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This is why I think much of Christian thought is actually quite intelligent. (Summary by a very intellectually and spiritually deficient moron): I am pathetic,

This is why I think much of Christian thought is actually quite intelligent. (Summary by a very intellectually and spiritually deficient moron): I am pathetic, my desires are all almost certainly evil, I can probably not even think one good thought let alone have a good intention without divine help. God, please please please please have mercy and grant me some very much needed horror of self and conformity to your will and help me to not become a puffed up moron who is full of himself if one seemingly desirable thing happens to me, which is certainly what is going to happen unless the literal creator of the universe helps me to do it a little bit less. Of course none of the American Protestant Christians I know will like it if you say that since they seem to think Christianity is about being a millionaire who gives 30% to charity and doesn’t have premarital sex too much

isoskeles 8y ago
> horror of self Not being obtuse: what do you mean here?
- polynomial 8y ago
  I would say it is a wish for spiritual insight into the nature of self-ishness, how it is a root cause of evil in the world, and presumably the related Christian tenet that it's not a 'fixable' problem without cultivating a divine relationship to the creator or source. But I would just be guessing.
  - goatlover 8y ago
    Then again, if everyone were selfish in a cat-like way that everyone else can fuck off, we wouldn't have wars, genocide, slavery, abuse of power, or terrorism. So there's something more to it than just being selfish. Something to do with our tribal, hierarchal tendencies where one alpha ape can convince the rest of us to do violence against those other groups, who get blamed for all our problems.
    - deleted 8y ago
      [deleted]
- davidhperry 8y ago
  > Not being obtuse: what do you mean here? I think internet555 was trying to suggest something about the duality of man, sir.
  - internet555 8y ago
    That’s what all my posts are about
SOMMS 8y ago
Yes. This exactly.
danans 8y ago
> grant me ... conformity to your will The "your will" is the part that gets interpreted, either by the individual, often with the help of an outside institution, to serve whatever objective they seek. Perhaps that objective is a good one, or maybe it's horrifying. Such a professed humility to a God's will could also just be serving as a cover for whatever else the person is doing. History is replete with examples of that. But at that point, you are back to where we started: needing to understand and judge the intent of people and the institutions that they take guidance from. EDIT: wording clarification
clairity 8y ago
to help make sense of this apparent contradiction, i'd suggest separating christianity the religion from the underlying philosophy of jesus. most people generally admire jesus's moral philosophy, but non-religious folks (e.g., humanists) find the various religions and sub-sects to be distasteful because, while there are some good people within, those organizations largely exist to concentrate and perpetuate power (which religious leaders would argue helps them with their mission of salvation).

isoskeles 8y ago

> horror of self Not being obtuse: what do you mean here?

polynomial 8y ago
I would say it is a wish for spiritual insight into the nature of self-ishness, how it is a root cause of evil in the world, and presumably the related Christian tenet that it's not a 'fixable' problem without cultivating a divine relationship to the creator or source. But I would just be guessing.
- goatlover 8y ago
  Then again, if everyone were selfish in a cat-like way that everyone else can fuck off, we wouldn't have wars, genocide, slavery, abuse of power, or terrorism. So there's something more to it than just being selfish. Something to do with our tribal, hierarchal tendencies where one alpha ape can convince the rest of us to do violence against those other groups, who get blamed for all our problems.
  - deleted 8y ago
    [deleted]
davidhperry 8y ago
> Not being obtuse: what do you mean here? I think internet555 was trying to suggest something about the duality of man, sir.
- internet555 8y ago
  That’s what all my posts are about

SOMMS 8y ago

Yes. This exactly.

danans 8y ago

> grant me ... conformity to your will The "your will" is the part that gets interpreted, either by the individual, often with the help of an outside institution, to serve whatever objective they seek. Perhaps that objective is a good one, or maybe it's horrifying. Such a professed humility to a God's will could also just be serving as a cover for whatever else the person is doing. History is replete with examples of that. But at that point, you are back to where we started: needing to understand and judge the intent of people and the institutions that they take guidance from. EDIT: wording clarification

clairity 8y ago

to help make sense of this apparent contradiction, i'd suggest separating christianity the religion from the underlying philosophy of jesus. most people generally admire jesus's moral philosophy, but non-religious folks (e.g., humanists) find the various religions and sub-sects to be distasteful because, while there are some good people within, those organizations largely exist to concentrate and perpetuate power (which religious leaders would argue helps them with their mission of salvation).