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Related, an excellent long-form New Yorker feature about another recent attempt: https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2018/02/12/the-white-darkness https://www.ne

by bydo 8y ago

Related, an excellent long-form New Yorker feature about another recent attempt: https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2018/02/12/the-white-darkness https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2018/02/12/the-white-dark...

biglenny 8y ago
Thanks for sharing. Great read so far
neaden 8y ago
That's a very beautiful, though ultimately sad, story. It inspired me to read Endurance which is just an amazing tale. Part of me does wonder if we over valorize these tales of suffering though. Is it worth all the death, injuries, and years separated from families?
- dbcurtis 8y ago
  You make a good point. Shackleton’s quirks are diminished in most histories. He could be a bit capricious in decision making. Scott was an utter fool, his reputation propped up after his disastrous expedition by the Admiralty and his widdow. Roland Huntford’s twin biography of Scott and Amundson is a study in contrasts. In Antarctica, there are no preditors and no microbes. The only things that can kill you are bad planning and poor execution. Scott died with his polar party from bad nutrition and poor judgement. Amundson’s polar party got there first, got home again, and gained weight on the trip.
tootie 8y ago
I read this and thought that whoever tries stuff like this is just a moron. There's not really much discovery to be made if any. It's extremely costly and dangerous. The only benefit is vanity.
- willbw 8y ago
  There is a part of some humans that drives them to do wild, adventurous things that can't be rationalised. Personally I find it quite a romantic notion, ignoring the sensible, boring options and doing something just because it is hard and exciting (and yes, stupid as well).
- PostOnce 8y ago
  Vanity is a benefit; it's hardly the only benefit. We'll spend maybe $100,000 on phone bills in our lives, I wonder would I be happier with a bunch of Instagram alerts, or having crossed the Antarctic alone; what would create fonder memories? Experiences that have been had by others don't impact you. I can look at a picture of Earth from NASA all I want, it'll never hit my core in the way it would if I went up there. What if you crossed it alone and didn't tell anyone you'd done it, and vanity wasn't the same sort? Living alone in the woods is one thing, living alone in the woods and posting it all to social media is a little different. Can you really imagine no benefit to a man doing something to challenge himself? This is no Everest tourist expedition with 1000 other climbers and an enormous support staff of locals, this is daring? Why should we ever try anything that anyone has ever done before? Should we then just stay home? Even if it provides nothing to these men, at the barest minimum they have inspired some long thought in others; after all, we're all sitting here thinking about it. I've been thinking about it, and talking to friends about being alone in the wilderness, for the better part of the day now.
- moab 8y ago
  The same thing could be said for many costly (in terms of either time or money) journeys: hiking the AT, biking across the world, to name two. In these cases, others have made these voyages thousands of times before, but that doesn't stop people from making these trips. By the way, I think you're misreading the piece---I don't get the impression that these men are making these trips for vanity.
  - tootie 8y ago
    Biking across the country is rarely a risk to your life. You can escape at any point with a phone call. The Antarctic trek resulted in a slow and costly airlift that was too late. I don't think they think they're doing it for vanity. It's my accusation.
  - kisstheblade 8y ago
    If you have to tell other people about your trips then it is (also) for vanity. Nobody does these extreme trips and doesn't tell about them to anybody.
    - RugnirViking 8y ago
      Artists usually show their pieces to at least some other people, yet many paint for internal contentment - we are fundamentally a social species. A large part of experiencing something is showing it to other people to seek their opinion/approval - especially if it had a large impact on a person. More to the point, beyond simply surviving, why do anything? What is life's goal? I would put it to you that many people like this were raised in such a way that their internal contentment and pride comes from this kind of thing: they judge people and more importantly themselves on the experiences they have had and the joy they get from it. They feel a need to share to get some of this joy - usually with loved ones and friends, but sometimes wider. This is not a bad thing: People often also have a need to hear about others' experiences - hence books, videos, and you being here on hacker news.

by bydo 8y ago

biglenny 8y ago

Thanks for sharing. Great read so far

neaden 8y ago

That's a very beautiful, though ultimately sad, story. It inspired me to read Endurance which is just an amazing tale. Part of me does wonder if we over valorize these tales of suffering though. Is it worth all the death, injuries, and years separated from families?

dbcurtis 8y ago
You make a good point. Shackleton’s quirks are diminished in most histories. He could be a bit capricious in decision making. Scott was an utter fool, his reputation propped up after his disastrous expedition by the Admiralty and his widdow. Roland Huntford’s twin biography of Scott and Amundson is a study in contrasts. In Antarctica, there are no preditors and no microbes. The only things that can kill you are bad planning and poor execution. Scott died with his polar party from bad nutrition and poor judgement. Amundson’s polar party got there first, got home again, and gained weight on the trip.

tootie 8y ago

I read this and thought that whoever tries stuff like this is just a moron. There's not really much discovery to be made if any. It's extremely costly and dangerous. The only benefit is vanity.

willbw 8y ago
There is a part of some humans that drives them to do wild, adventurous things that can't be rationalised. Personally I find it quite a romantic notion, ignoring the sensible, boring options and doing something just because it is hard and exciting (and yes, stupid as well).
PostOnce 8y ago
Vanity is a benefit; it's hardly the only benefit. We'll spend maybe $100,000 on phone bills in our lives, I wonder would I be happier with a bunch of Instagram alerts, or having crossed the Antarctic alone; what would create fonder memories? Experiences that have been had by others don't impact you. I can look at a picture of Earth from NASA all I want, it'll never hit my core in the way it would if I went up there. What if you crossed it alone and didn't tell anyone you'd done it, and vanity wasn't the same sort? Living alone in the woods is one thing, living alone in the woods and posting it all to social media is a little different. Can you really imagine no benefit to a man doing something to challenge himself? This is no Everest tourist expedition with 1000 other climbers and an enormous support staff of locals, this is daring? Why should we ever try anything that anyone has ever done before? Should we then just stay home? Even if it provides nothing to these men, at the barest minimum they have inspired some long thought in others; after all, we're all sitting here thinking about it. I've been thinking about it, and talking to friends about being alone in the wilderness, for the better part of the day now.
moab 8y ago
The same thing could be said for many costly (in terms of either time or money) journeys: hiking the AT, biking across the world, to name two. In these cases, others have made these voyages thousands of times before, but that doesn't stop people from making these trips. By the way, I think you're misreading the piece---I don't get the impression that these men are making these trips for vanity.
- tootie 8y ago
  Biking across the country is rarely a risk to your life. You can escape at any point with a phone call. The Antarctic trek resulted in a slow and costly airlift that was too late. I don't think they think they're doing it for vanity. It's my accusation.
- kisstheblade 8y ago
  If you have to tell other people about your trips then it is (also) for vanity. Nobody does these extreme trips and doesn't tell about them to anybody.
  - RugnirViking 8y ago
    Artists usually show their pieces to at least some other people, yet many paint for internal contentment - we are fundamentally a social species. A large part of experiencing something is showing it to other people to seek their opinion/approval - especially if it had a large impact on a person. More to the point, beyond simply surviving, why do anything? What is life's goal? I would put it to you that many people like this were raised in such a way that their internal contentment and pride comes from this kind of thing: they judge people and more importantly themselves on the experiences they have had and the joy they get from it. They feel a need to share to get some of this joy - usually with loved ones and friends, but sometimes wider. This is not a bad thing: People often also have a need to hear about others' experiences - hence books, videos, and you being here on hacker news.