4 ms·
> bernie sanders calling open borders a "Koch brother" conspiracy. Quite right. It wasn't just that Bernie disagrees with open borders, in that video he is vis
by rdtsc 8y ago
> bernie sanders calling open borders a "Koch brother" conspiracy.
Quite right. It wasn't just that Bernie disagrees with open borders, in that video he is visibly upset. He really doesn't like it.
(It was the Vox interview I assume, unless you saw another one)
Also if you are old enough you might remember large anti-globalization protests around G8, Bilderberg and other such meetings.
It is kind of baffling how just a decade ago left groups were getting teargassed fighting globalization and now they are openly advocating it.
Such is the power of propaganda. It is extremely effective and could turn pink into blue, and then yellow with some moderate effort.
I suggest everyone read Chomsky and Herman's Manufacturing Consent. It was actual when it was written and just as actual even if not more today.
Speaking of Chomsky, find his writings on NAFTA and globalization as well. It might also surprise you what he has to say.
- joshuamorton 8y agoThere's a wide variety of positions between "open borders" and "forcibly take refugee children away from their families and put both in detention facilities". One can object to the latter without supporting the former.
- sheepmullet 8y agoIn theory - in practice though we have had decades of weak borders.
- joshuamorton 8y agoWeak borders are still not open borders, and I again ask that you not conflate the two.
- exabrial 8y agoPlease name a crime where you are allowed to take your children with you when you're arrested.
- joshuamorton 8y agoRequesting asylum is not a crime, so I'm confused by this request.
- exabrial 8y agoI think that's more than valid. Does doing so require always crossing border illegally? Also, what percentage of people are under a legitimate threat of their lives (or relatives)?
- joshuamorton 8y agoWhy are you focusing on people who entered the country illegally? The trump admin has separated families who crossed the border legally at ports of entry and then requested asylum[1]. [1]: https://www.aclu.org/blog/immigrants-rights/immigrants-rights-and-detention/fact-checking-family-separation https://www.aclu.org/blog/immigrants-rights/immigrants-right...
- nyolfen 8y agocrossing the border illegally is
- xnyan 8y agoPlease name a misdemeanor crime that results in loss of custody of your dependent children on the first offense.
- deleted 8y ago[deleted]
- fzeroracer 8y agoI'm pretty sure we don't permanently separate families for doing things like petty theft. There's also the the 'Affluenza' case where a teenager killed four people and got off scott-free. Well, until he was found fleeing probation in a foreign country and was dragged back here. So I don't know: Do you think crossing the border is worse than murder?
- mohammedbin 8y agoSo who is doing this? And why? I only know the top leaders of US politics and all of them pretend that they are holy and the other side is pure evil. Funnily a child comment to you points out that "trump puts children in cage" and I followed the issue and somebody said it was an Obama era photo and they were detained by Obama because the so called parents were actually traffickers which I of course would support Obama for
- toiletfuneral 8y agoI'm pretty sure the people getting tear gassed over globalization at the G8 were against capital leveraging international workers to destroy domestic labor power and the ones getting tear gassed recently are fighting against policies targeting immigrant and refugee communities. It seems pretty consistent to want to protect workers and also fight xenophobia.
- RadiconCDF 8y agoThose are entirely unrelated positions. The first is a stance against a clear consequence of globalization, one that has had extremely negative effects for the American middle class. The other is a stance on social issues, unrelated to labor.
- alexnewman 8y agoThe left was the major source of anti immigration law until they replaced xenophobic labor laws with today's political reality
- alexnewman 8y agoWhy was this so downvoted?
- anigbrowl 8y agoThey think it's political point scoring but you are substantially correct. Maybe mentioning that this shift took place in the late 80s and 90s would have helped.
- mc32 8y agoYep, indeed. This has turned quite strikingly since the Seattle round. Democrats used to be pro-Us workers. Pro-Union. Now they forget about US workers, except to demand minimum wage increases but that does not do anything to protect well-paying union jobs which get shipped off or get undercut by illegal workers who work for less then minimum wage. It's quite interesting to see the Trump faction take this mantle and the Democrats (and traditional Repubs) have no idea how to react except to be reactionary and be pro-Globalization pro-TPP, pro-intervention, etc.
- toomanybeersies 8y agoGlobalism is part of the core philosophy of neo-liberalism, which most mainline political parties were advocating up until the past couple of years when public sentiment went against globalism. Both Republicans and Democrats were in favour of the TPP, for example. Globalism is orthogonal to leftism/rightism. Brexit support was roughly similar among both Labour and Conservative party supporters.
- kakarot 8y agoChomsky's Profit over People is also a fantastic read.