4 ms·

There isn't infinite demand, come on. The real REAL solution to this is to raise up the living conditions of people living in poor countries. At that point ev

by jgh 8y ago

There isn't infinite demand, come on. The real REAL solution to this is to raise up the living conditions of people living in poor countries. At that point even if we had open borders not everybody would move to USA/Europe/Canada/Australia any more than everybody from Louisiana moves to California. Besides the fees are already up there. I was on an O-1 for a while and IIRC it was roughly $8000 all in between lawyers and processing fees.

sonnyblarney 8y ago
Maybe you have never travelled to a poor country? What percentage of Africans living in poverty, corruption, dysfunction do you think would like to migrate to Europe, the US or Canada? It's 'most'. 1/2 of Chinese would emigrate according to a few surveys [1]. Since everyone has the internet - they can now see that people elsewhere live in considerably higher material standards of living, why would they want to stay? Basically, family and culture ... but most people would trade that for a decent job and stable governance. Yes - totally agree the solution is to help poor countries have some wealth, but what can we do to help? They mostly have systems of total corruption. Any real attempt to try to fix underlying problems would be utterly destroyed by leadership who wants to maintain their status. Either governmental or non-governmental. Most African countries run on bribery. All the way up and down. So if a US Agency comes in and starts exposing this, how is the leadership going to react? With massive anti-American sentiment is how. This is happening right now as China is greasing government figures to buy up land on the cheap. They're bringing in their own workers in lieu of hiring Africans. Why? Because they can, and they are paying off who they need to to keep it that way. [2 Finally - even if countries were wealthier - there would still be massive emigration. Poland has a GDP/capita of about $14K US, but in PPP it's much higher. Poland is 'poor' for a rich country, but they are not poor. They have stuff. They have industry, they have regular clothes, housing, highways, governance that mostly resembles ours. None of it is UK/US standard ... but it's still pretty good. They are 'rich' compared to Nigerians, easily. And yet, there's a massive exodus of Polish labour into other places, particularly the UK, which has caused calamity in Europe. That's a different kind of migration, because I think many Poles return at some point, but nevertheless, it's big. So no, open borders would be a migration disaster by any stretch, even in some distant future where Central South American countries are hopefully much more 'caught up', it still can't work very well. I think a NAFTA type arrangement for all of the Americas is within reason though: no visa requirement, and possibility of easy work for a few years, then apply for citizenship. I think the fee for an H1 could be $1.5K a year. Maybe even a hint of a higher tax bracket, why not? $8K for an O1 sounds about right. You're supposed to be 'world class genius/talent' so that's not out of range. [1] https://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2017/07/17/half-of-china-s-millionaires-want-to-emigrate-and-canada-s-thei_a_23034094/ https://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2017/07/17/half-of-china-s-mil... [2] https://www.brookings.edu/blog/africa-in-focus/2015/11/05/what-do-we-know-about-the-chinese-land-grab-in-africa/ https://www.brookings.edu/blog/africa-in-focus/2015/11/05/wh...
- jgh 8y ago
  I don't really feel like addressing all of your points here but I will say this: You cannot apply for GC or citizenship under TN status.
  - sonnyblarney 8y ago
    As a former TN holder I'm aware, but that's a current technicality. I'm hinting at a 'system' that I think might work for North America. I guess I'm saying NAFTA is a better model for the Americas than the EU, and even then, only when there is more economic parity.

by jgh 8y ago

sonnyblarney 8y ago

Maybe you have never travelled to a poor country? What percentage of Africans living in poverty, corruption, dysfunction do you think would like to migrate to Europe, the US or Canada? It's 'most'. 1/2 of Chinese would emigrate according to a few surveys [1]. Since everyone has the internet - they can now see that people elsewhere live in considerably higher material standards of living, why would they want to stay? Basically, family and culture ... but most people would trade that for a decent job and stable governance. Yes - totally agree the solution is to help poor countries have some wealth, but what can we do to help? They mostly have systems of total corruption. Any real attempt to try to fix underlying problems would be utterly destroyed by leadership who wants to maintain their status. Either governmental or non-governmental. Most African countries run on bribery. All the way up and down. So if a US Agency comes in and starts exposing this, how is the leadership going to react? With massive anti-American sentiment is how. This is happening right now as China is greasing government figures to buy up land on the cheap. They're bringing in their own workers in lieu of hiring Africans. Why? Because they can, and they are paying off who they need to to keep it that way. [2 Finally - even if countries were wealthier - there would still be massive emigration. Poland has a GDP/capita of about $14K US, but in PPP it's much higher. Poland is 'poor' for a rich country, but they are not poor. They have stuff. They have industry, they have regular clothes, housing, highways, governance that mostly resembles ours. None of it is UK/US standard ... but it's still pretty good. They are 'rich' compared to Nigerians, easily. And yet, there's a massive exodus of Polish labour into other places, particularly the UK, which has caused calamity in Europe. That's a different kind of migration, because I think many Poles return at some point, but nevertheless, it's big. So no, open borders would be a migration disaster by any stretch, even in some distant future where Central South American countries are hopefully much more 'caught up', it still can't work very well. I think a NAFTA type arrangement for all of the Americas is within reason though: no visa requirement, and possibility of easy work for a few years, then apply for citizenship. I think the fee for an H1 could be $1.5K a year. Maybe even a hint of a higher tax bracket, why not? $8K for an O1 sounds about right. You're supposed to be 'world class genius/talent' so that's not out of range. [1] https://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2017/07/17/half-of-china-s-millionaires-want-to-emigrate-and-canada-s-thei_a_23034094/ https://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2017/07/17/half-of-china-s-mil... [2] https://www.brookings.edu/blog/africa-in-focus/2015/11/05/what-do-we-know-about-the-chinese-land-grab-in-africa/ https://www.brookings.edu/blog/africa-in-focus/2015/11/05/wh...

jgh 8y ago
I don't really feel like addressing all of your points here but I will say this: You cannot apply for GC or citizenship under TN status.
- sonnyblarney 8y ago
  As a former TN holder I'm aware, but that's a current technicality. I'm hinting at a 'system' that I think might work for North America. I guess I'm saying NAFTA is a better model for the Americas than the EU, and even then, only when there is more economic parity.