8 ms·

If its important enough to put in on boarding, its important to have it handily available through easy to access means during regular use.

aidos 8y ago
Why? The initial setup is for the things you set once and never need to change. I tell my phone I want it in English during on boarding - and then I never need that setting again.
- fit2rule 8y ago
  Eyesight changes over time. People learn new languages, and want to switch. Making these decisions for the user and then forcing them forever is decidedly un-user-friendly.
  - coldtea 8y ago
    Or, you know, the person can search for 1-2 minutes how to change the font, when they need to, if and when their "eyesight changes" enough during their years of using iPhones to warranty it. Better than cramming every such feature as a first priority, and making a UI that's confusing for everyday use.
    - fit2rule 8y ago
      You didn't read the article? Even though its buried there, in the system prefs, people who need to change such settings still cannot find them. That's the point: the UI is already confusing for everyday use, and we honestly expect better of Apple.
      - coldtea 8y ago
        >You didn't read the article? Even though its buried there, in the system prefs, people who need to change such settings still cannot find them. They can always look them up (online), set them, and forget them. Better than having all such settings front and center over more commonly used settings.
        jscholes 8y ago
        > They can always look them up (online), set them, and forget them. But they don't. You're a reader of HN. It is fairly obvious that you're the sort of person who, at a point when you need to accomplish something you don't know how to accomplish, will assume that it's possible and start with research. But there are a lot of people out there who will start with the assumption that not being able to see their phone screen so well anymore is just something to put up with. The entire point of this post and discussion is that Apple may not be providing the best experience for those users for whom it would never even cross their mind that changing the text size on their phone is possible.
        Double_a_92 8y ago
        Would you say that everyones grandparents (which mostly could use that setting) are capable of googling tutorials? Even most young people I know are not able to google things (even if it's some important information they urgently need). Or maybe they just don't get the idea of even asking the internet.
      - Cthulhu_ 8y ago
        What operating systems have settings like these in a more intuitive location?
      - dublin 8y ago
        Apple's design of Settings has clearly evolved via accretion rather than any thoughtful and considered design. The fact that something is possible in a UI/UX has no bearing on the fact that it's fundamental design can still suck huevos.
    - aidos 8y ago
      Or 1-2 seconds. The 3 steps are explained at the top of the Google search: https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=change+font+size+iphone https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=change+font+size+iphone
  - Naracion 8y ago
    How often do you think this happens? I am through and through an Android + Windows user and hate Apple for certain things but I do have to admit their design decisions are pretty solid most of the time. It's not like you're learning a new language everyday. Nor losing your eyesight. Keep in mind that the life of a cellphone is anywhere between one and six years, for most tends to be around three (speculation). Isn't reason enough to make it a top priority for people to be able to access language / text size changes in their settings everyday.
  - Cthulhu_ 8y ago
    Forcing them forever is not the case, IDK where you're getting that from. Language settings and text size / other accessibility settings are in the settings and nowadays ios even has a search function in there.
    - fit2rule 8y ago
      If an elderly person can't find these settings buried in some menu system, they're as good as set forever.
coldtea 8y ago
I don't think so. What's important for setup is not important everyday. Some things you just need to be able to set once and forget. No reason to put those things front and center.
- fit2rule 8y ago
  Language? I'd quite like to be able to change that frequently. I see no good reason to have mono-culture enforced by the OS. There are three languages spoken in my household, by various family members. Changing the language dynamically for them would be a benefit, not a hindrance. Text size? Same - I often have to show something to my elderly family members, but digging deep into the menu's to find the Text Size setting is very distracting. I think what's happening in this thread is that people are simply attempting to justify bad design decisions without thinking things through. Language should be something you can change, with ease. Same with text size. Ditto, Wifi access, etc.
  - coldtea 8y ago
    >Language? I'd quite like to be able to change that frequently. I see no good reason to have mono-culture enforced by the OS. That's an outlier request, if I ever saw one, and the accusation is absurd (they give localizations for the OS and tons of things like Siri for dozens or hundreds of languages, so to say they ..."enforce a mono-culture" because they don't allow one to see Spanish one day and French the next on the menu" is contrived at best. The vast majority of people just don't change the language frequently, and wouldn't do it even if it had a dedicated rotary switch on the side. If that's the best argument, Apple is doing pretty well.
    - ovi256 8y ago
      It's not an outlier for me. Most people I know switch between English for work and international friends and the local language for mostly everything else. I'm switching languages I type in every whatsapp conversation. On an older Android version that doesn't track per chat language, I have to switch the keyboard every single time. Three languages. And I happen to know more.
kall 8y ago
You can put it in control center and have it be about as easily adjustable as brightness. It‘s not there by default and hard to discover, but adjusting your text size all the time really is a bit of a niche feature. I‘m really not sure what else Apple could do other than: - Asking during onboarding - Putting it in Display as well as Accessibility settings - Having a control center button
- mulletbum 8y ago
  This has no basis in reality. Putting a feature like this upfront will cause more accidents than it will allow people with vision issues to use it frequently. People with vision issues need almost all text to be larger. These same people will be the ones accidently hitting this bar instead of brightness and not knowing how to fix it.
  - kall 8y ago
    I have very bad vision and I use the feature regularly but I imagine I‘m like 1 of 500 people. Accidents are not an issue though since I oversold it being as easy as brightness. You need to force press the icon before you can slide up/down.
- ashildr 8y ago
  I really like this idea. Actually, I have it in control center on my iDevices, but I’m not sure if I had to turn that on.

aidos 8y ago

Why? The initial setup is for the things you set once and never need to change. I tell my phone I want it in English during on boarding - and then I never need that setting again.

fit2rule 8y ago
Eyesight changes over time. People learn new languages, and want to switch. Making these decisions for the user and then forcing them forever is decidedly un-user-friendly.
- coldtea 8y ago
  Or, you know, the person can search for 1-2 minutes how to change the font, when they need to, if and when their "eyesight changes" enough during their years of using iPhones to warranty it. Better than cramming every such feature as a first priority, and making a UI that's confusing for everyday use.
  - fit2rule 8y ago
    You didn't read the article? Even though its buried there, in the system prefs, people who need to change such settings still cannot find them. That's the point: the UI is already confusing for everyday use, and we honestly expect better of Apple.
    - coldtea 8y ago
      >You didn't read the article? Even though its buried there, in the system prefs, people who need to change such settings still cannot find them. They can always look them up (online), set them, and forget them. Better than having all such settings front and center over more commonly used settings.
      - jscholes 8y ago
        > They can always look them up (online), set them, and forget them. But they don't. You're a reader of HN. It is fairly obvious that you're the sort of person who, at a point when you need to accomplish something you don't know how to accomplish, will assume that it's possible and start with research. But there are a lot of people out there who will start with the assumption that not being able to see their phone screen so well anymore is just something to put up with. The entire point of this post and discussion is that Apple may not be providing the best experience for those users for whom it would never even cross their mind that changing the text size on their phone is possible.
      - Double_a_92 8y ago
        Would you say that everyones grandparents (which mostly could use that setting) are capable of googling tutorials? Even most young people I know are not able to google things (even if it's some important information they urgently need). Or maybe they just don't get the idea of even asking the internet.
    - Cthulhu_ 8y ago
      What operating systems have settings like these in a more intuitive location?
    - dublin 8y ago
      Apple's design of Settings has clearly evolved via accretion rather than any thoughtful and considered design. The fact that something is possible in a UI/UX has no bearing on the fact that it's fundamental design can still suck huevos.
  - aidos 8y ago
    Or 1-2 seconds. The 3 steps are explained at the top of the Google search: https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=change+font+size+iphone https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=change+font+size+iphone
- Naracion 8y ago
  How often do you think this happens? I am through and through an Android + Windows user and hate Apple for certain things but I do have to admit their design decisions are pretty solid most of the time. It's not like you're learning a new language everyday. Nor losing your eyesight. Keep in mind that the life of a cellphone is anywhere between one and six years, for most tends to be around three (speculation). Isn't reason enough to make it a top priority for people to be able to access language / text size changes in their settings everyday.
- Cthulhu_ 8y ago
  Forcing them forever is not the case, IDK where you're getting that from. Language settings and text size / other accessibility settings are in the settings and nowadays ios even has a search function in there.
  - fit2rule 8y ago
    If an elderly person can't find these settings buried in some menu system, they're as good as set forever.

coldtea 8y ago

I don't think so. What's important for setup is not important everyday. Some things you just need to be able to set once and forget. No reason to put those things front and center.

fit2rule 8y ago
Language? I'd quite like to be able to change that frequently. I see no good reason to have mono-culture enforced by the OS. There are three languages spoken in my household, by various family members. Changing the language dynamically for them would be a benefit, not a hindrance. Text size? Same - I often have to show something to my elderly family members, but digging deep into the menu's to find the Text Size setting is very distracting. I think what's happening in this thread is that people are simply attempting to justify bad design decisions without thinking things through. Language should be something you can change, with ease. Same with text size. Ditto, Wifi access, etc.
- coldtea 8y ago
  >Language? I'd quite like to be able to change that frequently. I see no good reason to have mono-culture enforced by the OS. That's an outlier request, if I ever saw one, and the accusation is absurd (they give localizations for the OS and tons of things like Siri for dozens or hundreds of languages, so to say they ..."enforce a mono-culture" because they don't allow one to see Spanish one day and French the next on the menu" is contrived at best. The vast majority of people just don't change the language frequently, and wouldn't do it even if it had a dedicated rotary switch on the side. If that's the best argument, Apple is doing pretty well.
  - ovi256 8y ago
    It's not an outlier for me. Most people I know switch between English for work and international friends and the local language for mostly everything else. I'm switching languages I type in every whatsapp conversation. On an older Android version that doesn't track per chat language, I have to switch the keyboard every single time. Three languages. And I happen to know more.

kall 8y ago

You can put it in control center and have it be about as easily adjustable as brightness. It‘s not there by default and hard to discover, but adjusting your text size all the time really is a bit of a niche feature. I‘m really not sure what else Apple could do other than: - Asking during onboarding - Putting it in Display as well as Accessibility settings - Having a control center button

mulletbum 8y ago
This has no basis in reality. Putting a feature like this upfront will cause more accidents than it will allow people with vision issues to use it frequently. People with vision issues need almost all text to be larger. These same people will be the ones accidently hitting this bar instead of brightness and not knowing how to fix it.
- kall 8y ago
  I have very bad vision and I use the feature regularly but I imagine I‘m like 1 of 500 people. Accidents are not an issue though since I oversold it being as easy as brightness. You need to force press the icon before you can slide up/down.
ashildr 8y ago
I really like this idea. Actually, I have it in control center on my iDevices, but I’m not sure if I had to turn that on.