10 ms·

The Napoleonic wars were fought because Napoleon wanted to great a "big blob". He knew times were changing and only big blocks would be able to play an importa

by dudul 8y ago

The Napoleonic wars were fought because Napoleon wanted to great a "big blob". He knew times were changing and only big blocks would be able to play an important role in the future. Most medieval wars were fought over very materialistic concerns. The 100 years war is basically a "dynastic war". Most important wars in the middle ages or the Renaissance were conquest wars that had nothing to do with religion. And also, Muslims probably hated Cristians just as much.

PhasmaFelis 8y ago
> And also, Muslims probably hated Cristians just as much. Surprisingly, not as much as you'd think. In most of medieval Islamic lands, non-Muslims were second-class citizens, but they were generally allowed to worship as they pleased. You didn't get large-scale pogroms like medieval Europe. Edit: It's telling that people are downvoting this.
- amygdyl 8y ago
  I must add the Bangladesh Civil War, 1971-87 , to the pogrom count, the other way around. Calcutta Brahmin Hindu families intermarried and converted to Islam. The Muslims were supposed to go to Pakistan, as it became. But the ties were deeper than just family; Calcutta was a technical powerhouse in its prime. Skilled workers couldn't find work outside the community, which of course moved to East Pakistan/Bangladesh. The numbers were not few, and the fact that the war is officially dated to the first year of Independence, is the start of the most sorrowful tale. Three million women and children were killed or perished. Veterans of that war, ten years ago, suddenly were allowed to immigrate to the UK and America. The UK dropped the prohibition of entry and settlement, of elderly, infirm, uneducated and dependant relatives. I have friends whose futures were ruined, as the burden, despite having free healthcare and extremely generous benefits, if you have cooperative society, which in a majority ghetto concentration, you can rely on as friendly, my friends watched younger siblings lose education and housing chances, the family resources depleted entirely. Caring for unwell elderly is not compatible with the part time jobs which young mothers and school age children forwent to be on hand to attend often multiple great grandparents and even aunts and uncles. THE EFFECTS ARE CATASTROPHIC the strictly patriarchal Bengali society was obedient to elders who alienated the younger population from general society. The youngest are growing up in houses no longer bilingual, but Bengali only for avoidance of offense to the elders. The elder men collect voting cards. Twenty five, in my friends family. I see families suffering from organised indignities. I see racial discrimination in sensitive positions like social workers, who are largely another race altogether. Unusual in i predominantly, 80% Bengali area. We have frightening frequency of forcible adoption and removed from mothers and the most amazingly brazen aggressive and fraudulent routine abuse of Family Division of the High Court. I experienced this obviously through friends but then with my mother because I fought in Court Pro bono and started winning the kinds of cases that sicken me to know many go unchallenged. I became unwell as a result.
- weberc2 8y ago
  I wonder how much this is a result of the distribution of minorities in Islamic and Christian territories, respectively. The Ottomans conquered huge swaths of predominately-Christian eastern Europe, so perhaps they were disinclined to crash the economy (their tax base) by _extreme_ persecution, so they settled for a more mild form. There isn't an analog in Christian territories.
radiowave 8y ago
> Most medieval wars were fought over very materialistic concerns. Indeed. Though, religion can be a very useful ideological pretext for getting you to do something that materially benefits me.
- weberc2 8y ago
  Probably not even religion, but anything that unites a tribe. Religion is useful if you're looking to invade a Muslim realm, but race, class/status, and political ideology are all popular rationalizations for motivating attrocities.
  - vmh1928 8y ago
    Religion is also a useful pretext if you are a merchant competing with Jewish merchants. Religion is real enough if you are promoting one religion as the only true way and there are people practicing another religion in the vicinity who seem to be going fine and undercut your claim of "the only true way." In that case you might find common cause with the merchants who want to get rid of the competition. Having an ignorant rabble hungry for loot at your disposal doesn't hurt either.
    - weberc2 8y ago
      I think you may have missed my point which was that it’s not religion _per se_ which provides the pretext, but rather any appeal to our tribal nature (religion is a favorite, but any sufficiently strong tribal boundary will suffice—racism, nationalism, secularism/theism, political ideology, etc).

by dudul 8y ago

PhasmaFelis 8y ago

> And also, Muslims probably hated Cristians just as much. Surprisingly, not as much as you'd think. In most of medieval Islamic lands, non-Muslims were second-class citizens, but they were generally allowed to worship as they pleased. You didn't get large-scale pogroms like medieval Europe. Edit: It's telling that people are downvoting this.

amygdyl 8y ago
I must add the Bangladesh Civil War, 1971-87 , to the pogrom count, the other way around. Calcutta Brahmin Hindu families intermarried and converted to Islam. The Muslims were supposed to go to Pakistan, as it became. But the ties were deeper than just family; Calcutta was a technical powerhouse in its prime. Skilled workers couldn't find work outside the community, which of course moved to East Pakistan/Bangladesh. The numbers were not few, and the fact that the war is officially dated to the first year of Independence, is the start of the most sorrowful tale. Three million women and children were killed or perished. Veterans of that war, ten years ago, suddenly were allowed to immigrate to the UK and America. The UK dropped the prohibition of entry and settlement, of elderly, infirm, uneducated and dependant relatives. I have friends whose futures were ruined, as the burden, despite having free healthcare and extremely generous benefits, if you have cooperative society, which in a majority ghetto concentration, you can rely on as friendly, my friends watched younger siblings lose education and housing chances, the family resources depleted entirely. Caring for unwell elderly is not compatible with the part time jobs which young mothers and school age children forwent to be on hand to attend often multiple great grandparents and even aunts and uncles. THE EFFECTS ARE CATASTROPHIC the strictly patriarchal Bengali society was obedient to elders who alienated the younger population from general society. The youngest are growing up in houses no longer bilingual, but Bengali only for avoidance of offense to the elders. The elder men collect voting cards. Twenty five, in my friends family. I see families suffering from organised indignities. I see racial discrimination in sensitive positions like social workers, who are largely another race altogether. Unusual in i predominantly, 80% Bengali area. We have frightening frequency of forcible adoption and removed from mothers and the most amazingly brazen aggressive and fraudulent routine abuse of Family Division of the High Court. I experienced this obviously through friends but then with my mother because I fought in Court Pro bono and started winning the kinds of cases that sicken me to know many go unchallenged. I became unwell as a result.
weberc2 8y ago
I wonder how much this is a result of the distribution of minorities in Islamic and Christian territories, respectively. The Ottomans conquered huge swaths of predominately-Christian eastern Europe, so perhaps they were disinclined to crash the economy (their tax base) by _extreme_ persecution, so they settled for a more mild form. There isn't an analog in Christian territories.

radiowave 8y ago

> Most medieval wars were fought over very materialistic concerns. Indeed. Though, religion can be a very useful ideological pretext for getting you to do something that materially benefits me.

weberc2 8y ago
Probably not even religion, but anything that unites a tribe. Religion is useful if you're looking to invade a Muslim realm, but race, class/status, and political ideology are all popular rationalizations for motivating attrocities.
- vmh1928 8y ago
  Religion is also a useful pretext if you are a merchant competing with Jewish merchants. Religion is real enough if you are promoting one religion as the only true way and there are people practicing another religion in the vicinity who seem to be going fine and undercut your claim of "the only true way." In that case you might find common cause with the merchants who want to get rid of the competition. Having an ignorant rabble hungry for loot at your disposal doesn't hurt either.
  - weberc2 8y ago
    I think you may have missed my point which was that it’s not religion _per se_ which provides the pretext, but rather any appeal to our tribal nature (religion is a favorite, but any sufficiently strong tribal boundary will suffice—racism, nationalism, secularism/theism, political ideology, etc).