6 ms·

I'm native arabic speaker too, and can tell you that your statement is far from the truth. Arabic is far more simple language with fewer exceptions than english

by smel 8y ago

I'm native arabic speaker too, and can tell you that your statement is far from the truth. Arabic is far more simple language with fewer exceptions than english or french (I love/speak french :D). There are only 3 tenses: Also it's derivational language which mean once you learn about a verb you actually learn about the whole lexical family of the verb. In english for example you have : Book, Author, Library In Arabic (kitaab, kaatib, maktaba) which is the same root (k,t,b) and with simple rules you can discover all those words or even invent them if not used previously The big problem of arabic as language is arabic societies/people/... but the language itself is a gem. https://blogs.transparent.com/arabic/the-arabic-morphological-measure/ https://blogs.transparent.com/arabic/the-arabic-morphologica...

namanyayg 8y ago
The translation is Book, Author, Library; (kitaab, kaatib, maktaba); respectively.
- smel 8y ago
  Good catch ! Thank you
avaika 8y ago
I'd argue that Arabic is simpler than English. It might have been simpler for you as your were the native :) For me Arabic and English both are foreign and I can definitely tell you that English was much simpler to learn. While words "transformation" might seem cool and convenient, there is no common rule on how to predict final meaning. Also the pronunciation is very (VERY) important. One tiny mistake and you will end up telling your girlfriend that you have a gift from deep of your dog (كلب/ Kalb) instead of deep of your heart (قلب / K'alb).
- smel 8y ago
  you're right ! and a little bit biased because pronunciation is important for all languages out there I see the same issue with french foreign speakers too. In Arabic pronunciation is straight forward, in english pronunciation depends on each word (a,u,o) can have a different sounds (depends in which word used) and the emphasis also is a dark magic :D there are no such exceptions in Arabic Arabic can be difficult but simple. English can be easy but complex.
  - abol3z 8y ago
    I agree with you, I even think that Arabic speakers are the best at understanding foreigners speech. As he pointed, you might tell your girlfriend this is a gift from your dog (كلب) instead of heart (قلب), but I'm sure that if she is a native speaker, she'll understand correctly. I've seen the same mistakes happen in other languages, but the native speaker usually miss the meaning. I think this relates to the fact that Arabic spoken language has a vast number is unique dialects, and they mostly understand each others dialects, unlike other languages that differs between dialects mostly in spelling sounds.
    - hedvig 8y ago
      And language aside, a partner that is willing to meet you halfway in understanding is a great partner. :)
  - afarrell 8y ago
    > in english pronunciation depends on each word (a,u,o) can have a different sounds (depends in which word used) It is also highly regional. Someone from Glasgow pronounces things rather differently to someone from Brighton.
    - bunderbunder 8y ago
      Is it as regional as Arabic, though? I don't speak Arabic, but my understanding is that someone from Morocco can't necessarily hold an easy conversation with someone from Qatar. Whereas, I can name very few varieties of English that aren't easily mutually intelligible with basically all of the rest of the English-speaking world - patois and gullah, for example.
      - Salamat 8y ago
        In my work, I have colleagues from all Arabic countries among others, I talk to people of Morroco and my Arabic is more Levante, with no issue at all. Syrian dialect, along with Egyptian, has gained a lot of ease in the region due to popular tv series and movies (more Egyptian than Syrian ones)I predict that the variations will be reduced since the differences grow out of old geographical barriers that gave distinctions and differences. There is a lesser strict everyday language that is very simple yet formal Arabic, as in the news, be it TV or online. So please look further before jumping to conclusions, as in the region you would read the news regardless of the geographical aspect of the source. If an Arabic website in Morroco has a compelling news story, or article speakers of Arabic in the whole region and abroad will read it very comfortably.
- eudora 8y ago
  That's a totally different letter, not a different pronunciation.. It's like confusing thumb with sum
  - posterboy 8y ago
    ... which likely happens as well.
babayega2 8y ago
"In english for example you have : Book, Author, Library In Arabic (kitaab, kaatib, maktaba) which is the same root (k,t,b)" I see might not be difficult for me to learn it since I know Swahili (the most commonly spoken language in East Africa, which has Arab influence) since those words are pronounced respectively: Kitabu(book), Katibu(secretary), Maktaba(library). Arab is not really complicated. Trust me, I'm accustomed to more troublesome dialects in Africa.
int_19h 8y ago
> In english for example you have : Book, Author, Library In Arabic (kitaab, kaatib, maktaba) which is the same root (k,t,b) and with simple rules you can discover all those words or even invent them if not used previously I don't see why the word for "author" has to be derived from the same root as "book", logically speaking. There are a great deal more things than books that have authors. The reason why this particular root that you've picked produces differences between "book" and "library" in most European languages is because they had two major sources from which their roots were borrowed: Latin (where "book" is "liber") and Greek (where "book" is "biblio"); and both roots were borrowed and used in this case. However, for most roots, the principle is exactly the same in European languages - a single common root produces a whole family of words, and new words are derived as needed. It's not something that's unique to Arabic.
- mohamedattahri 8y ago
  Indeed, many languages have a concept of root from which words must be derived. In Arabic, it’s much more pronounced, because knowing the root of a word is essential to being able to use the language effectively. 2 of may favorite things about the language: 1/ fun fact is that the vast majority of verbs have only 3 letters in them 2/ Pronouns make a distinction between one, two or more people, and even indicate whether the subject is present or absent. I find it extremely powerful.
  - deleted 8y ago
    [deleted]
  - posterboy 8y ago
    The concept word is not clearly defined. As a programmer it seems natural to assume that a word is a short series of bits. Anything else is composition. Why is of a word but -ed isn't? ab- is from the same origion, as in aberrant. The difference isn't completely arbitrary. Bio Logy might as well be two wods. The keyword is lexicalization and how words are learned. Obviously, shorter words are easier to discover.
- kissickas 8y ago
  > There are a great deal more things than books that have authors And those things all have their own words for their authors, as well. poetry - sha3r poet - shaa3r composition (the noun of the verb) - ta2leef composition (the thing written) - mu2allaf composer - mu2allef letter, correspondance - resala messenger - rasool correspondent (like a news reporter) - murasel You can also use kaateb for the author of a letter or perhaps a poem, but not really a symphony. Just like you wouldn't use author. Pardon the use of the numbers in words - it's how people represent letters that aren't in English in Arabic.
simias 8y ago
I love learning languages and learning about languages. I considered seriously learning Arabic but I eventually decided against it mainly because, as the parent points out, there seem to be many variations between countries and also between formal, literary arabic and the spoken dialects. Given that learning the language (in any form) is probably going to be a huge challenge the prospect of spending years studying the idiom only to end up in an arabophone country and not being able to fluently converse with anybody felt discouraging. I eventually decided that I would focus on learning Russian instead, an other very difficult but obviously completely different languages (although it also features declensions and relatively simple conjugations minus the aspect thingy). Do you think I was mistaken?
- nbvkkiauhvcr 8y ago
  Even though there are many dialects, nobody will misunderstand you. And, beyond that, it’s easy for everyone to shift to using a more formal Arabic in order to communicate with you.
  - kkarakk 8y ago
    yes but you are judged based on the dialect you speak, i have experienced cases where i wasn't taken seriously by businessmen coz i spoke a turkish variant of arabic in saudi arabia
  - Cyph0n 8y ago
    True, but North African dialects in general are not understood at all by Middle Easterners. Further, some of the Gulf dialects (e.g., Iraqi, Omani, Yemeni) can be hard to understand.
- eudora 8y ago
  You would just learn Egyptian or Lebanese arabic, everyone would understand you. Written (formal) arabic is a different story though, I think that's what's commonly taught for non arabic people
  - Cyph0n 8y ago
isolli 8y ago
It reminds me of Czech, where a fixed list of prefixes can be used to modify the meaning of any verb, with very creative possibilities! https://mluvtecesky.net/en/grammar/prefixes https://mluvtecesky.net/en/grammar/prefixes
- skocznymroczny 8y ago
  Same in Polish, with some curse words providing very flexible bases for every situation.
  - memsom 8y ago
    Do you know of a resource that shows pictograms for Polish like the one the parent shows? My partner is Polish and I’m slowly acquiring the language, butI have always struggled to visualise the meanings of the Polish equivalent prefixes
    - mbel 8y ago
      Most of them are the same as in Polish. The "prefixes" are called "przyimek" (plural przyimki) in Polish, try googling for that. Here's an example: https://i.pinimg.com/originals/73/ad/c8/73adc83b89ba15c7a79fb661008b041b.jpg https://i.pinimg.com/originals/73/ad/c8/73adc83b89ba15c7a79f...
  - v_lisivka 8y ago
    Same in many other indo-european languages. See Language tree: https://images.mentalfloss.com/sites/default/files/196.jpg https://images.mentalfloss.com/sites/default/files/196.jpg
DigitalHobo 8y ago
> Arabic is far more simple language with fewer exceptions than english or french Would you say this is true of spoken english as well? By that I mean, a large amount of the difficulty involving english involves our train-wreck of spelling rules, spoken english on the other hand tends to be reasonably easy to become functional in (apart from idioms). Would you say that Arabic is simpler than purely spoken english as well?
- mohamedattahri 8y ago
  I would say that English is somewhat hard, mostly because of the exceptions in the past participate, words that are NOT - edit - spelled phonetically, making it hard to learn new words, and there are many tenses - not as many as in French, most of which are misused when casually speaking.
- t-3 8y ago
  English spelling is a feature, not a bug. You can tell the origin of nearly any word by it's spelling, and knowing that gives you clues to pronunciation and grammar. If you're ignorant of latin and more modern European languages it might be difficult though.
  - deleted 8y ago
    [deleted]
  - dorfsmay 8y ago
    But spelling keeps changing. What's the origin behind "check", as in checkbook?
kkarakk 8y ago
yeah sure at an academic level arabic is tres beautiful just like french but realistically none of that translates to everyday spoken arabic to the point where you have to learn a different dialect based on who you want to sound like - a denizen of a country, a foreigner or a bedouin. arabic is one of those languages where there are so many local modifications going on it's insane amounts of effort to be known as "fluent" and "understandable". people in arabia even use emojis differently for crissakes

by smel 8y ago

namanyayg 8y ago

The translation is Book, Author, Library; (kitaab, kaatib, maktaba); respectively.

smel 8y ago
Good catch ! Thank you

avaika 8y ago

I'd argue that Arabic is simpler than English. It might have been simpler for you as your were the native :) For me Arabic and English both are foreign and I can definitely tell you that English was much simpler to learn. While words "transformation" might seem cool and convenient, there is no common rule on how to predict final meaning. Also the pronunciation is very (VERY) important. One tiny mistake and you will end up telling your girlfriend that you have a gift from deep of your dog (كلب/ Kalb) instead of deep of your heart (قلب / K'alb).

smel 8y ago
you're right ! and a little bit biased because pronunciation is important for all languages out there I see the same issue with french foreign speakers too. In Arabic pronunciation is straight forward, in english pronunciation depends on each word (a,u,o) can have a different sounds (depends in which word used) and the emphasis also is a dark magic :D there are no such exceptions in Arabic Arabic can be difficult but simple. English can be easy but complex.
- abol3z 8y ago
  I agree with you, I even think that Arabic speakers are the best at understanding foreigners speech. As he pointed, you might tell your girlfriend this is a gift from your dog (كلب) instead of heart (قلب), but I'm sure that if she is a native speaker, she'll understand correctly. I've seen the same mistakes happen in other languages, but the native speaker usually miss the meaning. I think this relates to the fact that Arabic spoken language has a vast number is unique dialects, and they mostly understand each others dialects, unlike other languages that differs between dialects mostly in spelling sounds.
  - hedvig 8y ago
    And language aside, a partner that is willing to meet you halfway in understanding is a great partner. :)
- afarrell 8y ago
  > in english pronunciation depends on each word (a,u,o) can have a different sounds (depends in which word used) It is also highly regional. Someone from Glasgow pronounces things rather differently to someone from Brighton.
  - bunderbunder 8y ago
    Is it as regional as Arabic, though? I don't speak Arabic, but my understanding is that someone from Morocco can't necessarily hold an easy conversation with someone from Qatar. Whereas, I can name very few varieties of English that aren't easily mutually intelligible with basically all of the rest of the English-speaking world - patois and gullah, for example.
    - Salamat 8y ago
      In my work, I have colleagues from all Arabic countries among others, I talk to people of Morroco and my Arabic is more Levante, with no issue at all. Syrian dialect, along with Egyptian, has gained a lot of ease in the region due to popular tv series and movies (more Egyptian than Syrian ones)I predict that the variations will be reduced since the differences grow out of old geographical barriers that gave distinctions and differences. There is a lesser strict everyday language that is very simple yet formal Arabic, as in the news, be it TV or online. So please look further before jumping to conclusions, as in the region you would read the news regardless of the geographical aspect of the source. If an Arabic website in Morroco has a compelling news story, or article speakers of Arabic in the whole region and abroad will read it very comfortably.
eudora 8y ago
That's a totally different letter, not a different pronunciation.. It's like confusing thumb with sum
- posterboy 8y ago
  ... which likely happens as well.

babayega2 8y ago

"In english for example you have : Book, Author, Library In Arabic (kitaab, kaatib, maktaba) which is the same root (k,t,b)" I see might not be difficult for me to learn it since I know Swahili (the most commonly spoken language in East Africa, which has Arab influence) since those words are pronounced respectively: Kitabu(book), Katibu(secretary), Maktaba(library). Arab is not really complicated. Trust me, I'm accustomed to more troublesome dialects in Africa.

int_19h 8y ago

> In english for example you have : Book, Author, Library In Arabic (kitaab, kaatib, maktaba) which is the same root (k,t,b) and with simple rules you can discover all those words or even invent them if not used previously I don't see why the word for "author" has to be derived from the same root as "book", logically speaking. There are a great deal more things than books that have authors. The reason why this particular root that you've picked produces differences between "book" and "library" in most European languages is because they had two major sources from which their roots were borrowed: Latin (where "book" is "liber") and Greek (where "book" is "biblio"); and both roots were borrowed and used in this case. However, for most roots, the principle is exactly the same in European languages - a single common root produces a whole family of words, and new words are derived as needed. It's not something that's unique to Arabic.

mohamedattahri 8y ago
Indeed, many languages have a concept of root from which words must be derived. In Arabic, it’s much more pronounced, because knowing the root of a word is essential to being able to use the language effectively. 2 of may favorite things about the language: 1/ fun fact is that the vast majority of verbs have only 3 letters in them 2/ Pronouns make a distinction between one, two or more people, and even indicate whether the subject is present or absent. I find it extremely powerful.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
- posterboy 8y ago
  The concept word is not clearly defined. As a programmer it seems natural to assume that a word is a short series of bits. Anything else is composition. Why is of a word but -ed isn't? ab- is from the same origion, as in aberrant. The difference isn't completely arbitrary. Bio Logy might as well be two wods. The keyword is lexicalization and how words are learned. Obviously, shorter words are easier to discover.
kissickas 8y ago
> There are a great deal more things than books that have authors And those things all have their own words for their authors, as well. poetry - sha3r poet - shaa3r composition (the noun of the verb) - ta2leef composition (the thing written) - mu2allaf composer - mu2allef letter, correspondance - resala messenger - rasool correspondent (like a news reporter) - murasel You can also use kaateb for the author of a letter or perhaps a poem, but not really a symphony. Just like you wouldn't use author. Pardon the use of the numbers in words - it's how people represent letters that aren't in English in Arabic.

simias 8y ago

I love learning languages and learning about languages. I considered seriously learning Arabic but I eventually decided against it mainly because, as the parent points out, there seem to be many variations between countries and also between formal, literary arabic and the spoken dialects. Given that learning the language (in any form) is probably going to be a huge challenge the prospect of spending years studying the idiom only to end up in an arabophone country and not being able to fluently converse with anybody felt discouraging. I eventually decided that I would focus on learning Russian instead, an other very difficult but obviously completely different languages (although it also features declensions and relatively simple conjugations minus the aspect thingy). Do you think I was mistaken?

nbvkkiauhvcr 8y ago
Even though there are many dialects, nobody will misunderstand you. And, beyond that, it’s easy for everyone to shift to using a more formal Arabic in order to communicate with you.
- kkarakk 8y ago
  yes but you are judged based on the dialect you speak, i have experienced cases where i wasn't taken seriously by businessmen coz i spoke a turkish variant of arabic in saudi arabia
- Cyph0n 8y ago
  True, but North African dialects in general are not understood at all by Middle Easterners. Further, some of the Gulf dialects (e.g., Iraqi, Omani, Yemeni) can be hard to understand.
eudora 8y ago
You would just learn Egyptian or Lebanese arabic, everyone would understand you. Written (formal) arabic is a different story though, I think that's what's commonly taught for non arabic people
- Cyph0n 8y ago

isolli 8y ago

It reminds me of Czech, where a fixed list of prefixes can be used to modify the meaning of any verb, with very creative possibilities! https://mluvtecesky.net/en/grammar/prefixes https://mluvtecesky.net/en/grammar/prefixes

skocznymroczny 8y ago
Same in Polish, with some curse words providing very flexible bases for every situation.
- memsom 8y ago
  Do you know of a resource that shows pictograms for Polish like the one the parent shows? My partner is Polish and I’m slowly acquiring the language, butI have always struggled to visualise the meanings of the Polish equivalent prefixes
  - mbel 8y ago
    Most of them are the same as in Polish. The "prefixes" are called "przyimek" (plural przyimki) in Polish, try googling for that. Here's an example: https://i.pinimg.com/originals/73/ad/c8/73adc83b89ba15c7a79fb661008b041b.jpg https://i.pinimg.com/originals/73/ad/c8/73adc83b89ba15c7a79f...
- v_lisivka 8y ago
  Same in many other indo-european languages. See Language tree: https://images.mentalfloss.com/sites/default/files/196.jpg https://images.mentalfloss.com/sites/default/files/196.jpg

DigitalHobo 8y ago

> Arabic is far more simple language with fewer exceptions than english or french Would you say this is true of spoken english as well? By that I mean, a large amount of the difficulty involving english involves our train-wreck of spelling rules, spoken english on the other hand tends to be reasonably easy to become functional in (apart from idioms). Would you say that Arabic is simpler than purely spoken english as well?

mohamedattahri 8y ago
I would say that English is somewhat hard, mostly because of the exceptions in the past participate, words that are NOT - edit - spelled phonetically, making it hard to learn new words, and there are many tenses - not as many as in French, most of which are misused when casually speaking.
t-3 8y ago
English spelling is a feature, not a bug. You can tell the origin of nearly any word by it's spelling, and knowing that gives you clues to pronunciation and grammar. If you're ignorant of latin and more modern European languages it might be difficult though.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
- dorfsmay 8y ago
  But spelling keeps changing. What's the origin behind "check", as in checkbook?

kkarakk 8y ago

yeah sure at an academic level arabic is tres beautiful just like french but realistically none of that translates to everyday spoken arabic to the point where you have to learn a different dialect based on who you want to sound like - a denizen of a country, a foreigner or a bedouin. arabic is one of those languages where there are so many local modifications going on it's insane amounts of effort to be known as "fluent" and "understandable". people in arabia even use emojis differently for crissakes