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I run https://jivesearch.com https://jivesearch.com, so I might be biased. The single biggest thing they can do to improve their product is open source everythi

I run https://jivesearch.com https://jivesearch.com, so I might be biased. The single biggest thing they can do to improve their product is open source everything. They've instead decided to move away from that by freezing their instant answers with no explanation as to if/when they will re-open source them. Makes me question their commitment to privacy and transparency.

sdinsn 8y ago
They've got to protect their IP somehow.
- yjftsjthsd-h 8y ago
  Do they? Their selling point is trustworthiness and privacy, not the software.
  - devwastaken 8y ago
    As most business's their internal code is probably a giant ball of mud that runs on caffeine and poor amounts of sleep. It works, but it probably wouldn't be reasonably releasable without refactoring and reworking a lot of the source so that it's componetized in some way. Personally I just want DDG to make a search API that is free and doesn't require API keys. That way I can setup search in mobile or desktop apps and have it automagically be searching through specific sites like Soundcloud and Youtube and such. Like if they're reading this, DDG is very unique and if they were to focus upon reducing costs, making efficient software, and better algorithms, DDG could be the service we shove into apps.
    - Kiro 8y ago
      That won't happen as every API call to DDG would result in an API call to Bing/Yandex/Yahoo which they have to pay for.
      - deleted 8y ago
        [deleted]
  - kevinali1 8y ago
    Their selling point is trustworthiness, privacy and usefulness. To be useful, they must have quality software/IP. And in their opinion, that should be protected.
- kgraves 8y ago
  I much rather trust a product that is open source, which makes me slightly uncomfortable and concerned about DDG.
  - GordonS 8y ago
    So let's say they release their source code - how can they possibly prove that their servers are running that same code?
    - enriquto 8y ago
      at least for some functionalities, you can run it on your computer and observe the same behavior
    - gregknicholson 8y ago
      If the code was AGPL'd and included contributions for which DDG didn't own the copyright (so DDG would be using the code under the terms of the AGPL), they'd be breaking the licence terms if they failed to disclose any changes. It wouldn't be proof, but it would be a fairly strong commitment.
- type0 8y ago
  Will they protect my IP somehow?
- pokemongoaway 8y ago
  Interesting premise... What if they open source some small subset of their code and then track their stock price, usage, and ad revenue as they release more. It could be done in a measured process. I would be more interested in them demonstrating an increasingly distributed, uncoupled, and failure-tolerant infrastructure. I'd like to see them compete with Google's caching too.
beachwood23 8y ago
Personally, I love that DuckDuckGo gives me a usable alternative to Google that is privacy focused. It might be better if they were open source, but I'll take what I can get from the industry regarding advertising practices at this point.
cpeterso 8y ago
I just DDG and have found !bang shortcuts that are broken or 404 for weeks. I've tried reporting the problems on their feedback forms or Reddit, but never got any responses. If it was open source, I could have submitted a pull request to fix them. I'm surprised they don't have automatic heartbeat queries with expected results for every bang shortcut, at least.
- brentadamson 8y ago
  I had the same issue with them back when I was a user. If you find any broken !bangs at Jive Search feel free to submit a pull request.
  - gregknicholson 8y ago
    Is there a way to go straight to the first result using Jive Search? With DuckDuckGo searching for "example !" does this. (This is the main reason I don't use Searx.)
    - brentadamson 8y ago
      I've opened up an issue: https://github.com/jivesearch/jivesearch/issues/83 https://github.com/jivesearch/jivesearch/issues/83 I didn't see the "!" documented anywhere but it seems to work at DDG. (We'll also add "\example" to do the same). https://duck.co/help/results/syntax https://duck.co/help/results/syntax
    - brentadamson 8y ago
      Just got done adding it. Let me know if there are any issues.
h1d 8y ago
Won't open sourcing the code make sites get to cheat their ranking by trying to make it rank logic friendly?
- daveFNbuck 8y ago
  They could open source everything else. I'm pretty sure they don't do their own ranking anyway.
- brentadamson 8y ago
  You can make the ranking configurable. Once we get our own index built we will go back to doing this. The way we used to do it was by having a PostgreSQL function that is customizable once you get everything set up...I'm sure there are other ways to do it as well.
- rvnx 8y ago
  No because DDG is a frontend to Bing results. The ads are different (DDG shows Yahoo ads, which also shows Bing ads) and Bing shows Bing ads only.
  - phinnaeus 8y ago
    Source?
    - rvnx 8y ago
      Easy way to verify this, right-click on the ads, paste link
    - Kiro 8y ago
      https://duck.co/help/results/sources https://duck.co/help/results/sources > We also of course have more traditional links in the search results, which we also source from a variety of partners, including Oath (formerly Yahoo) and Bing. They do not have their own search index.
      - mrweasel 8y ago
chme 8y ago
I agree. There is also searx: https://github.com/asciimoo/searx https://github.com/asciimoo/searx It has a couple of instances, like: https://searx.me/ https://searx.me/
moollaza 8y ago
Hey there, To clarify, we haven't closed anything that was previously open, and all open source Instant Answers will remain open. For now, we've paused community contributions for new Instant Answers and non-essential changes, until we can find a better way to work with the community and their contributions.
- brentadamson 8y ago
  A better way than open sourcing it?

sdinsn 8y ago

They've got to protect their IP somehow.

yjftsjthsd-h 8y ago
Do they? Their selling point is trustworthiness and privacy, not the software.
- devwastaken 8y ago
  As most business's their internal code is probably a giant ball of mud that runs on caffeine and poor amounts of sleep. It works, but it probably wouldn't be reasonably releasable without refactoring and reworking a lot of the source so that it's componetized in some way. Personally I just want DDG to make a search API that is free and doesn't require API keys. That way I can setup search in mobile or desktop apps and have it automagically be searching through specific sites like Soundcloud and Youtube and such. Like if they're reading this, DDG is very unique and if they were to focus upon reducing costs, making efficient software, and better algorithms, DDG could be the service we shove into apps.
  - Kiro 8y ago
    That won't happen as every API call to DDG would result in an API call to Bing/Yandex/Yahoo which they have to pay for.
    - deleted 8y ago
      [deleted]
- kevinali1 8y ago
  Their selling point is trustworthiness, privacy and usefulness. To be useful, they must have quality software/IP. And in their opinion, that should be protected.
kgraves 8y ago
I much rather trust a product that is open source, which makes me slightly uncomfortable and concerned about DDG.
- GordonS 8y ago
  So let's say they release their source code - how can they possibly prove that their servers are running that same code?
  - enriquto 8y ago
    at least for some functionalities, you can run it on your computer and observe the same behavior
  - gregknicholson 8y ago
    If the code was AGPL'd and included contributions for which DDG didn't own the copyright (so DDG would be using the code under the terms of the AGPL), they'd be breaking the licence terms if they failed to disclose any changes. It wouldn't be proof, but it would be a fairly strong commitment.
type0 8y ago
Will they protect my IP somehow?
pokemongoaway 8y ago
Interesting premise... What if they open source some small subset of their code and then track their stock price, usage, and ad revenue as they release more. It could be done in a measured process. I would be more interested in them demonstrating an increasingly distributed, uncoupled, and failure-tolerant infrastructure. I'd like to see them compete with Google's caching too.

beachwood23 8y ago

Personally, I love that DuckDuckGo gives me a usable alternative to Google that is privacy focused. It might be better if they were open source, but I'll take what I can get from the industry regarding advertising practices at this point.

cpeterso 8y ago

I just DDG and have found !bang shortcuts that are broken or 404 for weeks. I've tried reporting the problems on their feedback forms or Reddit, but never got any responses. If it was open source, I could have submitted a pull request to fix them. I'm surprised they don't have automatic heartbeat queries with expected results for every bang shortcut, at least.

brentadamson 8y ago
I had the same issue with them back when I was a user. If you find any broken !bangs at Jive Search feel free to submit a pull request.
- gregknicholson 8y ago
  Is there a way to go straight to the first result using Jive Search? With DuckDuckGo searching for "example !" does this. (This is the main reason I don't use Searx.)
  - brentadamson 8y ago
    I've opened up an issue: https://github.com/jivesearch/jivesearch/issues/83 https://github.com/jivesearch/jivesearch/issues/83 I didn't see the "!" documented anywhere but it seems to work at DDG. (We'll also add "\example" to do the same). https://duck.co/help/results/syntax https://duck.co/help/results/syntax
  - brentadamson 8y ago
    Just got done adding it. Let me know if there are any issues.

h1d 8y ago

Won't open sourcing the code make sites get to cheat their ranking by trying to make it rank logic friendly?

daveFNbuck 8y ago
They could open source everything else. I'm pretty sure they don't do their own ranking anyway.
brentadamson 8y ago
You can make the ranking configurable. Once we get our own index built we will go back to doing this. The way we used to do it was by having a PostgreSQL function that is customizable once you get everything set up...I'm sure there are other ways to do it as well.
rvnx 8y ago
No because DDG is a frontend to Bing results. The ads are different (DDG shows Yahoo ads, which also shows Bing ads) and Bing shows Bing ads only.
- phinnaeus 8y ago
  Source?
  - rvnx 8y ago
    Easy way to verify this, right-click on the ads, paste link
  - Kiro 8y ago
    https://duck.co/help/results/sources https://duck.co/help/results/sources > We also of course have more traditional links in the search results, which we also source from a variety of partners, including Oath (formerly Yahoo) and Bing. They do not have their own search index.
    - mrweasel 8y ago

chme 8y ago

I agree. There is also searx: https://github.com/asciimoo/searx https://github.com/asciimoo/searx It has a couple of instances, like: https://searx.me/ https://searx.me/

moollaza 8y ago

Hey there, To clarify, we haven't closed anything that was previously open, and all open source Instant Answers will remain open. For now, we've paused community contributions for new Instant Answers and non-essential changes, until we can find a better way to work with the community and their contributions.

brentadamson 8y ago
A better way than open sourcing it?