4 ms·

I'm curious what the difference is in feel between a 737 and the GA trainers they all started on. I've flown without AoA (in the clouds no less) or even a stal

I'm curious what the difference is in feel between a 737 and the GA trainers they all started on. I've flown without AoA (in the clouds no less) or even a stall horn but without seeing anything you still know what the plane is trying to do aerodynamically. At low speed most planes will get a little "rough" (kinda like high frequency, low amplitude turbulence) and the control surfaces will respond sluggishly whereas at high speed the controls feel sharp, trim controls have vastly more effect and slight changes in direction have a stronger feeling of G-force. I haven't flown anything with hydraulic or fly-by-wire controls so I'm not sure how much logic is being applied to augment input depending on speed which might have an effect. That and heavier airplanes respond more slowly and generally dampen aerodynamic oscillation more.

SomeHacker44 8y ago
What happens leading up to and in a stall is very heavily dependent on the plane. A Cessna 152/172 and Diamond DA-20/40 have very different stall characteristics despite being similar size. My 310R and my old Mooney are very different and I do not think I ever fully stalled the former. I know for sure I never fully stalled any straight-wing jet I fly and have no direct experience with swept wing jets (like the one in question here). So, stall characteristics just don’t generalize well in my experience.
- AWildC182 8y ago
  Sure, a cessna 152/172/182 or piper will universally mush then break somewhat cleanly but evenly downwards where as most aerobatic planes/taildraggers will try to enter a full spin if you look at them funny. I'm more interested in how you can get into a high AOA, low airspeed condition without noticing something is off. As AOA increases, indicated airspeed decreases further so it seems like nobody was even bothered so much as to glance down at it for a split second during the lead up. Also, how did they allow themselves to get so much pitch or so little throttle that a full stall developed. Edit: Re read and realized they never actually mentioned a stall, but rather they probably thought they were approaching one and just kept mashing the nose down trim switch because AOA was reading high so they probably over-sped the aircraft. I guess my point becomes: why does it seems like they were only flying off of AOA?? Edit Edit: The wording suggests it wasn't even the pilots making the input, the AOA sensor was making automatic inputs and the airplane probably over-sped and broke up (or someone freaked out and pulled up hard).
  - bonzini 8y ago
    > I'm more interested in how you can get into a high AOA, low airspeed condition without noticing something is off. As AOA increases, indicated airspeed decreases further so it seems like nobody was even bothered so much as to glance down at it for a split second during the lead up. Maybe you were confusing this accident with AF447, which indeed stalled due to an excessive AoA?

SomeHacker44 8y ago

What happens leading up to and in a stall is very heavily dependent on the plane. A Cessna 152/172 and Diamond DA-20/40 have very different stall characteristics despite being similar size. My 310R and my old Mooney are very different and I do not think I ever fully stalled the former. I know for sure I never fully stalled any straight-wing jet I fly and have no direct experience with swept wing jets (like the one in question here). So, stall characteristics just don’t generalize well in my experience.

AWildC182 8y ago
Sure, a cessna 152/172/182 or piper will universally mush then break somewhat cleanly but evenly downwards where as most aerobatic planes/taildraggers will try to enter a full spin if you look at them funny. I'm more interested in how you can get into a high AOA, low airspeed condition without noticing something is off. As AOA increases, indicated airspeed decreases further so it seems like nobody was even bothered so much as to glance down at it for a split second during the lead up. Also, how did they allow themselves to get so much pitch or so little throttle that a full stall developed. Edit: Re read and realized they never actually mentioned a stall, but rather they probably thought they were approaching one and just kept mashing the nose down trim switch because AOA was reading high so they probably over-sped the aircraft. I guess my point becomes: why does it seems like they were only flying off of AOA?? Edit Edit: The wording suggests it wasn't even the pilots making the input, the AOA sensor was making automatic inputs and the airplane probably over-sped and broke up (or someone freaked out and pulled up hard).
- bonzini 8y ago
  > I'm more interested in how you can get into a high AOA, low airspeed condition without noticing something is off. As AOA increases, indicated airspeed decreases further so it seems like nobody was even bothered so much as to glance down at it for a split second during the lead up. Maybe you were confusing this accident with AF447, which indeed stalled due to an excessive AoA?