and S9 are about $300 cheaper. That's a big chunk.
  - foobiekr 8y ago
    How long will they be supported? What is the cost per supported year?
    - scarface74 8y ago
      This. If history is any guide and seeing the iPhone 5s is going into its 5th year of being supported. Someone with an this years phone should be getting updates until 2023.
    - bsder 8y ago
      Don't know about Samsung, but Google has been quite good about supporting their phones over longer time periods and has been making specific changes to Android because they can't count on the carriers to do the upgrades. The Nexus 6 is a 2014 phone and is upgradeable to Nougat/7.1.1--which was basically top end until just this year. The original Pixel is a 2013 phone and actually has Android 9 support.
      - matteblack13 8y ago
        The original Pixel isn't a 2013 phone. It's a 2016 phone. That's a pretty big difference from 2013.
  - paulcole 8y ago
    Try selling them both 3 years from now. You’ll get that chunk back.
- Jtsummers 8y ago
  Unlocked Pixel 3: $799-899 (64GB-128GB) Unlocked Pixel 3XL: $899-999 (64GB-128GB) Unlocked iPhone Xs: $999-1349 (64GB-512GB) Unlocked iPhone Xs Max: $1099-1449 (64GB-512GB) I don't know if Google's Pixel phones are really premium, but by the price I'm assuming so. It seems Apple is adding about $200 over Google's price for the similar size and storage points.
  - alttab 8y ago
    Depth sensor? Other meaningful specs? Plthe difference between $800 and $1000 is abstract when you're financing or renting month to month
    - Jtsummers 8y ago
      No doubt there are more spec differences between the two. I don't know Android hardware well enough to find a proper Android-to-Apples comparison, so I went with a current flagship from Google and the two specs that (I suspect) most users care about: size and storage.
  - jama211 8y ago
    Yes, and when you sell them in 2 years time the iPhone will be worth $300 more than the Pixel.
- puranjay 8y ago
  In my market, the Google Pixel 2 XL is literally half the price of the iPhone X
- sien 8y ago
  As others have said the difference is a few hundred dollars. The other thing is that the premimum phones offer less than they used to over medium priced phones and that is where Android phones are much cheaper. Apple devices hold their value better, but still the price differences between very good mid-range phones and iPhones are pretty big.
- kccqzy 8y ago
  iPhone XS: $999 iPhone XS Max: $1,099 Pixel 3: $799 Pixel 3 XL: $899 So the new iPhones are now more expensive than the new premium Android phones. Historically, yes it seems like iPhones cost as much as the best-of-the-breed Android phones.
  - Alex3917 8y ago
    A big part of the issue is that there is no iPhone XS with 128gb storage, and no iPhone XR with 4x4 MIMO. If those were the real prices then that would be one thing, but they're purposely making their base models all but unusable.
    - kalleboo 8y ago
      When they still sold 16 GB phones sure, but 64 GB is perfectly fine for most users, especially if you use music and photo services in the cloud. As for 4x4 MIMO, I saw benchmarks on a real-world network, and the differences were pretty much negligible (under 10%) The base models are nowhere near "unusable", they're actually better than they have ever been for Apple.
macintux 8y ago
You mean, analysts who typically claim sales are down based on hints and rumors are once again claiming sales are down based on hints and rumors.
- partiallypro 8y ago
  No one is claiming sales are falling outright, but that they are slowing...and that is definitely the case. There is a reason why Apple has an incredibly low F P/E. Wall Street loves growth, cash cows usually get less love. That's why Microsoft was flat for ages despite having solid profits but no real growth arm. Then Azure happened and suddenly it's a growth stock. Apple will be just fine, obviously, I actually think the market's overreaction has more to do with overall jitters of the Trump trade war.
  - codyb 8y ago
    Isn't it possible by supporting their own devices for so long they've slowed sales for themselves? If Androids get three years of updates and Apple's get six, and there are fewer and fewer emerging markets you're obviously going to have slow down at some point. If anything, it might point to increased satisfaction with Apple products which retain their value and work securely for longer. iOS 12 made iPhone 5's faster than they were with iOS 11 didn't it? That to me is worth a premium but it also means I probably won't upgrade my 7 for a while. Apple will have to continue pushing their watches, Apple TVs, and air pods and maybe new products to perpetually have people buying more and more of their products if their products consistently last a long time.
6nf 8y ago
Last time we got actual numbers from Apple (only a few weeks ago btw) the iPhone was selling just fine even at the record setting price points.
- adrr 8y ago
  Apple just stopped releasing unit shipped data only revenue. Revenue grew but we don't know how many phones were sold.
  - scarface74 8y ago
    Apple announced that they were going to stop releasing numbers this coming quarter. Apple announced numbers during the quarter that just passed.
oscilloscope 8y ago
I'm not sure the largest company by market cap has priced itself out of the market just yet.
- protomyth 8y ago
  Blackberry’s highest stock price was one year after the iPhone was introduced. Market Cap is not a leading indicator.
  - Jtsummers 8y ago
    In fairness to RIM: https://www.statista.com/statistics/266240/global-revenue-of-rim-since-2004/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/266240/global-revenue-of... Their revenue continued to grow in the early iPhone days. Blackberry was still the mobile for business users until iOS (and Android) caught up on application and service support that those users wanted/needed. I don't think we've seen (yet) a situation where people will, en masse, depart the iOS platform. RIM failed to recognize (until too late) the desire for an iPhone-style device amongst business users, and ended up losing out to both Android and iOS devices. Android devices aren't offering anything (with regard to hardware and software capabilities) that is substantially different than what iOS devices offer. The primary differentiator today is the pricing, which it seems many Apple customers don't care about (enough to jump ship).
    - protomyth 8y ago
      RIM failed to recognize (until too late) the desire for an iPhone-style device amongst business users, and ended up losing out to both Android and iOS devices. After listening to the book Losing the Signal, I'm starting to think they rushed into the iPhone clone market too fast at the insistence of Verizon. I actually think they would have better off getting their ducks in a row and getting their software strategy correct before challenging Apple. It really seems like they were rushed badly.

nihonde 8y ago

The endless cycle of analysts manipulating AAPL with spurious reporting about supply chain shifts continues apace.

partiallypro 8y ago
How is this spurious? The maker of the components used to make FaceID cut their outlook. Since Apple is their largest (if only) customer that's a good indication that sales are slowing. Apple also recently said it will no longer make public the exact unit sales numbers.
- eridius 8y ago
  A maker. Are they the only supplier of these particular components?
  - microtherion 8y ago
    The last paragraph in this article implies otherwise: https://www.ped30.com/2018/11/12/lumentum-wells-fargo-apple/ https://www.ped30.com/2018/11/12/lumentum-wells-fargo-apple/ > UPDATE: A friend of the blog dug up this press release from last December, when Apple invested a few hundred million in one of Lementum’s chief competitors: Apple awards Finisar $390 million from its Advanced Manufacturing Fund Now, this is an Apple friendly blog; I don't know whether the two companies are truly in the same business, or whether or not Apple sales are actually slowing down, but there is a perennial pattern of analysts interpreting order cuts at a single supplier as evidence of a slowdown, and being mistaken.
    - eridius 8y ago
      > but there is a perennial pattern of analysts interpreting order cuts at a single supplier as evidence of a slowdown, and being mistaken. Exactly this. I didn't say it before because I didn't feel like trying to dig up sources on this, but I feel like we've had several instances already where "analysts" predict a slow quarter for Apple based on news coming out of a supplier of Apple cutting inventory orders, and then it turns out that Apple had a great quarter and presumably just used a different supplier instead.

askaboutit 8y ago

Been on an Apple binge recently. The prices are out of reach. I’ve watched Steve on stage reducing prices! Whilst increasing speed. Steve talked about speed, ram, students constantly.

puranjay 8y ago
Same here. The prices in my local market are absurdly high. They're literally more expensive than a 2017 Macbook Pro, and more expensive than every Macbook Air on the market. My OnePlus 5T was less than 1/4th the price. The latest iterations turned me off the brand. Apple is still my go to for laptops, but the phone prices are a ripoff
- askaboutit 8y ago
  It was kind of inspiring to see Steve talk about the power PC CPU’s in a technical way. He would say “these things scream” and would compare constantly. He would talk about students and creatives. Professionals and home users in detail. Watching him bring down the prices was cool to see. The event in NY was a slap in the face. The new air might be great. But they increased the price by $100 without making it anything innovative.
  - saagarjha 8y ago
    What do you define to be "innovative"? They added a new screen, Touch ID, new trackpad, faster processor…for a $100 more. Compared to the computer it was replacing, this is a steal.
- n1231231231234 8y ago
  the new macbook air starts at €1349 (ca $1500) in Belgium and you really want the one for €1599 (ca $1800). for the same money, you get other laptops that are really nice with a cost/return ratio that is a lot better. sure, apple products are good products. but the premium is getting absurdly high
  - 8y ago

tehlike 8y ago

apple is becoming a services company, selling high margin services. This seems to be what the market is missing.

askaboutit 8y ago
Without devices to compliment its services. Why would someone use Apple Music over Spotify on android? Or appleflix over disneyflix or Netflix. Services are growing because of an established user base. Take away the hardware and they need to compete with many other companies. It’s a mistake I feel.
- MekaiGS 8y ago
  Apple services are also not very good outside of Apple's platform: Apple Music - Only major service which requires you to install iTunes to play with all kinds of funky issues. (ex: try to play an Apple music video fullscreen on a multi-screen system and all other screens goes to BLANK, I mean seriously??) Apple Maps - Not available on non Apple devices iCloud - You only pay for this when you are heavily invested on iOS ecosystem. Apple services works best on Apple products today; the real question is whether the price increase just forces your average consumers to buy/keep used/older products or they would switch to alternatives.
Someone1234 8y ago
It is possible they missed that, it is also possible that that assumption is already built into APPL's $194.17 share price. A lot of Apple stock holders are speculators who have bet big on Apple continuing to grow and expand their device and service business to even larger heights, stopping or slowing won't recoup the current bets.
- millstone 8y ago
  AAPL's P/E of 16.36 does not reflect speculation on a growth company. Compare to Google at 40, MSFT at 44, f'ing Oracle at 52...
partiallypro 8y ago

Zelphyr 8y ago

A lot of people keep complaining about Apple raising their prices without considering that a) Apple knows people will pay it and b) they're making really solid machines that last longer. The MacBook Pro that I'm typing this on is closer to a decade old than is it new and is showing no signs of stopping. A friend of mine has had three name-brand PC laptops in that time. I acknowledge the current prices are a hard pill to swallow, but the tool I use to generate my income isn't something I want to skimp on.

amvalo 8y ago
> b) they're making really solid machines that last longer. The MacBook Pro that I'm typing this on is closer to a decade old Erm... We can certainly conclude that a decade ago, they made long-lasting machines. The newer MBP are apparently defeated by a grain of sand.
- baxtr 8y ago
  Which is not true. One of my worst apple products was a white MB I bought 10 yrs ago that just disintegrated, the white plastic broke gradually of.
protomyth 8y ago
b) they're making really solid machines that last longer. The concern is their products are no longer lasting longer, they deny there are problems for long periods of time, and make it very hard to fix independently. The higher prices are worth it for quality, but they are cutting corners in places they shouldn’t for quality products.
- stevenjohns 8y ago
  In all honesty iOS 12 rolling out to the iPhone 5s - a five year old device - showed their commitment to that. It will be supported at least until iOS 13 which is next year, giving the device six years of software updates. And the iOS 12 update was actually quite good and breathed life into older phones. I don't think there was ever much concern about MacBooks not lasting long - they definitely hold up. The concerns lay with iPads and iPhones, and they're most certainly holding up now. This shift is actually the reason why I moved back to Apple after leaving the ecosystem back in 2011 or so.

taytus 8y ago

I saw a video on youtube saying that the bump in prices is because sales are slowing down year over year. I have a bunch of Apple devices but haven't updated them in a couple of years. Prices are just prohibited for me.

jama211 8y ago
They're also probably reaching market saturation of who will likely buy their devices - there's a limit at some point. It's analogous to Facebook, which isn't growing it's user base much anymore because they have already have just about everyone on the social internet outside of China with an account. At some point, there just isn't more humans in your market sector. Wall street cares about growth, and Apple knows they're growth in device numbers is going to slow - so the way you make more money is to make your devices more expensive. They did this, and that's why their revenue and profit is still rising even though the sales numbers are not. They don't want to report the sales numbers of iPhones anymore because they know they won't go up, so they'll just show revenue and profit instead because they're confident there's still growth there. Other manufacturers such as Samsung and Google already don't release sales numbers, it was actually outside of the norm that Apple used to share these.

tinkerteller 8y ago

AAPL will survive, not because they are doing great but the fact that Android just can't pick up the slack. I was completely mind boggled when top Android phones decided to get rid of headphone jack in order to copy iPhone's mistake. When Apple introduced notch, most Android phones followed up to also have that ugly thing. Funny thing is that none had FaceID to justify it! As long as Android is determined to chase tail lights, Apple is safe and will keep leading the segment. Wall street will come around back in few days.

jama211 8y ago
There were android phones without a headphone jack prior to Apple removing theirs, such as the Motorola Z.

GeekyBear 8y ago

There is a long history of these sorts of rumors making the rounds shortly after the yearly iPhone announcement, only to later turn out to be complete nonsense. The most recent example was in January 2018: >Apple has reportedly slashed production orders for its iPhone X… sending shares in the world’s biggest company down on Monday. The US giant has told Asian suppliers to halve manufacturing targets for the first three months of the year, from 40m units to 20m, according to the Japanese newspaper Nikkei. The news sent Apple shares falling by as much as 2.3pc in early trading https://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/2018/01/29/apple-slows-iphone-x-production-causing-shares-fall/ https://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/2018/01/29/apple-slow... The reality turned out to be quite different. >According to the latest estimates from IHS Markit, the iPhone X was the world’s most sold smartphone in the first 3 months of 2018, with 12.7 million units, while the iPhone 8 ranked second with 8.5 million units. https://www.forbes.com/sites/jeanbaptiste/2018/06/13/the-iphone-x-was-the-worlds-best-selling-smartphone-in-q1-2018/ https://www.forbes.com/sites/jeanbaptiste/2018/06/13/the-iph...

codyb 8y ago
That is 21 million units though. Unless there were other models in production that brought it up to 40 million seems like it could still be the best selling models and about 20 million units total, no? Ope, clicked your link before posting thankfully. Looks like with the 7 and 6 and 8 plus it gets up to 40 million units on the nose pretty much. Impressive.

xhruso00 8y ago

I still have hopes for SE 2. Wish there was XR mini.