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You are comparing prices without VAT to prices with VAT. In France VAT is 20%, quite typical in the EU, so the comparison is not fair at all. There's VAT in ma

by Xixi 8y ago

You are comparing prices without VAT to prices with VAT. In France VAT is 20%, quite typical in the EU, so the comparison is not fair at all. There's VAT in many states and cities in the United States, although typically at rates much lower than in the EU. Buying a MacBook Air in New York City for instance will be at least $1,300 (combined VAT rate of 8.875%). [EDIT] Granted, the exchange rate is not great, but it's definitely not as bad as you make it sounds. In the EU sticker price is the final price, in the US the sticker price is a baseline on top of which any ridiculous fee and unexpected tax can (and will) be added. Unlike in the EU you really don't know how much you will pay until you get the final bill...

klodolph 8y ago
There’s currently no VAT in the US, there used to be a VAT in Michigan but currently there are only sales and use taxes, which aren’t universal. Buying a MacBoox Air for $1,199 in Oregon will cost $1,199 out of pocket.
- reaperducer 8y ago
  He's using "VAT" as a generic term. Think "sales tax."
- Xixi 8y ago
  Indeed you are correct, I'm not using the term VAT correctly. But here in New York you still have to go through three layers of sales taxes to acquire your MacBook Air: New York City local sales and use tax rate of 4.5%, New York State sales and use tax rate of 4%, and Metropolitan Commuter Transportation District surcharge of 0.375% My main point was that it makes little sense to compare prices US prices without sales tax to EU prices with the VAT included. The second -more subtle- point that I wanted to get into but was really only skimming, is that the very meaning of the price on a sticker is vastly different in the EU and in US. In the EU if you write 1,350 EUR on a sticker, anyone can walk in your store and buy that product at that price without paying a eurocent more. No handling fees, service fees, sales tax or any other obscure hidden tax. This is the law. Sticker price is final price. If it's not on the sticker the merchant has to pay for it. It's quite a shock when you first walk in a store in New York City while visiting from France and the price asked at checkout is not the one written on the sticker. The law is the same for online sales, though shipping costs don't have to be included. Ridiculous $30 dollars "handling fees" or "service fees" on $50 tickets that you print at home, added at the very end of the lengthy checkout process, are to my knowledge completely forbidden. I'll be happy (in fact I'll be sad) to be corrected if I am wrong about that.
  - bluedino 8y ago
    Ironically I buy from stores in New York or New Jersey over the internet and pay no tax in my home state. Adorama or B&H Photo
IkmoIkmo 8y ago
Fair point! But average sales tax in the US is about $100. It's still a $350 difference.
- Xixi 8y ago
  That's not an exchange rate issue, that's a political one. Presumably you get something out of these high sales tax, in the form of cheaper education, cheaper healthcare, better infrastructures, or a better social net. Why would Apple close that gap by charging the American customers more? If you want cheaper sales taxes, vote accordingly. Don't ask Apple to cover the difference. Though you could argue that if Apple was paying its fair share of taxes (for your own favorite definition of fair share of taxes), maybe VAT could be lowered. Again, that's a political issue, not an exchange rate issue.
  - IkmoIkmo 8y ago
    You misunderstand me, I'm saying after you take out the difference in sales tax you're still left with about a $350 gap that has nothing to do with sales tax. I've got no complaints about the sales tax.
    - Xixi 8y ago
      Let's compare prices without sales tax then. US: 1,199 USD vs France: 1,124.17 EUR. 1,124.17 EUR translates to 1,275.31 USD according to Google, at the time of this writing. That's a difference of about 75 USD. Not great, but where do you get a 350 USD gap? [EDIT] That $75 difference could actually be explained by the extra year of warranty for the EU version. Not the greatest bargain maybe, but Apple is hardly ripping off EU customers there. At least not more than the US ones...

by Xixi 8y ago

klodolph 8y ago

There’s currently no VAT in the US, there used to be a VAT in Michigan but currently there are only sales and use taxes, which aren’t universal. Buying a MacBoox Air for $1,199 in Oregon will cost $1,199 out of pocket.

reaperducer 8y ago
He's using "VAT" as a generic term. Think "sales tax."
Xixi 8y ago
Indeed you are correct, I'm not using the term VAT correctly. But here in New York you still have to go through three layers of sales taxes to acquire your MacBook Air: New York City local sales and use tax rate of 4.5%, New York State sales and use tax rate of 4%, and Metropolitan Commuter Transportation District surcharge of 0.375% My main point was that it makes little sense to compare prices US prices without sales tax to EU prices with the VAT included. The second -more subtle- point that I wanted to get into but was really only skimming, is that the very meaning of the price on a sticker is vastly different in the EU and in US. In the EU if you write 1,350 EUR on a sticker, anyone can walk in your store and buy that product at that price without paying a eurocent more. No handling fees, service fees, sales tax or any other obscure hidden tax. This is the law. Sticker price is final price. If it's not on the sticker the merchant has to pay for it. It's quite a shock when you first walk in a store in New York City while visiting from France and the price asked at checkout is not the one written on the sticker. The law is the same for online sales, though shipping costs don't have to be included. Ridiculous $30 dollars "handling fees" or "service fees" on $50 tickets that you print at home, added at the very end of the lengthy checkout process, are to my knowledge completely forbidden. I'll be happy (in fact I'll be sad) to be corrected if I am wrong about that.
- bluedino 8y ago
  Ironically I buy from stores in New York or New Jersey over the internet and pay no tax in my home state. Adorama or B&H Photo

IkmoIkmo 8y ago

Fair point! But average sales tax in the US is about $100. It's still a $350 difference.

Xixi 8y ago
That's not an exchange rate issue, that's a political one. Presumably you get something out of these high sales tax, in the form of cheaper education, cheaper healthcare, better infrastructures, or a better social net. Why would Apple close that gap by charging the American customers more? If you want cheaper sales taxes, vote accordingly. Don't ask Apple to cover the difference. Though you could argue that if Apple was paying its fair share of taxes (for your own favorite definition of fair share of taxes), maybe VAT could be lowered. Again, that's a political issue, not an exchange rate issue.
- IkmoIkmo 8y ago
  You misunderstand me, I'm saying after you take out the difference in sales tax you're still left with about a $350 gap that has nothing to do with sales tax. I've got no complaints about the sales tax.
  - Xixi 8y ago
    Let's compare prices without sales tax then. US: 1,199 USD vs France: 1,124.17 EUR. 1,124.17 EUR translates to 1,275.31 USD according to Google, at the time of this writing. That's a difference of about 75 USD. Not great, but where do you get a 350 USD gap? [EDIT] That $75 difference could actually be explained by the extra year of warranty for the EU version. Not the greatest bargain maybe, but Apple is hardly ripping off EU customers there. At least not more than the US ones...