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The only fully correct term, as used in our laws and in numerous Supreme Court rulings, is "illegal alien". Shortening that to "aliens" causes confusion with le

• code_duck 8y ago
  I’d have to be sarcastic to say that was an interesting or useful perspective to which I had never been introduced. I’ll leave this to other people to battle off HN. Best of luck informing yourself about how to not use perjorative terms to slander vast amounts of people. As far as immigration control, I disagree with your scenario. Since my comment was about people who supposedly abhor regulation, i’d like to make sure to apply the same logic to pollution, financial fraud, lobbying and labor abuse.
• mikeash 8y ago
  Shortening it to “illegals” is weird, though, since it could easily be the shorthand for illegal hunters, illegal employers, illegal polluters, or what have you.
• monocasa 8y ago
  Except being undocumented isn't actually a crime, so they're not committing an illegal act.
  • tropo 8y ago
    I didn't say they were committing an illegal act, although most are. I just said that "illegal alien" is the only correct term under our law. The vast majority are not undocumented. They have fraudulent documentation. Identity theft is not a victimless crime. Overstaying a visa isn't a crime, but getting a visa with the intent to overstay it is a crime. Jumping the border is obviously a crime. Those two methods of entry cover the vast majority. There aren't a lot of people who intended to leave and then just... forgot the visa expiration date or something.
    • code_duck 8y ago
      Coming to the US to pick crops is a victimless ‘crime’. If anyone, the bigger criminals are the US citizens who own the companies, large and small, who hire undocumented workers and know full well they are doing it.
      • masonic 8y ago
        Less than one half of one percent are "picking crops". Most work in hospitality and food prep, indoors.
        • code_duck 8y ago
          Are you saying there is some qualitative difference there, or just adding work examples? Do you use the scare quotes to mean people who come to the US to work cleaning hotels are victimizing US citizens by doing so? Or that you disagree, because I’m wrong and people who prep sandwiches and clean apartments are more to blame for their unlawful employment than their employers? Why would it matter that they're indoors? I’m really confused by what you choose to emphasize. I find it unlikely that agricultural employees make up .5% of Central American immigrants in the US at any given time. That figure sounds low.
    • monocasa 8y ago
      > I just said that "illegal alien" is the only correct term under our law. Except it isn't. https://www.politifact.com/texas/statements/2018/may/09/steve-mccraw/illegal-alien-legal-term-federal-law/ https://www.politifact.com/texas/statements/2018/may/09/stev... It appears in section headers that don't have legal weight behind them, and in reference to aliens who have additionally been convicted of at least on felony. Just saying something doesn't make it true.
      • tropo 8y ago
        Not that politifact is trustworthy, but OK, which alternative do you like? That article lists "unauthorized aliens", "inadmissible aliens" and "deportable aliens". Undocumented is when somebody loses their wallet, so that won't do. These people generally have illegal documentation, possibly even matching your documentation.
• dragonwriter 8y ago
  > The only fully correct term, as used in our laws and in numerous Supreme Court rulings, is "illegal alien". Incorrect. While numerous Supreme Court decisions use “illegal alien” they do not do so exclusively, e.g., Plyler v. Doe (1981) uses, at a minimum, all of (directly, ignoring uses that occur only in quoted material, and consistently reflecting singular though some terms are used in both singular and plural, and some only plural, forms) “illegal alien”, “undocumented child”, “undocumented alien”, “undocumented resident alien”, and “illegal entrant”.