4 ms·

"I believe applying to elite schools is a total crapshoot unless you satisfy an instutional need of the university" As an ex-Ivy leaguer, that is the most trut

"I believe applying to elite schools is a total crapshoot unless you satisfy an instutional need of the university" As an ex-Ivy leaguer, that is the most truthful statement in your offer. ATTN APPLICANTS: remember this and don't get discouraged.

Alex3917 16y ago
Alternatively, remember this and go about satisfying some need. This really shouldn't take more than two years assuming you have a decent level of diligence. Two years is really enough time to become pretty much the best at any sport, instrument, or other activity you can think of, at least at the high school level.
- patio11 16y ago
  Egads, you're kidding me. If you are applying to the Ivies and are not black, your competition had a violin in her hands at the age of 6 months, has played in Carnegie Hall, was the valedictorian of her high school class and had test scores in the 99th percentile, and will still be rejected with the words "Another smart Asian girl... meh."
  - Alex3917 16y ago
    That's a vast exaggeration of how hard it is. If you want to be guaranteed to get into a specific Ivy then you're probably right. But if you just want to get into any Ivy and you don't care which then all you really need 1250 SATs and no Cs. And even these are negotiable if you're really good. Also, if you get recruited then they send your applications to admissions and tell if you're likely to get in or not before you even apply. And if you're not likely to get in then they'll tell you to go talk to folks at the other colleges because they don't want a bad reputation for future years. Because of this there will usually be at least one Ivy who needs what you have badly enough to pull some strings to get you in. As for the violin, don't choose something like violin, gymnastics, or soccer where people start at age 3. Just choose some obscure instrument and you're pretty much guaranteed to at least be one of the best in your state in a couple years if you practice enough and get lessons. It's not like you need to be the absolute best, assuming each school takes on average 8 of X then you only need to be in the top 80. And remember that there will be a handful of those who are completely ineligible because of outright terrible grades or SATs, or else they just don't want to go to an Ivy, so really it's more like you only need to be in the top 96 or so. Also there are a whole bunch of tricks. For example US News doesn't count the grades of people who come from Canada, so every year Harvard will recruit a whole bunch of folks from up there to round out whatever they need when if there aren't enough qualified US applicants. And plus most of these schools run massive direct mail campaigns encouraging every one to apply no mater how unqualified they are in order to make themselves appear more selective, so it's actually a ton easier to get in than it looks. Again you still need to be reasonably hard working and maybe a little lucky, but it's not so difficulty that you need to be obscenely lucky or genetically talented or whatever.
    - brandnewlow 16y ago
      Citation needed.
      - Alex3917 16y ago
        As far as I know the only one who has written anything about this is me. I wrote this essay five years ago visiting every Ivy league school and learning about their admission processes: http://alexkrupp.com/pirate.html http://alexkrupp.com/pirate.html I'm pretty sure the book The Game of Life talks about the admissions process of athletes and other students with special talents as well, but I haven't read it so I'm not sure how much detail they go into or how accurate it is. It's also worth understanding how the Academic Index works, since that's very important for getting into an Ivy. I don't think there is anything official written about it, but if you do some sleuthing you can find a bunch of stuff. For example a quick Google search turned up this: http://home.comcast.net/~charles517/ivyai.html http://home.comcast.net/~charles517/ivyai.html It's only officially used for football, but I get the impression that it's often used unofficially as a ballpark for students with special talents in other areas.
    - SkyMarshal 16y ago
      "But if you just want to get into any Ivy and you don't care which then all you really need 1250 SATs and no Cs. And even these are negotiable if you're really good." Sounds like you're referring to the 'Z-list', of rich kids who don't need financial aid or legacies, or the athletes or whatever. They might be able to get in with those metrics, but not normal kids who have 1250s, 3.5GPA, and committed to something unusual for a mere 2 years. Having gone through the application process with more impressive marks and accomplishments than that (1400, 3.8, national science competition winner, published in NSF journal), and gotten waitlisted till the last round, before somehow finally squeezing in and finding myself close to out-of-my-league anyway, I'm pretty sure that's not accurate.
  - johnfn 16y ago
    I don't buy this. I got into a few Ivys, but I'm not black, and I'm not a virtuoso instrumentalist. I just wrote about how I really liked CS and math. I got good grades and scores too, so I'm not disregarding those, but really, the world isn't full of perfect children, and even if it was, I don't think that colleges would prioritize them
    - brandnewlow 16y ago
      There are always outliers. Congrats.
- andrewljohnson 16y ago
  That's disingenuous. Two years is enough time to become second best at anything. First best usually has talent, who also tries just as hard as you.
- deleted 16y ago
  [deleted]
- apl 16y ago
  I strongly suspect you're kidding. In two years, you can't achieve anything on an instrument.
  - deleted 16y ago
    [deleted]

Alex3917 16y ago

Alternatively, remember this and go about satisfying some need. This really shouldn't take more than two years assuming you have a decent level of diligence. Two years is really enough time to become pretty much the best at any sport, instrument, or other activity you can think of, at least at the high school level.

patio11 16y ago
Egads, you're kidding me. If you are applying to the Ivies and are not black, your competition had a violin in her hands at the age of 6 months, has played in Carnegie Hall, was the valedictorian of her high school class and had test scores in the 99th percentile, and will still be rejected with the words "Another smart Asian girl... meh."
- Alex3917 16y ago
  That's a vast exaggeration of how hard it is. If you want to be guaranteed to get into a specific Ivy then you're probably right. But if you just want to get into any Ivy and you don't care which then all you really need 1250 SATs and no Cs. And even these are negotiable if you're really good. Also, if you get recruited then they send your applications to admissions and tell if you're likely to get in or not before you even apply. And if you're not likely to get in then they'll tell you to go talk to folks at the other colleges because they don't want a bad reputation for future years. Because of this there will usually be at least one Ivy who needs what you have badly enough to pull some strings to get you in. As for the violin, don't choose something like violin, gymnastics, or soccer where people start at age 3. Just choose some obscure instrument and you're pretty much guaranteed to at least be one of the best in your state in a couple years if you practice enough and get lessons. It's not like you need to be the absolute best, assuming each school takes on average 8 of X then you only need to be in the top 80. And remember that there will be a handful of those who are completely ineligible because of outright terrible grades or SATs, or else they just don't want to go to an Ivy, so really it's more like you only need to be in the top 96 or so. Also there are a whole bunch of tricks. For example US News doesn't count the grades of people who come from Canada, so every year Harvard will recruit a whole bunch of folks from up there to round out whatever they need when if there aren't enough qualified US applicants. And plus most of these schools run massive direct mail campaigns encouraging every one to apply no mater how unqualified they are in order to make themselves appear more selective, so it's actually a ton easier to get in than it looks. Again you still need to be reasonably hard working and maybe a little lucky, but it's not so difficulty that you need to be obscenely lucky or genetically talented or whatever.
  - brandnewlow 16y ago
    Citation needed.
    - Alex3917 16y ago
      As far as I know the only one who has written anything about this is me. I wrote this essay five years ago visiting every Ivy league school and learning about their admission processes: http://alexkrupp.com/pirate.html http://alexkrupp.com/pirate.html I'm pretty sure the book The Game of Life talks about the admissions process of athletes and other students with special talents as well, but I haven't read it so I'm not sure how much detail they go into or how accurate it is. It's also worth understanding how the Academic Index works, since that's very important for getting into an Ivy. I don't think there is anything official written about it, but if you do some sleuthing you can find a bunch of stuff. For example a quick Google search turned up this: http://home.comcast.net/~charles517/ivyai.html http://home.comcast.net/~charles517/ivyai.html It's only officially used for football, but I get the impression that it's often used unofficially as a ballpark for students with special talents in other areas.
  - SkyMarshal 16y ago
    "But if you just want to get into any Ivy and you don't care which then all you really need 1250 SATs and no Cs. And even these are negotiable if you're really good." Sounds like you're referring to the 'Z-list', of rich kids who don't need financial aid or legacies, or the athletes or whatever. They might be able to get in with those metrics, but not normal kids who have 1250s, 3.5GPA, and committed to something unusual for a mere 2 years. Having gone through the application process with more impressive marks and accomplishments than that (1400, 3.8, national science competition winner, published in NSF journal), and gotten waitlisted till the last round, before somehow finally squeezing in and finding myself close to out-of-my-league anyway, I'm pretty sure that's not accurate.
- johnfn 16y ago
  I don't buy this. I got into a few Ivys, but I'm not black, and I'm not a virtuoso instrumentalist. I just wrote about how I really liked CS and math. I got good grades and scores too, so I'm not disregarding those, but really, the world isn't full of perfect children, and even if it was, I don't think that colleges would prioritize them
  - brandnewlow 16y ago
    There are always outliers. Congrats.
andrewljohnson 16y ago
That's disingenuous. Two years is enough time to become second best at anything. First best usually has talent, who also tries just as hard as you.
deleted 16y ago
[deleted]
apl 16y ago
I strongly suspect you're kidding. In two years, you can't achieve anything on an instrument.
- deleted 16y ago
  [deleted]