5 ms·

I’ve often thought only being able to down vote with a comment would be a positive. There have been times where I have had posts down voted to hell, and legitim

by donatj 8y ago

I’ve often thought only being able to down vote with a comment would be a positive. There have been times where I have had posts down voted to hell, and legitimately have no idea why. I think having to tell someone why you were down voting would be an improvement. Maybe even work at so down vote comment doesn’t count if it it self has negative karma.

avip 8y ago
That's a very interesting idea. Force constructive feedback.
- weberc2 8y ago
  To downvote, please tell us what you don't like about this comment > asdfasdfasdf
  - mrhappyunhappy 8y ago
    Make it multiple choice not free text. Limit to a few basic reasons. Make that thing pop up for every downvote and watch downvotes reduce over time. Also, maybe assign weights to how often one downvotes. So say you are someone who disagrees often, your downvotes become less and less potent the longer you are in session.
    - weberc2 8y ago
      Honestly my post was mostly a joke, but I don't think mandating a rationale is a good idea, and I give a rationale for ~85% of my downvotes. Probably a third of those don't deserve rationale--I'm responding to someone who is pretty overtly trolling or otherwise trying to incent a flamewar. Beyond that, I will occassionally not leave an explanation because 1. I don't have time to type out an appropriately nuanced comment, and an un-nuanced comment is hardly better qualified than a driveby downvote. 2. No matter the quality of my explanatory comment, it will only be a target for partisan downvoters. I don't care much for my karma, but I do care for my time and I don't want to waste it so trolls can give my view an air of illegitimacy. Besides, while it is annoying to be downvoted anonymously, no one owes me an explanation. It's a courtesy at best, and any attempt to regulate it will be defeated by insincere feedback.
  - donatj 8y ago
    I think that could be resolved by downvotes losing their power if they themselves get downvoted.
    - weberc2 8y ago
      Maybe, but this seems far more likely to only amplify the majority voice. Especially on a platform like Twitter, this would inevitably be used to suppress a dissenting minority more than it is used to encourage thoughtful explanations. Not trying to shoot down suggestions; moderation is hard.
- Fellshard 8y ago
  I somehow doubt it would end up being constructive.
pjc50 8y ago
Slashdot had, 20 years ago, different types of upvote and downvote, so you could say things were "insightful" or "off topic". You could even alter the weightings attached to them so "Funny" would be negative rather than positive. Of course, slashdot was also where I first encountered trolling and regular attempts at posting racial hatred or obscene images into conversations...
- donatj 8y ago
  Slashdots comments these days seem on par with YouTube.
madeofpalk 8y ago
Based on all the people commenting “f” on Facebook to subscribe, I don’t think this would actually change anything.
- pjc50 8y ago
  Surely "f" means "pay respect to", or is that a different meme?
  - madeofpalk 8y ago
    Different - they mean “follow”. Facebook will send you notifications from threads you’ve commented on.
    - xemoka 8y ago
      I don't understand why facebook isn't better at determining the intent of the message: hide messages with "following" "f" or whatever and just subscribe the user to notifications—which they could have done otherwise if the option was made more obvious.
      - danso 8y ago
        Maybe I don't use FB enough but I hadn't heard of this "f" thing (beyond 'F' being a Call of Duty meme). I imagine it's an unexpected usecase for Facebook and one that would better be served by making a prominent "subscribe to notification" feature, rather than coming up with a machine learning solution. What if the parent comment is a quiz type question for which there are answers A through F? Admittedly it's an edge case but it's an example of how diverse the strange ways people use FB for commenting and discussing.
accnumnplus1 8y ago
Careful - the rules say you're not allowed to complain about downvoting. I've made this suggestion myself on a number of occasions in the past, probably different accounts. The quickest approach to problem fixing - the hn approach - have a rule saying don't complain about the problem.
craftyguy 8y ago
lobste.rs makes you select a reason, visible by the author, for downwoting a comment.
city41 8y ago
I think this stems from downvotes being abused. If a comment is well written and constructive, you should not downvote it just because you disagree with it. The real intent of downvotes is to flush away off topic and low effort comments.
dsfyu404ed 8y ago
> There have been times where I have had posts down voted to hell, and legitimately have no idea why. It happens when you've struck a nerve but nobody wants to try and refute you because engaging in debate comes with a risk of you actually being right and them actually being wrong and some part of their ideology hinges on the correctness of whatever you're challenging.

by donatj 8y ago

avip 8y ago

That's a very interesting idea. Force constructive feedback.

weberc2 8y ago
To downvote, please tell us what you don't like about this comment > asdfasdfasdf
- mrhappyunhappy 8y ago
  Make it multiple choice not free text. Limit to a few basic reasons. Make that thing pop up for every downvote and watch downvotes reduce over time. Also, maybe assign weights to how often one downvotes. So say you are someone who disagrees often, your downvotes become less and less potent the longer you are in session.
  - weberc2 8y ago
    Honestly my post was mostly a joke, but I don't think mandating a rationale is a good idea, and I give a rationale for ~85% of my downvotes. Probably a third of those don't deserve rationale--I'm responding to someone who is pretty overtly trolling or otherwise trying to incent a flamewar. Beyond that, I will occassionally not leave an explanation because 1. I don't have time to type out an appropriately nuanced comment, and an un-nuanced comment is hardly better qualified than a driveby downvote. 2. No matter the quality of my explanatory comment, it will only be a target for partisan downvoters. I don't care much for my karma, but I do care for my time and I don't want to waste it so trolls can give my view an air of illegitimacy. Besides, while it is annoying to be downvoted anonymously, no one owes me an explanation. It's a courtesy at best, and any attempt to regulate it will be defeated by insincere feedback.
- donatj 8y ago
  I think that could be resolved by downvotes losing their power if they themselves get downvoted.
  - weberc2 8y ago
    Maybe, but this seems far more likely to only amplify the majority voice. Especially on a platform like Twitter, this would inevitably be used to suppress a dissenting minority more than it is used to encourage thoughtful explanations. Not trying to shoot down suggestions; moderation is hard.
Fellshard 8y ago
I somehow doubt it would end up being constructive.

pjc50 8y ago

Slashdot had, 20 years ago, different types of upvote and downvote, so you could say things were "insightful" or "off topic". You could even alter the weightings attached to them so "Funny" would be negative rather than positive. Of course, slashdot was also where I first encountered trolling and regular attempts at posting racial hatred or obscene images into conversations...

donatj 8y ago
Slashdots comments these days seem on par with YouTube.

madeofpalk 8y ago

Based on all the people commenting “f” on Facebook to subscribe, I don’t think this would actually change anything.

pjc50 8y ago
Surely "f" means "pay respect to", or is that a different meme?
- madeofpalk 8y ago
  Different - they mean “follow”. Facebook will send you notifications from threads you’ve commented on.
  - xemoka 8y ago
    I don't understand why facebook isn't better at determining the intent of the message: hide messages with "following" "f" or whatever and just subscribe the user to notifications—which they could have done otherwise if the option was made more obvious.
    - danso 8y ago
      Maybe I don't use FB enough but I hadn't heard of this "f" thing (beyond 'F' being a Call of Duty meme). I imagine it's an unexpected usecase for Facebook and one that would better be served by making a prominent "subscribe to notification" feature, rather than coming up with a machine learning solution. What if the parent comment is a quiz type question for which there are answers A through F? Admittedly it's an edge case but it's an example of how diverse the strange ways people use FB for commenting and discussing.

accnumnplus1 8y ago

Careful - the rules say you're not allowed to complain about downvoting. I've made this suggestion myself on a number of occasions in the past, probably different accounts. The quickest approach to problem fixing - the hn approach - have a rule saying don't complain about the problem.

craftyguy 8y ago

lobste.rs makes you select a reason, visible by the author, for downwoting a comment.

city41 8y ago

I think this stems from downvotes being abused. If a comment is well written and constructive, you should not downvote it just because you disagree with it. The real intent of downvotes is to flush away off topic and low effort comments.

dsfyu404ed 8y ago

> There have been times where I have had posts down voted to hell, and legitimately have no idea why. It happens when you've struck a nerve but nobody wants to try and refute you because engaging in debate comes with a risk of you actually being right and them actually being wrong and some part of their ideology hinges on the correctness of whatever you're challenging.