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I mean the reason to buy Apple is the Software and hardware combination. Why would you install Linux on a Mac when pretty much every other cheaper laptop is mor

I mean the reason to buy Apple is the Software and hardware combination. Why would you install Linux on a Mac when pretty much every other cheaper laptop is more suitable for that?

nerdponx 8y ago
Not necessarily. Their hardware on its own is excellent, issues with keyboards notwithstanding.
tarboreus 8y ago
I was issued a Mac Air by my employer. OSX feels like an operating system for children. If this was in effect then, I would have just put the computer on the shelf as the toy it is.
- HatchedLake721 8y ago
  For children, really? And Linux is for grown up adults with beards?
- scarface74 8y ago
  OS X is real certified Unix. What can’t you do with OS X that you could do with Linux?
  - claudius 8y ago
    Install a compiler without an Apple account?
    - scarface74 8y ago
      Why would you need an Apple account to install any other compiler besides XCode - something you wouldn’t be doing with Linux?
      - claudius 8y ago
        There's no pre-installed compilers on it (at least as of 2013) and Homebrew needed me to install XCode first before it could do anything. Admittedly I stopped looking into it and just shelfed the laptop until requesting a saner one.
        scarface74 8y ago
        Which compilers?
        claudius 8y ago
        Well, none? To install GCC, Homebrew wanted me to install XCode first. That’s when I gave up because nothing was installed there by default except for an outdated Bash.
        scarface74 8y ago
        http://osxdaily.com/2014/02/12/install-command-line-tools-mac-os-x/ http://osxdaily.com/2014/02/12/install-command-line-tools-ma... But more to the point. Even if you didn’t know about that option you gave up because you didn’t want to sign up for a free account?
  - moondev 8y ago
    off the top of my head: * run containers natively * customize / swap out the window manager/display manager * run kvm virtual machines * desktop fractional scaling
    - scarface74 8y ago
      What do you get from KVM virtual machines that you don’t get from the various products available from the Mac - VMWare, Parallels, Virtual Box.
      - moondev 8y ago
        Run virtual machines in a more performant efficient manner. Not needing to pay the licensing fees for vmware, parallells Not needing to use a buggier hypervisor/manager such as virtualbox Leverage qemu and all of it's benefits at full speed, such as emulating ARM devices
        scarface74 8y ago
        Qemu. https://wiki.qemu.org/Hosts/Mac https://wiki.qemu.org/Hosts/Mac
        moondev 8y ago
        I said run qemu at full speed, which requires kvm, which requires linux.
        deleted 8y ago
        [deleted]
        scarface74 8y ago
        Not needing to pay the licensing fees for vmware, parallells So you’re okay with paying at least $800 for the cheapest Mac that Apple sells, but my development Mac would at least be $1100 - $2000, but you don’t want to spend $79 on Parallel Fusion?
pdkl95 8y ago
The laptop is their property; they don't need to justify how they want to use their own property. Locking down the bootloader against the laptop owner's wishes is an attempt to de facto usurp the owner's basic property rights. Apple is not the owner of he laptop; they have no right to mandate how their product is used after the first sale.
- gsich 8y ago
  After you bought it, it's your property. People tend to forget this. People are also allowed to install macOS on standard PC hardware, despite Apple crying "not allowed".
specialist 8y ago
You're right. I've never even be tempted to install bootcamp. But maybe someday I will. Fortunately, per above fact checker, disabling secure boot allows Linux installs. I hope that someone works with Apple to sign some Linux distro(s), recognized by secure boot. I deeply appreciate Apple's efforts to locking down their gear. But would still like the option of installing known good Linux, xBSD, Haiku, etc.
yayana 8y ago
Apple hardware was the most reasonable hardware to issue to OS developers. Apple is forced to keep things as stable as possible since new OsX drivers are their problem. You could also test every OS on the same hardware, which is the only use we had for OsX after setup tasks.

I mean the reason to buy Apple is the Software and hardware combination. Why would you install Linux on a Mac when pretty much every other cheaper laptop is more suitable for that?

nerdponx 8y ago

Not necessarily. Their hardware on its own is excellent, issues with keyboards notwithstanding.

tarboreus 8y ago

I was issued a Mac Air by my employer. OSX feels like an operating system for children. If this was in effect then, I would have just put the computer on the shelf as the toy it is.

HatchedLake721 8y ago
For children, really? And Linux is for grown up adults with beards?
scarface74 8y ago
OS X is real certified Unix. What can’t you do with OS X that you could do with Linux?
- claudius 8y ago
  Install a compiler without an Apple account?
  - scarface74 8y ago
    Why would you need an Apple account to install any other compiler besides XCode - something you wouldn’t be doing with Linux?
    - claudius 8y ago
      There's no pre-installed compilers on it (at least as of 2013) and Homebrew needed me to install XCode first before it could do anything. Admittedly I stopped looking into it and just shelfed the laptop until requesting a saner one.
      - scarface74 8y ago
        Which compilers?
        claudius 8y ago
        Well, none? To install GCC, Homebrew wanted me to install XCode first. That’s when I gave up because nothing was installed there by default except for an outdated Bash.
        scarface74 8y ago
        http://osxdaily.com/2014/02/12/install-command-line-tools-mac-os-x/ http://osxdaily.com/2014/02/12/install-command-line-tools-ma... But more to the point. Even if you didn’t know about that option you gave up because you didn’t want to sign up for a free account?
- moondev 8y ago
  off the top of my head: * run containers natively * customize / swap out the window manager/display manager * run kvm virtual machines * desktop fractional scaling
  - scarface74 8y ago
    What do you get from KVM virtual machines that you don’t get from the various products available from the Mac - VMWare, Parallels, Virtual Box.
    - moondev 8y ago
      Run virtual machines in a more performant efficient manner. Not needing to pay the licensing fees for vmware, parallells Not needing to use a buggier hypervisor/manager such as virtualbox Leverage qemu and all of it's benefits at full speed, such as emulating ARM devices
      - scarface74 8y ago
        Qemu. https://wiki.qemu.org/Hosts/Mac https://wiki.qemu.org/Hosts/Mac
        moondev 8y ago
        I said run qemu at full speed, which requires kvm, which requires linux.
        deleted 8y ago
        [deleted]
      - scarface74 8y ago
        Not needing to pay the licensing fees for vmware, parallells So you’re okay with paying at least $800 for the cheapest Mac that Apple sells, but my development Mac would at least be $1100 - $2000, but you don’t want to spend $79 on Parallel Fusion?

pdkl95 8y ago

The laptop is their property; they don't need to justify how they want to use their own property. Locking down the bootloader against the laptop owner's wishes is an attempt to de facto usurp the owner's basic property rights. Apple is not the owner of he laptop; they have no right to mandate how their product is used after the first sale.

gsich 8y ago
After you bought it, it's your property. People tend to forget this. People are also allowed to install macOS on standard PC hardware, despite Apple crying "not allowed".

specialist 8y ago

You're right. I've never even be tempted to install bootcamp. But maybe someday I will. Fortunately, per above fact checker, disabling secure boot allows Linux installs. I hope that someone works with Apple to sign some Linux distro(s), recognized by secure boot. I deeply appreciate Apple's efforts to locking down their gear. But would still like the option of installing known good Linux, xBSD, Haiku, etc.

yayana 8y ago

Apple hardware was the most reasonable hardware to issue to OS developers. Apple is forced to keep things as stable as possible since new OsX drivers are their problem. You could also test every OS on the same hardware, which is the only use we had for OsX after setup tasks.