10 ms·

Text size is part of the onboarding now.

ehsankia 8y ago
Yep, that's how Android does it too. Text size is a very important option for older folks, and having people pick it during the initial setup alongside other accessibility options, helps a lot.
- robterrell 8y ago
  I just set up a pixel 3 and it didn't ask anything about text size? Onboarding was like 3 steps, including "plug in your old phone".
  - yoz-y 8y ago
    Onboard if tends to be quite different if you already had a device though. With an iPhone you can just put it close to your old one and it will suck in everything. But if you set it up anew it will ask questions about privacy setup, text size and so on.
cududa 8y ago
It has been since the 6/ 2015
fit2rule 8y ago
If its important enough to put in on boarding, its important to have it handily available through easy to access means during regular use.
- aidos 8y ago
  Why? The initial setup is for the things you set once and never need to change. I tell my phone I want it in English during on boarding - and then I never need that setting again.
  - fit2rule 8y ago
    Eyesight changes over time. People learn new languages, and want to switch. Making these decisions for the user and then forcing them forever is decidedly un-user-friendly.
    - coldtea 8y ago
      Or, you know, the person can search for 1-2 minutes how to change the font, when they need to, if and when their "eyesight changes" enough during their years of using iPhones to warranty it. Better than cramming every such feature as a first priority, and making a UI that's confusing for everyday use.
      - fit2rule 8y ago
        You didn't read the article? Even though its buried there, in the system prefs, people who need to change such settings still cannot find them. That's the point: the UI is already confusing for everyday use, and we honestly expect better of Apple.
        coldtea 8y ago
        >You didn't read the article? Even though its buried there, in the system prefs, people who need to change such settings still cannot find them. They can always look them up (online), set them, and forget them. Better than having all such settings front and center over more commonly used settings.
        jscholes 8y ago
        > They can always look them up (online), set them, and forget them. But they don't. You're a reader of HN. It is fairly obvious that you're the sort of person who, at a point when you need to accomplish something you don't know how to accomplish, will assume that it's possible and start with research. But there are a lot of people out there who will start with the assumption that not being able to see their phone screen so well anymore is just something to put up with. The entire point of this post and discussion is that Apple may not be providing the best experience for those users for whom it would never even cross their mind that changing the text size on their phone is possible.
- coldtea 8y ago
  I don't think so. What's important for setup is not important everyday. Some things you just need to be able to set once and forget. No reason to put those things front and center.
  - fit2rule 8y ago
    Language? I'd quite like to be able to change that frequently. I see no good reason to have mono-culture enforced by the OS. There are three languages spoken in my household, by various family members. Changing the language dynamically for them would be a benefit, not a hindrance. Text size? Same - I often have to show something to my elderly family members, but digging deep into the menu's to find the Text Size setting is very distracting. I think what's happening in this thread is that people are simply attempting to justify bad design decisions without thinking things through. Language should be something you can change, with ease. Same with text size. Ditto, Wifi access, etc.
    - coldtea 8y ago
      >Language? I'd quite like to be able to change that frequently. I see no good reason to have mono-culture enforced by the OS. That's an outlier request, if I ever saw one, and the accusation is absurd (they give localizations for the OS and tons of things like Siri for dozens or hundreds of languages, so to say they ..."enforce a mono-culture" because they don't allow one to see Spanish one day and French the next on the menu" is contrived at best. The vast majority of people just don't change the language frequently, and wouldn't do it even if it had a dedicated rotary switch on the side. If that's the best argument, Apple is doing pretty well.
      - ovi256 8y ago
        It's not an outlier for me. Most people I know switch between English for work and international friends and the local language for mostly everything else. I'm switching languages I type in every whatsapp conversation. On an older Android version that doesn't track per chat language, I have to switch the keyboard every single time. Three languages. And I happen to know more.
- kall 8y ago
  You can put it in control center and have it be about as easily adjustable as brightness. It‘s not there by default and hard to discover, but adjusting your text size all the time really is a bit of a niche feature. I‘m really not sure what else Apple could do other than: - Asking during onboarding - Putting it in Display as well as Accessibility settings - Having a control center button
  - mulletbum 8y ago
    This has no basis in reality. Putting a feature like this upfront will cause more accidents than it will allow people with vision issues to use it frequently. People with vision issues need almost all text to be larger. These same people will be the ones accidently hitting this bar instead of brightness and not knowing how to fix it.
    - kall 8y ago
      I have very bad vision and I use the feature regularly but I imagine I‘m like 1 of 500 people. Accidents are not an issue though since I oversold it being as easy as brightness. You need to force press the icon before you can slide up/down.
  - ashildr 8y ago
    I really like this idea. Actually, I have it in control center on my iDevices, but I’m not sure if I had to turn that on.
jtokoph 8y ago
I bet the end users are not setting up the phones themselves and the younger people doing the setup skip all of the prompts except WiFi.
- simonh 8y ago
  Not if you do it in an Apple Store, at least in my experience.
  - stuaxo 8y ago
    I'm guessing most people get their phones from their phone provider or online. And of course there are still countries where there is no Apple store, but you see quite a few iPhones.
  - Sharlin 8y ago
    Only a small fraction of iPhone users have ever been to an Apple Store, never mind bought their phone from one.
  - LyndsySimon 8y ago
    Siri says that the nearest Apple Store to me is 265 miles (a 4h 38m drive) from me. It seems a bit of a stretch to ask everyone around me to drive go there every time they get a new phone.
    - georgespencer 8y ago
      > everyone around me [...] every time they get a new phone Reality: people who feel that they need help, and for most features it's a one-time trip with settings passed from phone to phone as you upgrade.
- dspillett 8y ago
  That isn't Apple's fault though. As much as I'm not a fan of their products, there is very little you can do to help users when they (by proxy in this case) ignore or avoid your attempts to help them. Making the option easier to find after on-boarding might help, but for the users you describe it would need to be very easy to access and you will fill any list of quick-access options very quickly if you include things they may only want to use one or twice in the life of the phone rendering the "quick access" a big scary list that is neither quick nor easy. Even if you do find a good place for the option: will that class of user even know to look for it never mind find it? They'd just ask the person who on-boarded them instead so the technical level of the target audience has changed back to someone who at least knows how to Google for where to find a more buried option.
cmurphycode 8y ago
I suppose a nice compromise here would be to make an intelligent decision whether to bring up a prompt asking if you want to change the font size. For instance, if the FaceID detects that your face is farther or closer from the screen than normal, or that you're squinting.
- dublin 8y ago
  Maybe, but I can say without reservation that the times I find my personal technologies the most frustrating are when they're "trying to help me". 99% of the time, this is the WRONG thing to do - for instance if my phone "helpfully" resizes my text, then there's a very good chance that I can no longer see everything I was trying to see on the tiny screen in the first place, as it will have reflowed off-screen! FAIL! It MAY be OK to ASK if I want help, but just jumping in and doing something is most likely to result in, "Shut up and do what I tell you!" (in the words of Beka Valentine...)

Yep, that's how Android does it too. Text size is a very important option for older folks, and having people pick it during the initial setup alongside other accessibility options, helps a lot.

robterrell 8y ago
I just set up a pixel 3 and it didn't ask anything about text size? Onboarding was like 3 steps, including "plug in your old phone".
- yoz-y 8y ago
  Onboard if tends to be quite different if you already had a device though. With an iPhone you can just put it close to your old one and it will suck in everything. But if you set it up anew it will ask questions about privacy setup, text size and so on.

cududa 8y ago

It has been since the 6/ 2015

fit2rule 8y ago

If its important enough to put in on boarding, its important to have it handily available through easy to access means during regular use.

aidos 8y ago
Why? The initial setup is for the things you set once and never need to change. I tell my phone I want it in English during on boarding - and then I never need that setting again.
- fit2rule 8y ago
  Eyesight changes over time. People learn new languages, and want to switch. Making these decisions for the user and then forcing them forever is decidedly un-user-friendly.
  - coldtea 8y ago
    Or, you know, the person can search for 1-2 minutes how to change the font, when they need to, if and when their "eyesight changes" enough during their years of using iPhones to warranty it. Better than cramming every such feature as a first priority, and making a UI that's confusing for everyday use.
    - fit2rule 8y ago
      You didn't read the article? Even though its buried there, in the system prefs, people who need to change such settings still cannot find them. That's the point: the UI is already confusing for everyday use, and we honestly expect better of Apple.
      - coldtea 8y ago
        >You didn't read the article? Even though its buried there, in the system prefs, people who need to change such settings still cannot find them. They can always look them up (online), set them, and forget them. Better than having all such settings front and center over more commonly used settings.
        jscholes 8y ago
        > They can always look them up (online), set them, and forget them. But they don't. You're a reader of HN. It is fairly obvious that you're the sort of person who, at a point when you need to accomplish something you don't know how to accomplish, will assume that it's possible and start with research. But there are a lot of people out there who will start with the assumption that not being able to see their phone screen so well anymore is just something to put up with. The entire point of this post and discussion is that Apple may not be providing the best experience for those users for whom it would never even cross their mind that changing the text size on their phone is possible.
coldtea 8y ago
I don't think so. What's important for setup is not important everyday. Some things you just need to be able to set once and forget. No reason to put those things front and center.
- fit2rule 8y ago
  Language? I'd quite like to be able to change that frequently. I see no good reason to have mono-culture enforced by the OS. There are three languages spoken in my household, by various family members. Changing the language dynamically for them would be a benefit, not a hindrance. Text size? Same - I often have to show something to my elderly family members, but digging deep into the menu's to find the Text Size setting is very distracting. I think what's happening in this thread is that people are simply attempting to justify bad design decisions without thinking things through. Language should be something you can change, with ease. Same with text size. Ditto, Wifi access, etc.
  - coldtea 8y ago
    >Language? I'd quite like to be able to change that frequently. I see no good reason to have mono-culture enforced by the OS. That's an outlier request, if I ever saw one, and the accusation is absurd (they give localizations for the OS and tons of things like Siri for dozens or hundreds of languages, so to say they ..."enforce a mono-culture" because they don't allow one to see Spanish one day and French the next on the menu" is contrived at best. The vast majority of people just don't change the language frequently, and wouldn't do it even if it had a dedicated rotary switch on the side. If that's the best argument, Apple is doing pretty well.
    - ovi256 8y ago
      It's not an outlier for me. Most people I know switch between English for work and international friends and the local language for mostly everything else. I'm switching languages I type in every whatsapp conversation. On an older Android version that doesn't track per chat language, I have to switch the keyboard every single time. Three languages. And I happen to know more.
kall 8y ago
You can put it in control center and have it be about as easily adjustable as brightness. It‘s not there by default and hard to discover, but adjusting your text size all the time really is a bit of a niche feature. I‘m really not sure what else Apple could do other than: - Asking during onboarding - Putting it in Display as well as Accessibility settings - Having a control center button
- mulletbum 8y ago
  This has no basis in reality. Putting a feature like this upfront will cause more accidents than it will allow people with vision issues to use it frequently. People with vision issues need almost all text to be larger. These same people will be the ones accidently hitting this bar instead of brightness and not knowing how to fix it.
  - kall 8y ago
    I have very bad vision and I use the feature regularly but I imagine I‘m like 1 of 500 people. Accidents are not an issue though since I oversold it being as easy as brightness. You need to force press the icon before you can slide up/down.
- ashildr 8y ago
  I really like this idea. Actually, I have it in control center on my iDevices, but I’m not sure if I had to turn that on.

jtokoph 8y ago

I bet the end users are not setting up the phones themselves and the younger people doing the setup skip all of the prompts except WiFi.

simonh 8y ago
Not if you do it in an Apple Store, at least in my experience.
- stuaxo 8y ago
  I'm guessing most people get their phones from their phone provider or online. And of course there are still countries where there is no Apple store, but you see quite a few iPhones.
- Sharlin 8y ago
  Only a small fraction of iPhone users have ever been to an Apple Store, never mind bought their phone from one.
- LyndsySimon 8y ago
  Siri says that the nearest Apple Store to me is 265 miles (a 4h 38m drive) from me. It seems a bit of a stretch to ask everyone around me to drive go there every time they get a new phone.
  - georgespencer 8y ago
    > everyone around me [...] every time they get a new phone Reality: people who feel that they need help, and for most features it's a one-time trip with settings passed from phone to phone as you upgrade.
dspillett 8y ago
That isn't Apple's fault though. As much as I'm not a fan of their products, there is very little you can do to help users when they (by proxy in this case) ignore or avoid your attempts to help them. Making the option easier to find after on-boarding might help, but for the users you describe it would need to be very easy to access and you will fill any list of quick-access options very quickly if you include things they may only want to use one or twice in the life of the phone rendering the "quick access" a big scary list that is neither quick nor easy. Even if you do find a good place for the option: will that class of user even know to look for it never mind find it? They'd just ask the person who on-boarded them instead so the technical level of the target audience has changed back to someone who at least knows how to Google for where to find a more buried option.

cmurphycode 8y ago

I suppose a nice compromise here would be to make an intelligent decision whether to bring up a prompt asking if you want to change the font size. For instance, if the FaceID detects that your face is farther or closer from the screen than normal, or that you're squinting.

dublin 8y ago
Maybe, but I can say without reservation that the times I find my personal technologies the most frustrating are when they're "trying to help me". 99% of the time, this is the WRONG thing to do - for instance if my phone "helpfully" resizes my text, then there's a very good chance that I can no longer see everything I was trying to see on the tiny screen in the first place, as it will have reflowed off-screen! FAIL! It MAY be OK to ASK if I want help, but just jumping in and doing something is most likely to result in, "Shut up and do what I tell you!" (in the words of Beka Valentine...)