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San Jose is among the most affordable urban locations in California. Tech talent doesn't want to live in the sticks. Especially young tech talent. I understan

San Jose is among the most affordable urban locations in California. Tech talent doesn't want to live in the sticks. Especially young tech talent. I understand them because I am one of them. What good is a nice compensation package if I have to live in the middle of nowhere?

wcfields 8y ago
Affordable for whom? [1] Rent is extremely high and so is buying [2] [1] https://www.zillow.com/homes/for_rent/san-jose,ca_rb/ https://www.zillow.com/homes/for_rent/san-jose,ca_rb/ [2] https://www.zillow.com/homes/San-Jose-CA_rb/ https://www.zillow.com/homes/San-Jose-CA_rb/
starpilot 8y ago
San Jose is more expensive than LA and close to Boston in rent: http://d3exkutavo4sli.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/zumper-rent-december.png http://d3exkutavo4sli.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2017.... Also it really is the blandest area I've ever lived in in California. I don't think there's another city with a higher CoL:QoL ratio.
- dunpeal 8y ago
  More expensive than LA? Where exactly in LA? I'd suspect the parts of LA you'd like to live in - Santa Monica, for example - are far more expensive than the livable parts of San Diego.
bsvalley 8y ago
Silicon Valley for instance is sitting on top of a giant swamp. In the 70’s it looked like the middle of nowhere. In 2018, it looks like a bunch of office buildings and strip malls. Is this attractive? Young folks are looking for the fame that’s what it is. The google’s, facebook’s etc. Yes there’s always san francisco but these are just extensions of the headquarters just to make sure they get hold of everyone. If the fame was in the middle of nowhere people wouldn’t hesitate a second to move to that place. If it’s not you, someone else will.
- automatoney 8y ago
  I don't speak for all young folks, but at least for me I just want to be in a big city where there's a lot going on - people from all over, interesting events and new experiences. Oh and also good public transportation, most young people aren't super into owning cars. It's hard to say if people would move to the middle of nowhere for the big names, I'm sure a lot of people would but I definitely would not, and I believe many of my friends feel similarly.
  - weirdstuff 8y ago
    It's a bit of circular logic. Big names are where big populations are. By that criteria San Francisco city has more "nowhereness" than San Jose. New York metro area is much more nowhere than Tokyo metro if you want to go buy sheer population in a continuous urban conglomeration. And to me, personally, NYC is just as nowhere as Boise, Idaho. Just a bunch of people living in groups doing things they find interesting, or can't leave due to financial/family/personal reasons. You can do lots of stuff in and around Boise that the same people can't do in NYC and visa versa, depending on individual preferences. Many folks I know get bored quickly in NYC and SF. I do. I still love NYC and SF, though. I suffer from a bit of Stockholm Syndrome ;)
    - not_kurt_godel 8y ago
      > NYC is just as nowhere as Boise, Idaho. Just a bunch of people living in groups doing things they find interesting, or can't leave due to financial/family/personal reasons I am having difficulty thinking of any group of humans living anywhere that doesn't meet this definition. The same could be said for a mining town in Siberia, or an uncontacted tribe living in the Amazon, or prisoners in a prison. > You can do lots of stuff in and around Boise that the same people can't do in NYC and [vice] versa, depending on individual preferences. The list of things you can do in Boise that you can't do in NYC is effectively zero if you exclude "the outdoors" as a category. For people who don't prioritize the outdoors as highly as other things in life, this makes Boise effectively nowhere by comparison.
- strken 8y ago
Fins 8y ago
One impression I got of San Jose was that it IS the sticks. Climate is nice, but culturally it is about as exciting as Omaha (no offense to Nebraska meant).
- twtw 8y ago
  Yes! It's super lame here, please move away or don't move here - I'd like to bring the orchards back to my hometown.
  - pbarnes_1 8y ago
    Fins has a point though. I live in SF but was down in SJ recently and honestly... it's just nice suburbia with the same strip malls and everything that's copy-pasted across the US? Am I missing something there that makes it... unique?
    - burfog 8y ago
      There is no better place for growing apricots. Apricots are simply divine. For this alone, bulldozing would be justified.
    - twtw 8y ago
      I absolutely agree that fins has a point, and I'm serious - if it doesn't work for you, move away. There is certainly no lack of people. I also dislike the strip malls everywhere; I was serious about the orchards part too. I wish that I could rewind to having fewer houses and strip malls and more orchards. But for people who like suburbia but also want to work for technology companies, it works out pretty nicely. If you take the "everything that's copy pasted across the US" and splash in world class semiconductor company HQs (in San Jose and surrounding areas, like Sunnyvale, Santa Clara, etc), you get San Jose. Seems sorta unique to me, but I won't try too hard to sell it to anyone else who disagrees.
    - deleted 8y ago
      [deleted]
    - epynonymous 8y ago
soundwave106 8y ago
There are a lot of places in the United States that are well between "middle of nowhere" and current high housing cost markets like San Francisco and NYC. Technology wise I have heard of decent activity (including in a few of these cities some startup ventures) in places like Austin, the North Carolina research triangle, Miami, Boulder, Phoenix, Portland, Boston, etc. (Internationally, I'm sure there's some other markets people can add.) I have heard of housing costs creeping up in a few of these locations, but as far as I know, most of these still have pretty affordable housing compared to the Silicon Valley as a whole currently. Yes, the culture varies considerably between all these cities, but none of them I would describe as "middle of nowhere".
- pbarnes_1 8y ago
  One way to describe the difference between SF/NYC and all these other places is that the former have people from all over the place, and that makes them interesting and sort of mind expanding in a way that's hard to describe. The latter have varying degrees of "melting pot"-ness.
closeparen 8y ago
What good is a nice compensation package if I have to put most of it towards rent, live in a crap apartment, or both?

wcfields 8y ago

Affordable for whom? [1] Rent is extremely high and so is buying [2] [1] https://www.zillow.com/homes/for_rent/san-jose,ca_rb/ https://www.zillow.com/homes/for_rent/san-jose,ca_rb/ [2] https://www.zillow.com/homes/San-Jose-CA_rb/ https://www.zillow.com/homes/San-Jose-CA_rb/

starpilot 8y ago

San Jose is more expensive than LA and close to Boston in rent: http://d3exkutavo4sli.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/zumper-rent-december.png http://d3exkutavo4sli.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2017.... Also it really is the blandest area I've ever lived in in California. I don't think there's another city with a higher CoL:QoL ratio.

dunpeal 8y ago
More expensive than LA? Where exactly in LA? I'd suspect the parts of LA you'd like to live in - Santa Monica, for example - are far more expensive than the livable parts of San Diego.

bsvalley 8y ago

Silicon Valley for instance is sitting on top of a giant swamp. In the 70’s it looked like the middle of nowhere. In 2018, it looks like a bunch of office buildings and strip malls. Is this attractive? Young folks are looking for the fame that’s what it is. The google’s, facebook’s etc. Yes there’s always san francisco but these are just extensions of the headquarters just to make sure they get hold of everyone. If the fame was in the middle of nowhere people wouldn’t hesitate a second to move to that place. If it’s not you, someone else will.

automatoney 8y ago
I don't speak for all young folks, but at least for me I just want to be in a big city where there's a lot going on - people from all over, interesting events and new experiences. Oh and also good public transportation, most young people aren't super into owning cars. It's hard to say if people would move to the middle of nowhere for the big names, I'm sure a lot of people would but I definitely would not, and I believe many of my friends feel similarly.
- weirdstuff 8y ago
  It's a bit of circular logic. Big names are where big populations are. By that criteria San Francisco city has more "nowhereness" than San Jose. New York metro area is much more nowhere than Tokyo metro if you want to go buy sheer population in a continuous urban conglomeration. And to me, personally, NYC is just as nowhere as Boise, Idaho. Just a bunch of people living in groups doing things they find interesting, or can't leave due to financial/family/personal reasons. You can do lots of stuff in and around Boise that the same people can't do in NYC and visa versa, depending on individual preferences. Many folks I know get bored quickly in NYC and SF. I do. I still love NYC and SF, though. I suffer from a bit of Stockholm Syndrome ;)
  - not_kurt_godel 8y ago
    > NYC is just as nowhere as Boise, Idaho. Just a bunch of people living in groups doing things they find interesting, or can't leave due to financial/family/personal reasons I am having difficulty thinking of any group of humans living anywhere that doesn't meet this definition. The same could be said for a mining town in Siberia, or an uncontacted tribe living in the Amazon, or prisoners in a prison. > You can do lots of stuff in and around Boise that the same people can't do in NYC and [vice] versa, depending on individual preferences. The list of things you can do in Boise that you can't do in NYC is effectively zero if you exclude "the outdoors" as a category. For people who don't prioritize the outdoors as highly as other things in life, this makes Boise effectively nowhere by comparison.
strken 8y ago

Fins 8y ago

One impression I got of San Jose was that it IS the sticks. Climate is nice, but culturally it is about as exciting as Omaha (no offense to Nebraska meant).

twtw 8y ago
Yes! It's super lame here, please move away or don't move here - I'd like to bring the orchards back to my hometown.
- pbarnes_1 8y ago
  Fins has a point though. I live in SF but was down in SJ recently and honestly... it's just nice suburbia with the same strip malls and everything that's copy-pasted across the US? Am I missing something there that makes it... unique?
  - burfog 8y ago
    There is no better place for growing apricots. Apricots are simply divine. For this alone, bulldozing would be justified.
  - twtw 8y ago
    I absolutely agree that fins has a point, and I'm serious - if it doesn't work for you, move away. There is certainly no lack of people. I also dislike the strip malls everywhere; I was serious about the orchards part too. I wish that I could rewind to having fewer houses and strip malls and more orchards. But for people who like suburbia but also want to work for technology companies, it works out pretty nicely. If you take the "everything that's copy pasted across the US" and splash in world class semiconductor company HQs (in San Jose and surrounding areas, like Sunnyvale, Santa Clara, etc), you get San Jose. Seems sorta unique to me, but I won't try too hard to sell it to anyone else who disagrees.
  - deleted 8y ago
    [deleted]
  - epynonymous 8y ago

soundwave106 8y ago

There are a lot of places in the United States that are well between "middle of nowhere" and current high housing cost markets like San Francisco and NYC. Technology wise I have heard of decent activity (including in a few of these cities some startup ventures) in places like Austin, the North Carolina research triangle, Miami, Boulder, Phoenix, Portland, Boston, etc. (Internationally, I'm sure there's some other markets people can add.) I have heard of housing costs creeping up in a few of these locations, but as far as I know, most of these still have pretty affordable housing compared to the Silicon Valley as a whole currently. Yes, the culture varies considerably between all these cities, but none of them I would describe as "middle of nowhere".

pbarnes_1 8y ago
One way to describe the difference between SF/NYC and all these other places is that the former have people from all over the place, and that makes them interesting and sort of mind expanding in a way that's hard to describe. The latter have varying degrees of "melting pot"-ness.

closeparen 8y ago

What good is a nice compensation package if I have to put most of it towards rent, live in a crap apartment, or both?