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I think these things are a problem but can be solved by alternate means. We've completely stopped building council homes for no apparent reason, for example. I

I think these things are a problem but can be solved by alternate means. We've completely stopped building council homes for no apparent reason, for example. I'd pay more in taxation to support that - hell, if we did it properly and treated it like a New Deal-style thing I'd be proud to come along and help build. We owe it to people. The fact that there are massive fields everywhere that people aren't allowed to build on because a man with a gun says no is asinine. We can make transport faster and better as well. At some point I think the population of London needs to be limited somehow because having 20 million residents would make it hellish to navigate under any system. The central bits would turn into a gridlock of pedestrians. > Do you think they should be paid enough to achieve homeownership themselves? Where should that come from? I think this gets the directionality confused. If people agree to work for a low wage, the low wage is going to persist. I think people should refuse to work jobs that don't pay enough to exist. Individually or collectively, doesn't matter. Personally I don't understand how London's service industry works at all. I'd have left yesterday if I felt my options were limited to working in the local supermarket. The wages are farcical - literally _funny_ - can't afford a studio flat within the entire M25. Meanwhile, as you know well, there are cities <5 hours drive away where one can buy a terraced house with a garden on a single minimum wage. If people refused these silly conditions, wages would rise, residents would pay a bit more for services and it'd all work out. It's funny because this is a really common (probably the overwhelming) opinion in my hometown. London is bloody expensive, no-one understands why anyone would live there unless they're rich. It's only people who have the idea that they "must" live there regardless of resources that get into trouble.

pjc50 8y ago
> We've completely stopped building council homes for no apparent reason Decades of Tory policy, that one. Councils were forced by central government to sell it off way below market value and prevented from using the resulting money from building more houses. https://www.theguardian.com/society/2015/aug/26/right-to-buy-margaret-thatcher-david-cameron-housing-crisis https://www.theguardian.com/society/2015/aug/26/right-to-buy... > The fact that there are massive fields everywhere that people aren't allowed to build on Greenfield building is hugely unpopular with voters, especially Tory voters. Planning restrictions have popular support. > We can make transport faster and better as well I'd like to see that, but decades of privatisation have preferred "cheaper". > I think people should refuse to work jobs that don't pay enough to exist. Individually or collectively, doesn't matter. And how should they eat and live in the meantime? Refusing jobs will get you taken off JSA, and possibly sent on the unpaid work programme. > Personally I don't understand how London's service industry works at all. Overwhelmingly staffed by immigrants and children of immigrants, often living in cramped conditions. > "must" live there regardless of resources For a lot of people in the peripheral towns, it's the other way round: if you want to better yourself and get a professional job, that's where you've got to be. The networking effects are huge. > I'd have left yesterday if I felt my options were limited to working in the local supermarket Every day hundreds of people leave peripheral towns and head to London because that's the choice they face.
- esotericn 8y ago
  I feel like this would be better done as a pub chat. We basically agree but are picking apart points. Yes, we're not building council homes because our political system is broken. That's what I mean by 'no apparent reason'. Laziness on my behalf, sorry. Your JSA point is silly, you know I'm not suggesting people starve, please don't do that. We need to solve centralization of everything in London, yes.

pjc50 8y ago

> We've completely stopped building council homes for no apparent reason Decades of Tory policy, that one. Councils were forced by central government to sell it off way below market value and prevented from using the resulting money from building more houses. https://www.theguardian.com/society/2015/aug/26/right-to-buy-margaret-thatcher-david-cameron-housing-crisis https://www.theguardian.com/society/2015/aug/26/right-to-buy... > The fact that there are massive fields everywhere that people aren't allowed to build on Greenfield building is hugely unpopular with voters, especially Tory voters. Planning restrictions have popular support. > We can make transport faster and better as well I'd like to see that, but decades of privatisation have preferred "cheaper". > I think people should refuse to work jobs that don't pay enough to exist. Individually or collectively, doesn't matter. And how should they eat and live in the meantime? Refusing jobs will get you taken off JSA, and possibly sent on the unpaid work programme. > Personally I don't understand how London's service industry works at all. Overwhelmingly staffed by immigrants and children of immigrants, often living in cramped conditions. > "must" live there regardless of resources For a lot of people in the peripheral towns, it's the other way round: if you want to better yourself and get a professional job, that's where you've got to be. The networking effects are huge. > I'd have left yesterday if I felt my options were limited to working in the local supermarket Every day hundreds of people leave peripheral towns and head to London because that's the choice they face.

esotericn 8y ago
I feel like this would be better done as a pub chat. We basically agree but are picking apart points. Yes, we're not building council homes because our political system is broken. That's what I mean by 'no apparent reason'. Laziness on my behalf, sorry. Your JSA point is silly, you know I'm not suggesting people starve, please don't do that. We need to solve centralization of everything in London, yes.