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That 'but' is an excuse. Government opinion will always lag the peoples opinion - its a reactive organisation. Making a change yourself and normalising it is

That 'but' is an excuse. Government opinion will always lag the peoples opinion - its a reactive organisation. Making a change yourself and normalising it is a huge signal to those you come into contact with that they should do the same. Governments change when politicians realise they are growing out of touch with the people they are trying to coerce.

ForHackernews 8y ago
> Government opinion will always lag the peoples opinion - its a reactive organisation. I don't think this is true. In the USA, incandescent lightbulbs were more-or-less banned in favour of energy-efficient CFLs and LEDs, and people whined and moaned like crazy. Then they very quickly got over it. If you'd waited around for everyone to convince their friends and neighbors to spend 300% more up front on light bulbs, that would never, ever have happened. We need political leaders to show real leadership. I am not optimistic.
mac01021 8y ago
I've done all of the following at various points, and announced that it was for environment reasons: - Gone vegetarian - Bought a tiny used car instead on new one or one with more space. - Moved to a neighborhood where I could walk to work. - Declined for my employer to send me on an expenses paid trip to a conference 2000 miles away. This has had ZERO effect on the behavior of any of the witnesses. And if I voice too much disapproval of people's ecologically destructive behavior, all that will happen is that I will be branded as some weirdo puritanical eco-prude, who's opinions and values are too fringe to be given any weight.
- MandieD 8y ago
  Except for the last action, though, the first three had the benefit of saving you money and thus bringing you closer to financial freedom, as well as putting you in a less painful position when we all finally have to reduce our consumption. Show how excellent your life still is at this lower consumption level - not wasting all that time commuting, for starters.
- christophilus 8y ago
  How do you know this had ZERO effect on the witnesses? I used to be a climate change denier, and I’m not anymore. This is probably due to enough people like you convincing me to get informed. But people like you who knew me 15 years ago probably despaired (incorrectly) that they didn’t impact me.
ehnto 8y ago
It's not the government that needs to change though, it's industry and agriculture, and government needs to act to make them change because voting with our wallets is wishful thinking and only applies to people who care. That's not enough people unfortunately. To that end, we need to force the government's to act instead. Industry will not do what is best for you and I, let alone the planet, if it means an extra dollar. You think you can vote with your wallet but frankly, the rest of the world doesn't care like you and I do. They don't and won't change soon enough. Not only that, but marketing is really good at tricking people into thinking they are doing good. Sugar free, fat free, organic foods, marketing finds ways to pedal the same food and processes with different labels and the same negative effects. It takes regulation to change it. False advertising isn't prevelant in Australia because our government regulates the crap out of food labels for one example. Another example is green energy. People are swapping to green energy only now rather than years ago because the government has subsidised it so hard that the dollars make sense. People didn't care until it saved them money, and electricity companies who were in the best position to make changes didn't care until they were forced to. If it were up to them they will pedal coal until we all die, and if it were up to the consumer we would just use more dirty electricity to run our aircons. Thank you for your comment by the way, I am appreciating the discourse.

ForHackernews 8y ago

> Government opinion will always lag the peoples opinion - its a reactive organisation. I don't think this is true. In the USA, incandescent lightbulbs were more-or-less banned in favour of energy-efficient CFLs and LEDs, and people whined and moaned like crazy. Then they very quickly got over it. If you'd waited around for everyone to convince their friends and neighbors to spend 300% more up front on light bulbs, that would never, ever have happened. We need political leaders to show real leadership. I am not optimistic.

mac01021 8y ago

I've done all of the following at various points, and announced that it was for environment reasons: - Gone vegetarian - Bought a tiny used car instead on new one or one with more space. - Moved to a neighborhood where I could walk to work. - Declined for my employer to send me on an expenses paid trip to a conference 2000 miles away. This has had ZERO effect on the behavior of any of the witnesses. And if I voice too much disapproval of people's ecologically destructive behavior, all that will happen is that I will be branded as some weirdo puritanical eco-prude, who's opinions and values are too fringe to be given any weight.

MandieD 8y ago
Except for the last action, though, the first three had the benefit of saving you money and thus bringing you closer to financial freedom, as well as putting you in a less painful position when we all finally have to reduce our consumption. Show how excellent your life still is at this lower consumption level - not wasting all that time commuting, for starters.
christophilus 8y ago
How do you know this had ZERO effect on the witnesses? I used to be a climate change denier, and I’m not anymore. This is probably due to enough people like you convincing me to get informed. But people like you who knew me 15 years ago probably despaired (incorrectly) that they didn’t impact me.

ehnto 8y ago

It's not the government that needs to change though, it's industry and agriculture, and government needs to act to make them change because voting with our wallets is wishful thinking and only applies to people who care. That's not enough people unfortunately. To that end, we need to force the government's to act instead. Industry will not do what is best for you and I, let alone the planet, if it means an extra dollar. You think you can vote with your wallet but frankly, the rest of the world doesn't care like you and I do. They don't and won't change soon enough. Not only that, but marketing is really good at tricking people into thinking they are doing good. Sugar free, fat free, organic foods, marketing finds ways to pedal the same food and processes with different labels and the same negative effects. It takes regulation to change it. False advertising isn't prevelant in Australia because our government regulates the crap out of food labels for one example. Another example is green energy. People are swapping to green energy only now rather than years ago because the government has subsidised it so hard that the dollars make sense. People didn't care until it saved them money, and electricity companies who were in the best position to make changes didn't care until they were forced to. If it were up to them they will pedal coal until we all die, and if it were up to the consumer we would just use more dirty electricity to run our aircons. Thank you for your comment by the way, I am appreciating the discourse.