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They should do like HN: keep the button but remove the counter visibility. I would like to see this generalized to all social networks actually. You still get t

They should do like HN: keep the button but remove the counter visibility. I would like to see this generalized to all social networks actually. You still get to do an appreciation gesture but without entering the popularity contest. Maybe the author of the post could still see the total. YouTube "dislike" button on comments also works like this, you can dislike but it's not counted. In this case it's a bit stupid since the likes are counted, but I feel it's still an improvement.

buboard 8y ago
basically use it as a squishy toy
xylophoner 8y ago
try it out now: https://bengrosser.com/projects/twitter-demetricator/ https://bengrosser.com/projects/twitter-demetricator/
- mrhappyunhappy 8y ago
  This is awesome and I like your logic. Metrics should be off for every social network by default. All metrics do is breed heard mentality.
TangoTrotFox 8y ago
I'm still not entirely convinced this vote based filtering is really more effective than the basic old chronological threading it 'improved' upon. It opens itself up to extreme gaming and the threaded nature often results in what are, more or less, the exact same conversation chains happening multiple times in different places in a topic. Threaded + votes also results in a very artificial selection of top posts. Posts that are more viewed, and aren't awful, are more likely to get more votes further reinforcing their prioritization. And maybe the most important thing of all. The vast majority of people do not check out new threads. So you get a very artificial selection of topics that end up making it onto the front page, since it's selected by the tiny minority that do view and vote upon the new topics.
donatj 8y ago
I’ve often thought only being able to down vote with a comment would be a positive. There have been times where I have had posts down voted to hell, and legitimately have no idea why. I think having to tell someone why you were down voting would be an improvement. Maybe even work at so down vote comment doesn’t count if it it self has negative karma.
- avip 8y ago
  That's a very interesting idea. Force constructive feedback.
  - weberc2 8y ago
    To downvote, please tell us what you don't like about this comment > asdfasdfasdf
    - mrhappyunhappy 8y ago
      Make it multiple choice not free text. Limit to a few basic reasons. Make that thing pop up for every downvote and watch downvotes reduce over time. Also, maybe assign weights to how often one downvotes. So say you are someone who disagrees often, your downvotes become less and less potent the longer you are in session.
      - weberc2 8y ago
        Honestly my post was mostly a joke, but I don't think mandating a rationale is a good idea, and I give a rationale for ~85% of my downvotes. Probably a third of those don't deserve rationale--I'm responding to someone who is pretty overtly trolling or otherwise trying to incent a flamewar. Beyond that, I will occassionally not leave an explanation because 1. I don't have time to type out an appropriately nuanced comment, and an un-nuanced comment is hardly better qualified than a driveby downvote. 2. No matter the quality of my explanatory comment, it will only be a target for partisan downvoters. I don't care much for my karma, but I do care for my time and I don't want to waste it so trolls can give my view an air of illegitimacy. Besides, while it is annoying to be downvoted anonymously, no one owes me an explanation. It's a courtesy at best, and any attempt to regulate it will be defeated by insincere feedback.
appleiigs 8y ago
For HN, I think up-votes and down-votes counts should be shown individually. The comments with no up-votes and lots of downvotes would go grey - universally considered bad. The comments with lots of up-votes and down-votes, but with net down, indicates controversial opinion but with some support/validity.

buboard 8y ago

basically use it as a squishy toy

xylophoner 8y ago

try it out now: https://bengrosser.com/projects/twitter-demetricator/ https://bengrosser.com/projects/twitter-demetricator/

mrhappyunhappy 8y ago
This is awesome and I like your logic. Metrics should be off for every social network by default. All metrics do is breed heard mentality.

TangoTrotFox 8y ago

I'm still not entirely convinced this vote based filtering is really more effective than the basic old chronological threading it 'improved' upon. It opens itself up to extreme gaming and the threaded nature often results in what are, more or less, the exact same conversation chains happening multiple times in different places in a topic. Threaded + votes also results in a very artificial selection of top posts. Posts that are more viewed, and aren't awful, are more likely to get more votes further reinforcing their prioritization. And maybe the most important thing of all. The vast majority of people do not check out new threads. So you get a very artificial selection of topics that end up making it onto the front page, since it's selected by the tiny minority that do view and vote upon the new topics.

donatj 8y ago

I’ve often thought only being able to down vote with a comment would be a positive. There have been times where I have had posts down voted to hell, and legitimately have no idea why. I think having to tell someone why you were down voting would be an improvement. Maybe even work at so down vote comment doesn’t count if it it self has negative karma.

avip 8y ago
That's a very interesting idea. Force constructive feedback.
- weberc2 8y ago
  To downvote, please tell us what you don't like about this comment > asdfasdfasdf
  - mrhappyunhappy 8y ago
    Make it multiple choice not free text. Limit to a few basic reasons. Make that thing pop up for every downvote and watch downvotes reduce over time. Also, maybe assign weights to how often one downvotes. So say you are someone who disagrees often, your downvotes become less and less potent the longer you are in session.
    - weberc2 8y ago
      Honestly my post was mostly a joke, but I don't think mandating a rationale is a good idea, and I give a rationale for ~85% of my downvotes. Probably a third of those don't deserve rationale--I'm responding to someone who is pretty overtly trolling or otherwise trying to incent a flamewar. Beyond that, I will occassionally not leave an explanation because 1. I don't have time to type out an appropriately nuanced comment, and an un-nuanced comment is hardly better qualified than a driveby downvote. 2. No matter the quality of my explanatory comment, it will only be a target for partisan downvoters. I don't care much for my karma, but I do care for my time and I don't want to waste it so trolls can give my view an air of illegitimacy. Besides, while it is annoying to be downvoted anonymously, no one owes me an explanation. It's a courtesy at best, and any attempt to regulate it will be defeated by insincere feedback.

appleiigs 8y ago

For HN, I think up-votes and down-votes counts should be shown individually. The comments with no up-votes and lots of downvotes would go grey - universally considered bad. The comments with lots of up-votes and down-votes, but with net down, indicates controversial opinion but with some support/validity.