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> It’s not done from malice, just good-natured ribbing about our differences. I'm Québécois. My family has been Québécois for hundreds of years. My first langu

> It’s not done from malice, just good-natured ribbing about our differences. I'm Québécois. My family has been Québécois for hundreds of years. My first language was French but I spoke English from a very young age, and went to a mixture of English and French schools. I watch Québécois movies and tv shows, listen to Québécois music and radio, and cook traditional Québécois food for myself and friends every chance I get. I can't vouch for any of the other Canadian subcultures you've named, but I can assure you that I never enjoyed the taunting, the name calling, the literal physical violence (I got beat up many times as kid because I was "one of those fucking French frogs"), and not to mention the inevitable eye rolling and pointed questions about why my particular cultural heritage was even allowed to exist in Canada. Some people view us as some sort of blight that needs to be eradicated because we don't fit the mould of what a "Canadian" is. I've had people tell me to my face that they "can't wait for the French to just die off in this country", and then laugh because they think it's a funny joke. I'm not saying everyone is like that, and things seem to have softened in the past few decades, but please don't believe that we enjoy being marginalized.

cal5k 8y ago
I mean hey - that really sucks. It sounds like you've met some shitty people. It doesn't change the fact that good-natured ribbing is really common in cross-cultural contexts. I grew up in Ottawa, a really bilingual city, and making fun of each other was part of how we all bonded in spite of our differences. Intent matters.
- jperras 8y ago
  > Intent matters. There’s an entire aphorism dedicated to the idea that intentions and effects are often vastly different. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_road_to_hell_is_paved_with_good_intentions https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_road_to_hell_is_paved_wi...
- rfrey 8y ago
  Intent matters, but so does being aware of the effect of "punching down". Ontario, specifically Ottawa and Toronto, dominate so much in Canada, that people in repressed Quebec, impoverished PEI, or one of Ontario's western colonies may not appreciate it as much as you think.
  - cal5k 8y ago
    I find this claim that Quebec is a repressed province bizarre, particularly when more Prime Ministers have hailed from Quebec than any other province (including Ontario): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Prime_Ministers_of_Canada_by_constituency https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Prime_Ministers_of_Can...
pasbesoin 8y ago
Hearing a 20-something Albertan casually reference "frogs" made the bottom drop out of my stomach. (This was the better part of 20 years ago.) They'd never call someone that, face-to-face out on the patch, but the disdain was apparent. And the superficiality. Montreal is one of my favorite cities -- warts and all. (No pun intended, although now I see it.) This person reduced to using the term "frog" had never been to Quebec and had not even taken the time to learn the basics about the place, people, and culture. Canada has assholes, like everywhere else. Fortunately, on balance, I've found Canadians a lovely people. Not perfect -- but then again, not particularly trying to be, either. Good, not "perfect". Or so, as an American, I need to hope. Some place better than what we are becoming. The wheel turns... P.S. Shawarma Poutine. Whoever's appropriating what, I've made a mental note, for the next time I'm up there.
- jperras 8y ago
  > Hearing a 20-something Albertan casually reference "frogs" made the bottom drop out of my stomach. (This was the better part of 20 years ago.) Still happens today, really. Lots of casual cultural/ethnic (if you consider Quebecois an ethnicity, which is an argument that can be made) racism that is somehow okay. Like how the Irish are often derided as being a bunch of drunks; I'm sure they love that. I think it got better for a while due to social mobility and the ease of travel - it's harder to blindly dislike or hate a culture when you actually spend some meaningful time immersed in it. But with the recent rise of very nationalistic tendencies across many countries (Canada included, sadly, and from both the French and English populations), I'm worried things will regress. > P.S. Shawarma Poutine. Whoever's appropriating what, I've made a mental note, for the next time I'm up there. Oh it's delicious. And as someone pointed out earlier in the comments, I wouldn't call that appropriation. There's a heavy Lebanese/Middle Eastern influence in cuisine, especially in Montréal, due to the partially shared language (French is a common 2nd language for people that live in Lebanon).
danoli 8y ago
Same experience here. That said, I think the tartiflette to be superior (seriously, look it up). You just can't get the special "mountain cheese" (Reblochon) at a reasonable price here.

cal5k 8y ago

I mean hey - that really sucks. It sounds like you've met some shitty people. It doesn't change the fact that good-natured ribbing is really common in cross-cultural contexts. I grew up in Ottawa, a really bilingual city, and making fun of each other was part of how we all bonded in spite of our differences. Intent matters.

jperras 8y ago
> Intent matters. There’s an entire aphorism dedicated to the idea that intentions and effects are often vastly different. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_road_to_hell_is_paved_with_good_intentions https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_road_to_hell_is_paved_wi...
rfrey 8y ago
Intent matters, but so does being aware of the effect of "punching down". Ontario, specifically Ottawa and Toronto, dominate so much in Canada, that people in repressed Quebec, impoverished PEI, or one of Ontario's western colonies may not appreciate it as much as you think.
- cal5k 8y ago
  I find this claim that Quebec is a repressed province bizarre, particularly when more Prime Ministers have hailed from Quebec than any other province (including Ontario): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Prime_Ministers_of_Canada_by_constituency https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Prime_Ministers_of_Can...

pasbesoin 8y ago

Hearing a 20-something Albertan casually reference "frogs" made the bottom drop out of my stomach. (This was the better part of 20 years ago.) They'd never call someone that, face-to-face out on the patch, but the disdain was apparent. And the superficiality. Montreal is one of my favorite cities -- warts and all. (No pun intended, although now I see it.) This person reduced to using the term "frog" had never been to Quebec and had not even taken the time to learn the basics about the place, people, and culture. Canada has assholes, like everywhere else. Fortunately, on balance, I've found Canadians a lovely people. Not perfect -- but then again, not particularly trying to be, either. Good, not "perfect". Or so, as an American, I need to hope. Some place better than what we are becoming. The wheel turns... P.S. Shawarma Poutine. Whoever's appropriating what, I've made a mental note, for the next time I'm up there.

jperras 8y ago
> Hearing a 20-something Albertan casually reference "frogs" made the bottom drop out of my stomach. (This was the better part of 20 years ago.) Still happens today, really. Lots of casual cultural/ethnic (if you consider Quebecois an ethnicity, which is an argument that can be made) racism that is somehow okay. Like how the Irish are often derided as being a bunch of drunks; I'm sure they love that. I think it got better for a while due to social mobility and the ease of travel - it's harder to blindly dislike or hate a culture when you actually spend some meaningful time immersed in it. But with the recent rise of very nationalistic tendencies across many countries (Canada included, sadly, and from both the French and English populations), I'm worried things will regress. > P.S. Shawarma Poutine. Whoever's appropriating what, I've made a mental note, for the next time I'm up there. Oh it's delicious. And as someone pointed out earlier in the comments, I wouldn't call that appropriation. There's a heavy Lebanese/Middle Eastern influence in cuisine, especially in Montréal, due to the partially shared language (French is a common 2nd language for people that live in Lebanon).

danoli 8y ago

Same experience here. That said, I think the tartiflette to be superior (seriously, look it up). You just can't get the special "mountain cheese" (Reblochon) at a reasonable price here.