4 ms·

MDMA therapy achieves astounding 76% success rate for treating PTSD

49 points by mgdo 8y ago

travmatt 8y ago
Every time I read an article about the continuing progress MAPS has made into using ‘recreational’ drugs to alleviate these terrible afflictions, I can’t help but think of all the people who suffered because this research was demonized and outlawed decades ago for easy political points. Much appreciation for Rick Doblin for sticking to the research when the scientific community was told to stop.
- eckmLJE 8y ago
  I agree with you for the most part, but fear of psychedelics by political leaders is bigger than scoring points. What can be a miracle cure for individuals with various mental illnesses can have a similarly potent impact on "healthy" minds and result in radical changes in how we view the world and each other... In ways that could threaten the political status quo. On the one hand it sounds wonderful to me-- on the other, potentially quite dangerous and disruptive.
  - globe1337 8y ago
    Maybe people need something like it to snap out of what we're doing to the planet. The current system is anything but normal.
  - brokenmachine 8y ago
    The current political status quo is not "dangerous and disruptive" to you? I'm not even specifically referring to the US.
- philwelch 8y ago
  It's also worth noting that many of the most visible public advocates of these drugs (e.g. Timothy Leary) were, eh, not quite operating on the same plane of reality as the rest of us, so to speak. The kind of restrained, politically correct, scientific-sounding discussions about clinical trials and whatnot are quite a bit different from the "studies" done in that era, which largely fell into two camps: incredibly unethical MKULTRA research funded by the CIA, and LSD-fueled hippies trying to start a cultural revolution by getting everyone to drop acid.
  - village-idiot 8y ago
    Far too many advocates forget that the messenger is part of the message. The most successful advocacy campaigns carefully pick their messenger to match their needs. Good example: Rosa Parks was not the first person arrested for refusing to give up her seat, Claudette Calvins was arrested 9 months before Rosa. But Claudette was pregnant out of wedlock to an older man, and shitty or not, civil leaders knew this would be used to attack her and their cause if she was their representative. So they went with Rosa, knowing that her character would be much harder to impeach in the court of public opinion.
RickS 8y ago
This research continues to leave me extremely hopeful. After reading a similar report a few months ago, I decided to roll the dice and put aside my fears of more serious drugs to see if this could work for me. Let me tell you. MDMA delivered. Here's an anecdotal stream of consciousness about it. I am unsure whether the thing I experienced is something that only MDMA can provide, or if it is something that is normal in healthy people but is otherwise unobtainable in people such as myself. In the context of PTSD the phenomenon typically sought and described is something along the lines of "zoom out, see yourself, forgive yourself". It does this. There's an episode of House involving a war vet who lost his hand while clenching his fist in a moment of trauma. The ghost of his severed hand remained alive in his mind, clenching, for every day of his life thereafter. Finally, House sets up an experiment with a mirror in a box that creates an illusion that his lost hand is intact. The man's mind, sufficiently convinced that this new reality is plausible, allows him to unclench his haunted fist, for the first time. The man breaks down in a wave of profound gratitude. I am weeping as I write this, so familiar is the sensation of existential tension and release. That is the most apt metaphor I can conjure for the emotional experience MDMA provides. You just... let go. Finally. With ease. A task which was previously not merely impossible, but flatly inconceivable. Except letting go isn't about whether you're holding a foreign object or not. It's more like a transition between two states – two shapes the hand can be in. Closed to open. Imagine having no nerves, no muscles, no sensation that would let you direct your hand from the shape it is in now, to this hypothetical other shape it could take. Similarly, you go from one mental model of the world to another. And so you have to have an idea of what this other place is. In the past, I've described to my therapist the struggle of imagining this place and unclenching, emotionally, as being asked to draw an animal you've never seen. "Paint me a zarnur", I say. Well.. how many legs does it have? Is it a mammal? Eyes? Color? Size? There's no sensible place to get started that isn't just firing birdshot into the dark. It is a special helplessness borne in the void of total disconnection from what your goal might be. Emotional forgiveness is an animal you can't draw, because the door that blocks your sight of him is too heavy for you to move on your own. When I took MDMA, it was with the pretense that god damnit, if I can't open that door with my mind, with all my effort, in my current state, then maybe we bulldoze it open. And maybe it's only open an inch, and I get a peek at a single hair. And maybe it's only open for a moment, and my glance is fleeting. And maybe it kills me. Fine. We've gotta try. Because if it works, it would be something. The beginning of some north star, from which I might be able to plant myself and work outwards, where previously there was no ground beneath me. And that's what happened. For five hours on one night, I felt like a version of myself that not only might be worthy of love and acceptance from other humans, but a version of my self that was inarguably worthy. That evening remains the only blip of signal in an otherwise empty transmission log. I don't say that to be morbid – I say it with profound gratitude. It went from zero to one. That's huge. My biggest regret? That I didn't have a voice recorder. I remember snippets of conversation, but four hours of mental rearchitecture is not easily recalled with much fidelity by an amateur. Nevertheless, the emotion, the sensation, was so real and so profound that I could never doubt it. Perception is reality, here, and I saw to my satisfaction that the place I wanted to go, the state where one hopes to finally be at rest, certainly exists. If you want to buy runway for hope, that's about as good as it gets. Your mileage may vary, of course. I was extremely fortunate that I have a group of friends whom I've known nearly a decade, lived with, grown up with, and trust fully happen to also be experts in administering such an experience, so it was about as good as I could have gotten. I feel, having been through it, that this is a fairly safe thing to attempt. But do take precautions. Rollsafe[1] appears to be an authority in this space. [1]https://rollsafe.org/ https://rollsafe.org/
not_real_acct 8y ago
Everyone that I know hates my wife and I, because we're just so ridiculously happy with each other. It's just sickening, we're that super annoying couple that finish each other's sentences and act like teenagers in love, even though we've known each other for well over two decades. I don't think I could have done it without LSD. Here's what happened: I was raised by a single mom and I just had NO IDEA how to talk to women whatsoever. On top of that, I was always the kid who'd spend all weekend squirreled away in his room writing code. I never had any luck with girls, I honestly lost my virginity to a girl because I did her taxes. No joke, she basically felt bad for my nerdy self and threw me a bone because I did her taxes. In some other timeline, I could've turned into an incel. Instead, when I was 20, a coworker gave me some LSD one night and we went to a night club. On a normal night, I would've spent the whole night trying to 'pick up' girls. On that night, I just wanted to dance and have a good time. And it stuck. I stopped worrying about trying to find a GF. I stopped stressing out about being lonely. Practically overnight, I found myself going out and focusing on having a good time and just having fun. And the interesting thing about LSD is that I didn't have to do it every night. I did it one time and it changed how I viewed the world. It wasn't a crutch, it just re-arranged how I saw things. Naturally, you know where this is going right? I met a great girl, and suddenly I wasn't nervous or self conscious or creepy, I was just like "hey let's go out and have a good time."
- RcouF1uZ4gsC 8y ago
  > And the interesting thing about LSD is that I didn't have to do it every night. I did it one time and it changed how I viewed the world. It wasn't a crutch, it just re-arranged how I saw things. This is one of the most scary things I have read. What if you got lucky in that it was beneficial for you? For all we know it could have easily gone the other way where just that single dose on that single night could have permanently ruined your life. Persistent effects of drugs after a single use are a terrifying phenomenon.
  - aluren 8y ago
    Everything you experience is bound to be mind-altering in one way or another. We change constantly, and our past selves from 10 years ago are hardly the same person as our current selves. (In fact, the very notion that there is a 'self' is more artificial and murky than anything.) Why experience anything then, if the thought of changing is so terrifying? Of course, that does not mean you should experience everything. I would stay away from acid if I had known schizophrenic antecedents in my family. But that's like with anything: be aware of risk factors, act accordingly. Don't eat too much sugar if you are diabetic, don't explore caves if you are claustrophobic, and so on.

49 points by mgdo 8y ago

Every time I read an article about the continuing progress MAPS has made into using ‘recreational’ drugs to alleviate these terrible afflictions, I can’t help but think of all the people who suffered because this research was demonized and outlawed decades ago for easy political points. Much appreciation for Rick Doblin for sticking to the research when the scientific community was told to stop.

eckmLJE 8y ago
I agree with you for the most part, but fear of psychedelics by political leaders is bigger than scoring points. What can be a miracle cure for individuals with various mental illnesses can have a similarly potent impact on "healthy" minds and result in radical changes in how we view the world and each other... In ways that could threaten the political status quo. On the one hand it sounds wonderful to me-- on the other, potentially quite dangerous and disruptive.
- globe1337 8y ago
  Maybe people need something like it to snap out of what we're doing to the planet. The current system is anything but normal.
- brokenmachine 8y ago
  The current political status quo is not "dangerous and disruptive" to you? I'm not even specifically referring to the US.
philwelch 8y ago
It's also worth noting that many of the most visible public advocates of these drugs (e.g. Timothy Leary) were, eh, not quite operating on the same plane of reality as the rest of us, so to speak. The kind of restrained, politically correct, scientific-sounding discussions about clinical trials and whatnot are quite a bit different from the "studies" done in that era, which largely fell into two camps: incredibly unethical MKULTRA research funded by the CIA, and LSD-fueled hippies trying to start a cultural revolution by getting everyone to drop acid.
- village-idiot 8y ago
  Far too many advocates forget that the messenger is part of the message. The most successful advocacy campaigns carefully pick their messenger to match their needs. Good example: Rosa Parks was not the first person arrested for refusing to give up her seat, Claudette Calvins was arrested 9 months before Rosa. But Claudette was pregnant out of wedlock to an older man, and shitty or not, civil leaders knew this would be used to attack her and their cause if she was their representative. So they went with Rosa, knowing that her character would be much harder to impeach in the court of public opinion.

RickS 8y ago

This research continues to leave me extremely hopeful. After reading a similar report a few months ago, I decided to roll the dice and put aside my fears of more serious drugs to see if this could work for me. Let me tell you. MDMA delivered. Here's an anecdotal stream of consciousness about it. I am unsure whether the thing I experienced is something that only MDMA can provide, or if it is something that is normal in healthy people but is otherwise unobtainable in people such as myself. In the context of PTSD the phenomenon typically sought and described is something along the lines of "zoom out, see yourself, forgive yourself". It does this. There's an episode of House involving a war vet who lost his hand while clenching his fist in a moment of trauma. The ghost of his severed hand remained alive in his mind, clenching, for every day of his life thereafter. Finally, House sets up an experiment with a mirror in a box that creates an illusion that his lost hand is intact. The man's mind, sufficiently convinced that this new reality is plausible, allows him to unclench his haunted fist, for the first time. The man breaks down in a wave of profound gratitude. I am weeping as I write this, so familiar is the sensation of existential tension and release. That is the most apt metaphor I can conjure for the emotional experience MDMA provides. You just... let go. Finally. With ease. A task which was previously not merely impossible, but flatly inconceivable. Except letting go isn't about whether you're holding a foreign object or not. It's more like a transition between two states – two shapes the hand can be in. Closed to open. Imagine having no nerves, no muscles, no sensation that would let you direct your hand from the shape it is in now, to this hypothetical other shape it could take. Similarly, you go from one mental model of the world to another. And so you have to have an idea of what this other place is. In the past, I've described to my therapist the struggle of imagining this place and unclenching, emotionally, as being asked to draw an animal you've never seen. "Paint me a zarnur", I say. Well.. how many legs does it have? Is it a mammal? Eyes? Color? Size? There's no sensible place to get started that isn't just firing birdshot into the dark. It is a special helplessness borne in the void of total disconnection from what your goal might be. Emotional forgiveness is an animal you can't draw, because the door that blocks your sight of him is too heavy for you to move on your own. When I took MDMA, it was with the pretense that god damnit, if I can't open that door with my mind, with all my effort, in my current state, then maybe we bulldoze it open. And maybe it's only open an inch, and I get a peek at a single hair. And maybe it's only open for a moment, and my glance is fleeting. And maybe it kills me. Fine. We've gotta try. Because if it works, it would be something. The beginning of some north star, from which I might be able to plant myself and work outwards, where previously there was no ground beneath me. And that's what happened. For five hours on one night, I felt like a version of myself that not only might be worthy of love and acceptance from other humans, but a version of my self that was inarguably worthy. That evening remains the only blip of signal in an otherwise empty transmission log. I don't say that to be morbid – I say it with profound gratitude. It went from zero to one. That's huge. My biggest regret? That I didn't have a voice recorder. I remember snippets of conversation, but four hours of mental rearchitecture is not easily recalled with much fidelity by an amateur. Nevertheless, the emotion, the sensation, was so real and so profound that I could never doubt it. Perception is reality, here, and I saw to my satisfaction that the place I wanted to go, the state where one hopes to finally be at rest, certainly exists. If you want to buy runway for hope, that's about as good as it gets. Your mileage may vary, of course. I was extremely fortunate that I have a group of friends whom I've known nearly a decade, lived with, grown up with, and trust fully happen to also be experts in administering such an experience, so it was about as good as I could have gotten. I feel, having been through it, that this is a fairly safe thing to attempt. But do take precautions. Rollsafe[1] appears to be an authority in this space. [1]https://rollsafe.org/ https://rollsafe.org/

not_real_acct 8y ago

Everyone that I know hates my wife and I, because we're just so ridiculously happy with each other. It's just sickening, we're that super annoying couple that finish each other's sentences and act like teenagers in love, even though we've known each other for well over two decades. I don't think I could have done it without LSD. Here's what happened: I was raised by a single mom and I just had NO IDEA how to talk to women whatsoever. On top of that, I was always the kid who'd spend all weekend squirreled away in his room writing code. I never had any luck with girls, I honestly lost my virginity to a girl because I did her taxes. No joke, she basically felt bad for my nerdy self and threw me a bone because I did her taxes. In some other timeline, I could've turned into an incel. Instead, when I was 20, a coworker gave me some LSD one night and we went to a night club. On a normal night, I would've spent the whole night trying to 'pick up' girls. On that night, I just wanted to dance and have a good time. And it stuck. I stopped worrying about trying to find a GF. I stopped stressing out about being lonely. Practically overnight, I found myself going out and focusing on having a good time and just having fun. And the interesting thing about LSD is that I didn't have to do it every night. I did it one time and it changed how I viewed the world. It wasn't a crutch, it just re-arranged how I saw things. Naturally, you know where this is going right? I met a great girl, and suddenly I wasn't nervous or self conscious or creepy, I was just like "hey let's go out and have a good time."

RcouF1uZ4gsC 8y ago
> And the interesting thing about LSD is that I didn't have to do it every night. I did it one time and it changed how I viewed the world. It wasn't a crutch, it just re-arranged how I saw things. This is one of the most scary things I have read. What if you got lucky in that it was beneficial for you? For all we know it could have easily gone the other way where just that single dose on that single night could have permanently ruined your life. Persistent effects of drugs after a single use are a terrifying phenomenon.
- aluren 8y ago
  Everything you experience is bound to be mind-altering in one way or another. We change constantly, and our past selves from 10 years ago are hardly the same person as our current selves. (In fact, the very notion that there is a 'self' is more artificial and murky than anything.) Why experience anything then, if the thought of changing is so terrifying? Of course, that does not mean you should experience everything. I would stay away from acid if I had known schizophrenic antecedents in my family. But that's like with anything: be aware of risk factors, act accordingly. Don't eat too much sugar if you are diabetic, don't explore caves if you are claustrophobic, and so on.