8 ms·
The Curse of the Honeycrisp Apple
- 2trill2spill 8y agoSo this article is about east coast orchards complaining that a plant that was bred to grow in Minnesota doesn't grow as well on the east coast? Well duh. As Karina Gallardo, an agricultural economist at Washington State University was quoted in the article saying “There’s a higher investment and production cost in places that are not Minnesota,” And yet it seems these orchard still make money off Honeycrisp so I'm not sure why this article was written in the first place.
- PhasmaFelis 8y agoIt's an interesting look at the vagaries of the apple-growing business. Not sure why you're reading it as a sob story.
- travisjungroth 8y ago> I'm not sure why this article was written in the first place It's an inside look, not really news. If you abstract it to "some competitors face challenges meeting changing consumer demands", it's boring. But some people might find the details of the apple market interesting.
- irrational 8y ago1. Pink Lady > Honeycrisp (though Honeycrisp is very good). 2. "The Honeycrisp variety is now so popular, consumers will spend three times the cost of other apples to experience it." Wow, I'm thankful I live in Oregon. Our local grocery store has about 10 varieties of apples on sale and Honeycrisp are usually no more expensive than other varieties.
- 2trill2spill 8y agoPink lady better than Honeycrisp? Pink lady's are okay but they are less sweet, not as crunchy and much more dense then a Honeycrisp. Also Honeycrisp are not that expensive if you buy them on sale, just got some for $1.85 a pound in Minneapolis.
- spike021 8y ago$1.85 a pound in Minneapolis? Probably cheaper near you because they're grown closer to you. I rarely see them for that cheap a cost in the bay area. I think I've seen them as low as maybe 2.20/lb but that's it.
- 2trill2spill 8y ago$2.20 is not a bad price for Honeycrisp, If I saw that price and the apples looked good I would buy a bunch. They seem to come in two prices in Minneapolis just under $4 dollars a pound or just under $2 a pound, depending on the season and if they are on sale or not.
- logfromblammo 8y agoI remember buying Honeycrisps for $1.09/# in SE Wisconsin, back before they got nationally popular. Of course, now that they are popular, they sell for more than $3/# where I currently live, and you can often tell they were grown somewhere other than northern lake country, just because they taste so different. East coast Honeycrisps really are no better than Pink Lady, and if you line up three genetically identical Honeycrisps from Washington, Minnesota, and New York, there is absolutely no question that you will be able to pick out the Minnesota one by taste. It's like buying low-sulfur onions grown somewhere other than Vidalia, GA. If you know the food well enough, you can sometimes taste the placeness in it.
- harimau777 8y agoJust be glad you're not in the Midwest where your options are "red", "yellow", and "green"! Red delicious are truly a crime against horticulture!
- 2trill2spill 8y agoWhat? Did you read the article? Or have you been to the midwest? Honeycrisp are from the midwest and when I'm in the grocery store we have a dozen or so varieties of apples, Like Zestar, Pink lady, Honeycrisp, Sweet tango, Opal and the usual suspects as well.
- jperras 8y agoLady Alice > every other apple. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lady_Alice_(apple) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lady_Alice_(apple)
- twic 8y agoCox’s Orange Pippin or GTFO. Although i am also fond of Discovery - it's a good apple, with striking red-streaked flesh. And my dad's got a tree of it, which helps.
- c0brac0bra 8y agoBraeburns are perfectly cheap and taste great and crisp, imo. I've never understood the draw of $3+/lb Honeycrisps.
- axaxs 8y agoAbsolutely agreed. One thing I've noticed though is that they are harder to find for some reason. The stores near me have gallons of red delicious, gala, fuji, and granny smith. Honeycrisp is a nice find, and pink ladies I have to remember where I bought. Do people really like those common garbage apples, or just buy them because they are cheaper?
- plushpuffin 8y agoGood article on the worst apple: https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2014/09/the-evil-reign-of-the-red-delicious/379892/ https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2014/09/the-evil-...
- bunderbunder 8y agoIf there's an Aldi in your area, that's where I find mine.
- Tiktaalik 8y agoYep. Lucky to be in the pacific northwest apple country (British Columbia for me), where a super market will have tons of apple varieties such as Jazz, Pink Lady, and locally developed Ambrosia (so sweet and honeylike it's almost like a dessert apple).
- zwieback 8y agoYes, Pink Lady FTW, very cheap in Oregon supermarkets and better than Honeycrips. Also good: Sweet Tango but a bit spendy.
- rpeden 8y agoHave you tried Envy apples? I like them a bit more than Pink Lady or Honeycrisp, though they're all pretty tasty. They can be a bit hard to find. Here in Toronto I've only seen Envys from New Zealand. They grow a decent number of them in Washington, though, and since you're right next door in Oregon maybe your grocery store will have some of those.
- rabboRubble 8y agoEnvies are wonderful. I only started seeing them in the last 2 years. My current reliably available favorite is Fuji apples.
- wizzard 8y agoI’ve tried Honeycrisps a few times and I just don’t understand why they’re so loved. They have a super crisp skin with a mealy interior, and I swear the flavor has a hint of tomato. It’s so off-putting.
- throw7 8y agoYou and me brother. Honeycrisp is way overrated. Personally, I enjoy the empire apple for raw eating.
- CarVac 8y agoHoneycrisps grown in the wrong climate are remarkably meh. Ones grown in the north to northwest are far better. Just today I found a sale on organic Honeycrisps from Washington State and they're outrageously good. The flesh is very sweet and only slightly tart (not like a Pink Lady) and when you bite into it, what feels like half the apple cleaves off into your mouth. The interior is by no means mealy if you get a good one. The problem is that growers everywhere try growing them due to the high prices, and it just isn't good at growing everywhere.
- timdiggerm 8y agoHave you tried Goldrush?
- Zarath 8y agoPink Lady is better than Honeycrisp, as Honeycrisp is far too sweet and generally are too large to eat as a small snack. Pink Lady's can sometimes have a bad aftertaste though. Personally I've been buying the Fuji variety for the last couple years, while mixing in some experimentation with other varieties. Cheaper than both Pink Lady and Honeycrisp, but not overly sweet and without the occasional bad aftertaste.
- BurningFrog 8y agoAm I the only one who gets a kind of bitter taste from Pink Lady? I'm wondering if I have one of those "cilantro tastes like soap" mutations that affects my Pink Lady enjoyment...
- deleted 8y ago[deleted]
- deleted 8y ago[deleted]
- logfromblammo 8y ago> at a certain point the consumer doesn’t want to buy an apple the size of a grapefruit Um... yes I do. Is the Honeycrisp itself not sufficient proof that apple growers have had absolutely no clue about what consumers really wanted, for decades? In the same vein, where have all the honkin' big seeded watermelons gone? You remember those, back when they had big black seeds, and actual flavor? Don't blame the consumer for not wanting to buy things they can't find in the store any more. The truth is that the apple infrastructure cannot pick and ship fruit that size, so they refuse to try, and then they blame the consumer for their choices. It bears repeating that the first Honeycrisp tree was thrown away, without anyone ever tasting the fruit. Even now, remedying that error has basically led to just one guy tasting all the apples, to the point where he has to use special toothpaste to save his teeth from the malic acid, and making the clone or cut decision based on that one bite. > The demand for this one apple exceeds supply—it’s all consumers, and therefore supermarkets, want. This is patently false. I frequently pass up Honeycrisp for other varieties (Fuji, Gala, Pink Lady), because the latter are $1.29/# and the former is something insane, like $3.59/# . I like Honeycrisp, but not three times more than other firm, tart apples. And I don't want Honeycrisp to be my only option for table fruit. How often do we have to remind growers that monoculture is stupid? Stop cloning Honeycrisp everywhere just because it's a sure sale, and try out some new varieties. If it fails as a table variety, you can always make hard cider, or applejack, and sell it to Millennial hipsters.
- monetus 8y agoDo you have any idea what edible mutualists you could grow with them? I'd bet there is a fungus meant for the rootbed. Having trouble intuiting much beyond that though. I agree with what you're trying to communicate, I think, but my anecdote from yesterday disagrees with size. I looked at the massive honey crisp on my counter (around a softball's size), but didn't want to have to cut it in half.
- logfromblammo 8y agoI want apples that I can fit three in my mouth at a time, that squish like grapes. I want apples bigger than my head, that I can pop into the oven whole, then cut off the top and spoon out the flesh like custard. I want apples that crunch when I bite them. I want apples that splat when I throw them. I want apples that taste like cherries. I want apples that taste like pears. I want apples that taste like different kinds of apple when you bite opposite sides of the fruit. I want apples that stay the same color when you cut them up. I want apples that are already fermenting by the time you get them home. I want apples that shrivel up all winter into little wrinkly apple-raisins, and then still taste fine in spring. What I don't want is one apple that's one size fits all. Because the last variety they tried for that was Red Delicious, and it is the worst named variety of apple I have ever eaten. The only way to get worse is to try naturally pollinated grown-from-seed apples, and even then you have to be very unlucky with your pick. Apple farmers tend to graft the variety clones onto dwarfing rootstock, to control for height and branching, so it's likely that any mutual crop would work just as well for any kind of apple. I seem to recall that someone was trying to get truffle to grow in apple orchards, but I don't remember seeing anything about it actually being successful.
- gbustomtv5 8y ago“Envy” is my personal favorite.
- hockeybias 8y agoInteresting article on the U of M apples: https://www.forbes.com/sites/theresabeckhusen/2018/10/06/thank-minnesotas-harsh-winters-for-your-honeycrisp-sweetango-and-first-kiss-apples/#61618b476241 https://www.forbes.com/sites/theresabeckhusen/2018/10/06/tha...
- judah 8y agoThe article mentions it only in passing, but in 2019 we'll finally see Cosmic Crisps [0] on the market. These are likely to surpass the Honeycrisp in texture, sweetness, and tart. And unlike the otherwise excellent Honeycrisp, Cosmic Crisps are not susceptible to sun burn nor bitter pit (brown pits on the apple). I'm excited to try them! [0]: https://www.cosmiccrisp.com/the-facts/ https://www.cosmiccrisp.com/the-facts/
- 3rdAccount 8y agoCosmic Crisps will supposedly not only taste amazing, but be cheaper than Honeycrisps as they're easier to manage and orchard owners are replacing red delicious as it is basically disgusting.
- Alex3917 8y agoI got a couple Cosmic Crisp at a farmer's market this year in NYC. Can confirm they're better than Honeycrisp in every way, albeit they're so sweet and tart that you might not feel like eating that many per year. I'd compare it to something like a Rebecca's Gold pawpaw, where it's like "this is the best thing I've ever eaten" but you wouldn't really want more than one or two per week during their short season.
- viggity 8y agoTarget has 3lb bags of honeycrips at consistently low prices $2ish/lb. It is because they're smaller apples than what you get in the "pile-o-apples". But this works great for us because we have small kids and they can't eat a huge honeycrisp anyway. If you really like a big honeycrisp but are more price conscious, I think the Braeburn is a damn close comparison for a much more reasonable price. And they're available at all the stores around me in Iowa. Just stick with the ones that still have a fair bit of yellow/green spackle and not too much or too deep of the red color. Too much red ends up being slightly less crisp with much less tartness. That is kind of true with honeycrisp but it is really true with Braeburn.
- stcredzero 8y agoI have childhood memories of going into the woods around the park to pick blackberries. The flavors to be found in good blackberries are pretty sublime. The other day, I bought a container of blackberries. Somehow, they had been reduced to bloated, flavorless bags of purple sugar water. (I suspect this is why they were a sale item.) Altering plants for better taste does have a place.
- 2trill2spill 8y agoYea Blackberries to me are the definition of hit or miss, They are either bland and bitter or absolutely delicious with little middle ground.
- dcbadacd 8y agoSpeaking of [color]berries, have you trued blackcurrants, redcurrants and whitecurrants?
- woobar 8y agoCurrants are [mostly] unknown in the USA. Biggest reason is the ban on black currants cultivation from a 100 years ago. I don't care much for fresh red or white currants (they are good in jams though), but black currant is something I really miss here.
- mrob 8y agoThe reason for that ban is that currant plants can spread white pine blister rust[0], which American pine trees have little resistance to. However, plant breeders are working on resistant strains of blackcurrant and pine tree, and the ban is decided by individual states, so it's not impossible to get blackcurrants in the US. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cronartium_ribicola https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cronartium_ribicola
- ip26 8y agoThere are many other varieties of currant, many native and thus easy to grow.
- CoolGuySteve 8y agoIf you're in the Northeast, you should try a Macoun apple. More tart than Honey crisp, it's a cross between a Macintosh and some more crisp apple. I never had one until I moved to New York but now it's my favourite variety.
- lh7777 8y agoAgreed! Really wish we could get Macouns in Washington. Honeycrisp are good, but a bit sweet for my taste. I also like how comparatively small New England apples are.
- sam 8y agoI just have to second this. Macouns are sublime. They peak in late fall in the northeast. Their fragrance in the cold New England fall air is the definition of November to me.
- colechristensen 8y agoVariety and regional specialty are good! This article seems to be complaining that things grow well in one place and not another place. Breed your own apples then! There aren't any apples besides honeycrisp that I know I like for eating out of hand. The market wants better produce all around and most things you find these days were bred for qualities that are good for the supply chain instead of the taste and health of the consumer. If the apples everybody likes don't grow well in your climate, fund research into finding new varieties that do. There's no "curse". The best things will not suit everybody's tastes or needs. In fact it's a pretty good indicator that you're doing something right if some people really don't like it.
- soperj 8y ago>There aren't any apples besides honeycrisp that I know I like for eating out of hand. Really? I can think of a few just off the top of my head, ambrosia, gala, pink lady, spartan, fuji. I'm not really even that into apples.
- colechristensen 8y agoI'm similarly incredulous, but when I actually go to buy apples the only ones I'm confident I'll like are honeycrisp. I guess I'm even less into apples.
- bluejekyll 8y agoHow did you leave Granny Smith off that list?
- gwbas1c 8y agoI remember loving Granny Smith back in the 1990s. Now they just don't have the same flavor. They're pulpy instead of sweet.
- mrob 8y agoI suspect it's "improvements" in storage that are to blame. All Granny Smiths are clones from the same tree, and they were grown successfully in many different places, so I don't think climate is the problem. Probably it's some new storage technique that lets them keep longer without rotting, at the expense of taste/texture. I see problems with bananas too that I think have the same cause, where they turn directly from green to brown, and I don't remember that happening ten years ago.
- timeseries2018 8y ago>> wet weather that makes organic growing impossible What what what?
- lisper 8y agoPersonally, I'm a big fan of Fujis. And nothing beats a good Red Delicious if it's fresh. I know that Red Delicious is reputed to be the White Zinfandel of the apple world, but I like 'em, and I don't care what the apple snobs have to say about it. (Or the wine snobs either, for that matter.)
- justinmchase 8y agoYou get a couple mealy dry red delicious and it just makes to scared to keep trying them.
- lisper 8y agoYeah, I totally agree. That's why I hedged with "if it's fresh." You can actually tell the quality of a RD by pressing on them with your thumb. The mealy ones will give. The crispy ones won't. I suspect even a honeycrisp will get mushy if you let it sit on the shelf long enough.
- justinmchase 8y agoBut damn they're good! We're overflowing with honey crisps and fresh cider this time of year, its beautiful.
- iambateman 8y agoI just want to say that I spent my childhood eating terrible red delicious apples and honey crisp apples are a revelation and I don’t care if they cost $18/pound they’re still worth it.
- draw_down 8y agoAgreed. Red delicious is just a crap piece of produce. I can’t believe people ever liked them.
- chx 8y agoThe apples I have eaten in my childhood behind the Iron Curtain were so bad I have not eaten any for decades until my doctor almost forced it and then I tasted honeycrisp and I was like "OMFG this is good!"
- waldoh 8y agoHere in Los Angeles (Specifically Sunland Produce in Sunland) Honeycrisps are available nearly year around for 99 cents a pound. Not on sale. It's insane, I've lived all over the place and the price actually shocks me every time i go in.
- SuoDuanDao 8y agoNo love for Cortlands here? Incredible. I'm one of those who don't understand the appeal of honeycrisp, I guess I prefer soft-fleshed apples.
- xfactor973 8y agohttp://skillcult.com/ http://skillcult.com/ has an amazing set of blog posts and videos about a whole range of obscure and interesting apple varieties. He’s talked about apples that taste like fruit punch, bananas, anise, spice, etc. The range of possible flavors that apples can express is pretty amazing.
- mfarris 8y agoHere in Los Angeles your typical store has 6-10 varieties of apple, almost all of them painfully similar. Braeburn, Jazz, Fuji, Honeycrisp, Gala, Ambrosia, Jonagold, Envy... these are all the same basic apple: overly sweet, hard/dense, not a lot of taste outside sugar. Envy apples are the yellow version of the same thing. Pink Ladies are marginally better. If anyone knows an LA area market where I can escape the tyranny of obnoxiously "crisp" sugar bombs in favor of Cortlands, McIntosh, Jonathan, or anything out of the ordinary... do tell. If the Granny Smith wasn't available I don't know what I'd do.
- kppullin 8y agoWhile a bit of a drive from LA, if you haven't made a trip out to Oak Glen I'd suggest a look at the various apple orchards out there: https://www.oakglen.net/ https://www.oakglen.net/ . This place for example lists 25 or so varieties http://losriosrancho.com/produce/ http://losriosrancho.com/produce/ and all the orchards I've visited over the years provide samples of most, if not all, of their stock.
- TimesOldRoman 8y agoAw man I love the Fuji and never tried a honeycrisp. Are they really similar?
- diablerouge 8y agoI used to work at a grocery store, and actually don't feel the way OP does. Honeycrisp are fairly different, in my opinion. A fair bit tarter, and they have an almost fluffy light crisp texture. They even have a different cellular structure than your average apple, IIRC. Though I agree that more apple varieties would be good, OP is underplaying the differences between the widely available apples. Growing conditions have a great effect in flavor and texture as well.
- iamnothere 8y agoTry them fresh from a pick-it-yourself orchard; the difference is unbelievable. The problem is that grocery store "apples" are often picked underripe, and they sit in a cold room for months before making it to the shelves.
- spiritcat 8y agoWow sounds like they're talking about JavaScript frameworks. A few good years then on to new hotness. Think of all those poor red delicious trees.
- draw_down 8y agoYou guys are so ingenious at figuring out how to make digs at JavaScript! I’m serious, I really respect the creativity on display here
- 140091 8y agoI only buy the cheapest apples. Usually that would be the red delicious. They are like 10 lb for $8 at costco. Nutritiously red delicious is the same as honeycrisp.
- crazygringo 8y agoThis is one of the silliest articles I've ever read. > "Though it succeeded beyond anyone’s wildest dreams, along the way it became a nightmare for some producers, forcing small Northeastern growers to compete with their massive, climatically advantaged counterparts on the West Coast." > Prices for Honeycrisps Can Be 2-3x Other Apples > "So why do farmers put up with the hassle? They simply don’t have a choice. The demand for this one apple exceeds supply—it’s all consumers, and therefore supermarkets, want. So growers are planting with almost reckless abandon, pulling out old varieties, like the tired Red Delicious, and putting in Honeycrisp trees—even in places where they don’t grow well." > "Meanwhile, everyone is nervously waiting for the day when the supply-demand equilibrium brings sticker prices down far enough that growing the Honeycrisp no longer makes economic sense. But it’s not likely to happen soon, said Eric Rama, head of agricultural research at MetLife Inc. Even though production is increasing at a rapid pace, demand for premium apples isn’t waning." Farmers need to grow the things that people want to buy? And it seems like this will be the situation for the foreseeable future, so it's low-risk? And they sell for more? Really struggling to see how this is a curse... instead of sensational journalism at its very worst...
- notable_user 8y agoIt’s a curse if you were a small orchard happily growing another apple variety. No one wants your apples anymore so you have to rip out all your trees an plant new one. (Side note: Really you’re grafting new branches.) That’s a lot of capital investment for a family business that might have been eeking along already. And, as the article says, who knows when you’ll need to switch to the next variety.
- deleted 8y ago[deleted]
- Alex3917 8y ago> Really you’re grafting new branches. Where does the expense come in for grafting? Isn't the only cost basically the parafilm? I'm not a grafter, but my understanding is that you just take some branches from the varietal you want to clone, cut off the tops off your existing root stock, and then connect the root stock with the twig using some grafting tape. Unless by capital investment you just mean the fact that you're not going to get more apples for another three years or whatever.
- GatorD42 8y agoThe Honeycrisp is fine, but I don't love the trend of Apple varieties that taste like jolly ranchers (super sweet and crisp - see also Pink Lady or Jazz). Old fashioned apple varieties like Macintosh and even Red Delicious can be great in season from local farms - I had a Red Delicious today I would take over any Honeycrisp. I have friends who only eat Honeycrisp, I feel old when I complain that it's not a real apple and they should try something else.
- maxerickson 8y agoIf you want to go that direction, maybe no commercial cloned apples are real.
- citrus1330 8y agoI don't understand how anyone could feel this way. Pink Lady and Honeycrisp are so much better than Red Delicious they may as well not even be the same fruit. I'll never eat a Red Delicious again.
- CarVac 8y agoIt's almost certainly about location. Maybe there's some climate where good-tasting Red Delicious grows. I find that Fuji apples in the US are fairly bland, but when I was in Japan I had one from Aomori Prefecture. It was right up there with the best Honeycrisp I've ever had. Crisp in the same way, and just as flavorful in a different way.
- GatorD42 8y agoFresh Red Delicious from a local farm can be good. The ones in cafeterias or cheap supermarkets are beyond terrible. My point is that good versions of traditional varieties can be very good, even though they are less sweet.
- war1025 8y agoPinata apples are my favorite (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pinova https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pinova) Honeycrisp have been on sale a lot lately (99 cents a pound a week ago) Honeycrisp is good, but it just seems sort of hollow and doesn't really leave you feeling any fuller at the end. It also doesn't seem to have much depth of flavor. It's just sweet.
- milleramp 8y agoI just came across Smitten apples and they are also crunchy, sweet and tart like the honeycrisp. https://www.smittenapple.com https://www.smittenapple.com In California even these new apples are relatively cheap, i never pay over 1$/lb Those who complain about red delicious simply do not know how to pick them. I often pass over them if they are not hard with tight skin. Put them in the fridge and they can be great. In fact I put all my apples into the fridge, it extends their shelf life about 2-3x.