5 ms·

If so, storing a season's worth of heat might not be so feasible. A home in northern Europe needs about 30,000 MJ, so that would be 53,000 kg of norbornadeine.

by sjburt 8y ago

If so, storing a season's worth of heat might not be so feasible. A home in northern Europe needs about 30,000 MJ, so that would be 53,000 kg of norbornadeine. If the system absorbs energy during the day and releases energy at night, it might work with quite a bit less (maybe only a few hundred kg). It's interesting that the article doesn't suggest that. I wonder if there is a reason that wouldn't work--not enough solar energy in the winter, perhaps?

jws 8y ago
Your solar collectors will still be pulling in 1/3 of summer sun in the middle of winter (rough estimate, varies by latitude and weather, void above arctic circle). At the edges of winter you’d even be gaining energy still, so let’s say 40,000kg. That fits in an underground tank typically used by gasoline stations and could be filled by two tank trucks. Sounds doable in the scheme of new house construction, subject to the cost of the chemical of course. But, I have to think that if space is available, increasing the collector area to gather more winter energy and reducing the inventory of chemical and energy would make more sense. In the summer you could sell your saturated chemical to industry and have them replace it with unsaturated to offset your panel cost. Of course now that I have introduced shipping… who wants to live in a shiny reflector farm? Cover industrial buildings and car parks with reflectors, ship or pipe the chemical to houses and have a nicer domestic landscape. I wonder if there are degradation issues? They make a point of being able to store for 18 years which probably only interests survivalists, but make no mention of cycle limits.
- extrapickles 8y ago
  Assuming the at-scale cost is similar to gasoline, it would cost ~$75k just for that much material. If you assume the useful life is 18 years, you would have to spend >$347/mo on heating/cooling for it to be worth it.
  - jvanderbot 8y ago
    You're suggesting buying pre-charged sun juice? That seems less helpful. TFA suggested you can have much less by recharging it, and did not suggest the fluid expires ever (suggested otherwise, actually). It holds energy for 18 years, but can be used in cycle forever.
m_eiman 8y ago
A home in northern Europe needs about 30,000 MJ Really? We live in central Sweden, just outside Gothenburg. According to the estimate from our power company, our house uses about 15,000 MJ per year - and we have a single floor 200 square meter house. It's rated "C" in energy efficiency (which is the minimum rate allowed for new housing now).
- bjelkeman-again 8y ago
  I live in a house from 1909, with a heat pump (bergvärme). We probably use 18000 kWh for hearing in a year, 64800 MJ, at 190 m2 plus basement. 30000 MJ wouldn’t be enough for us I guess.

by sjburt 8y ago

jws 8y ago

Your solar collectors will still be pulling in 1/3 of summer sun in the middle of winter (rough estimate, varies by latitude and weather, void above arctic circle). At the edges of winter you’d even be gaining energy still, so let’s say 40,000kg. That fits in an underground tank typically used by gasoline stations and could be filled by two tank trucks. Sounds doable in the scheme of new house construction, subject to the cost of the chemical of course. But, I have to think that if space is available, increasing the collector area to gather more winter energy and reducing the inventory of chemical and energy would make more sense. In the summer you could sell your saturated chemical to industry and have them replace it with unsaturated to offset your panel cost. Of course now that I have introduced shipping… who wants to live in a shiny reflector farm? Cover industrial buildings and car parks with reflectors, ship or pipe the chemical to houses and have a nicer domestic landscape. I wonder if there are degradation issues? They make a point of being able to store for 18 years which probably only interests survivalists, but make no mention of cycle limits.

extrapickles 8y ago
Assuming the at-scale cost is similar to gasoline, it would cost ~$75k just for that much material. If you assume the useful life is 18 years, you would have to spend >$347/mo on heating/cooling for it to be worth it.
- jvanderbot 8y ago
  You're suggesting buying pre-charged sun juice? That seems less helpful. TFA suggested you can have much less by recharging it, and did not suggest the fluid expires ever (suggested otherwise, actually). It holds energy for 18 years, but can be used in cycle forever.

m_eiman 8y ago

A home in northern Europe needs about 30,000 MJ Really? We live in central Sweden, just outside Gothenburg. According to the estimate from our power company, our house uses about 15,000 MJ per year - and we have a single floor 200 square meter house. It's rated "C" in energy efficiency (which is the minimum rate allowed for new housing now).

bjelkeman-again 8y ago
I live in a house from 1909, with a heat pump (bergvärme). We probably use 18000 kWh for hearing in a year, 64800 MJ, at 190 m2 plus basement. 30000 MJ wouldn’t be enough for us I guess.