4 ms·

When atheists lack the courage of their convictions

6 points by jkuria 8y ago

ackfoo 8y ago
The article gets at the central problem of atheism: that atheists are so arrogant as to think they can prove a negative in an infinity (or a reasonable facsimile thereof) of space-time. Although is it childishly simple to disprove some purported characteristics of a creator (omniscience, for example, is disprovable on the grounds that the future of complex dynamic systems cannot be predicted) it is pure arrogance to assert that one does not exist without searching the entire universe at all scales. The realization that religion is gobbledygook passed down from one shithead to another does not automatically lead to enlightenment, and it should not erase humility.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
- yesenadam 8y ago
  Your language is, I think, the least humble I've read on HN. I don't think I've ever heard or read an atheist say they can prove there's no 'creator' (whatever that's supposed to mean exactly). Mainly that there's no reason to believe that there is one. No evidence whatsoever. Would it similarly be 'pure arrogance' to assert that Russell's teapot doesn't exist? "If I were to suggest that between the Earth and Mars there is a china teapot revolving about the sun in an elliptical orbit, nobody would be able to disprove my assertion provided I were careful to add that the teapot is too small to be revealed even by our most powerful telescopes. But if I were to go on to say that, since my assertion cannot be disproved, it is intolerable presumption on the part of human reason to doubt it, I should rightly be thought to be talking nonsense. If, however, the existence of such a teapot were affirmed in ancient books, taught as the sacred truth every Sunday, and instilled into the minds of children at school, hesitation to believe in its existence would become a mark of eccentricity and entitle the doubter to the attentions of the psychiatrist in an enlightened age or of the Inquisitor in an earlier time." - Bertrand Russell, 1952.[0] Meanwhile, "Atheists and religious skeptics can be executed in at least fourteen nations: Afghanistan, Iran, Malaysia, Maldives, Mauritania, Nigeria, Pakistan, Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Somalia, Sudan, Libya, the United Arab Emirates and Yemen."[1] And in Indonesia, people who discuss atheism publicly are being jailed. "Secular and atheist bloggers have been killed in Bangladesh, atheists have been threatened by government officials in Malaysia and jailed in Egypt."[2] [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russell%27s_teapot https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russell%27s_teapot [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discrimination_against_atheists https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discrimination_against_atheist... [2] http://www.thejakartapost.com/news/2018/07/11/living-a-double-life-indonesias-atheists-fear-jail-or-worse.html http://www.thejakartapost.com/news/2018/07/11/living-a-doubl...

6 points by jkuria 8y ago

The article gets at the central problem of atheism: that atheists are so arrogant as to think they can prove a negative in an infinity (or a reasonable facsimile thereof) of space-time. Although is it childishly simple to disprove some purported characteristics of a creator (omniscience, for example, is disprovable on the grounds that the future of complex dynamic systems cannot be predicted) it is pure arrogance to assert that one does not exist without searching the entire universe at all scales. The realization that religion is gobbledygook passed down from one shithead to another does not automatically lead to enlightenment, and it should not erase humility.

deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
yesenadam 8y ago
Your language is, I think, the least humble I've read on HN. I don't think I've ever heard or read an atheist say they can prove there's no 'creator' (whatever that's supposed to mean exactly). Mainly that there's no reason to believe that there is one. No evidence whatsoever. Would it similarly be 'pure arrogance' to assert that Russell's teapot doesn't exist? "If I were to suggest that between the Earth and Mars there is a china teapot revolving about the sun in an elliptical orbit, nobody would be able to disprove my assertion provided I were careful to add that the teapot is too small to be revealed even by our most powerful telescopes. But if I were to go on to say that, since my assertion cannot be disproved, it is intolerable presumption on the part of human reason to doubt it, I should rightly be thought to be talking nonsense. If, however, the existence of such a teapot were affirmed in ancient books, taught as the sacred truth every Sunday, and instilled into the minds of children at school, hesitation to believe in its existence would become a mark of eccentricity and entitle the doubter to the attentions of the psychiatrist in an enlightened age or of the Inquisitor in an earlier time." - Bertrand Russell, 1952.[0] Meanwhile, "Atheists and religious skeptics can be executed in at least fourteen nations: Afghanistan, Iran, Malaysia, Maldives, Mauritania, Nigeria, Pakistan, Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Somalia, Sudan, Libya, the United Arab Emirates and Yemen."[1] And in Indonesia, people who discuss atheism publicly are being jailed. "Secular and atheist bloggers have been killed in Bangladesh, atheists have been threatened by government officials in Malaysia and jailed in Egypt."[2] [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russell%27s_teapot https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russell%27s_teapot [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discrimination_against_atheists https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discrimination_against_atheist... [2] http://www.thejakartapost.com/news/2018/07/11/living-a-double-life-indonesias-atheists-fear-jail-or-worse.html http://www.thejakartapost.com/news/2018/07/11/living-a-doubl...