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>>When it comes to pension funds, investing in anything volatile like hedge funds is an incredibly irresponsible thing to do. Ideally. But then you have thing

by kamaal 8y ago

>>When it comes to pension funds, investing in anything volatile like hedge funds is an incredibly irresponsible thing to do. Ideally. But then you have things like: https://www.mercurynews.com/2016/11/01/bart-janitor-grossed-270k-in-pay-and-benefits-last-year/ https://www.mercurynews.com/2016/11/01/bart-janitor-grossed-... and look at stories here: https://hn.algolia.com/?query=pensions&sort=byPopularity&prefix&page=0&dateRange=all&type=story https://hn.algolia.com/?query=pensions&sort=byPopularity&pre... Mostly unions graciously award over time work, and other benefits to people about to retire in the last years. Since the pension benefits are based on the benefits and pay in the last years, You now have retirees drawing millions in benefits and pay. I guess in California a lot of tax dollars already go to pay pensions then help build schools and roads. You can't exactly pay all that big money pensions by just investing in bonds alone.

rtkwe 8y ago
The thing the galls me the most about that article is it doesn't once stop to try to say or find out how much the guy is working to bring in that much, spoiler it's going to be a lot of hours given it's overtime and his base compensation is only 50k. Pensions are a fine tool but they have to be funded responsibly, states liked to use them as an incentive but then refused to properly fund them banking instead on large returns. Companies did the same thing for a long time but they've been allowed to cut benefits to retirees when they run dry and have since moved on to 401ks if they offer any thing at all.
- SilasX 8y ago
  >The thing the galls me the most about that article is it doesn't once stop to try to say or find out how much the guy is working to bring in that much, spoiler it's going to be a lot of hours given it's overtime and his base compensation is only 50k. You're right, it deceptively leaves out such vital information. It also leaves out: - how productive he actually was for each of those 80 hours - how many workers "only" at 1.5x time were willing to take those shifts but denied because of seniority - how much of the compensation came from the non-standard practice of letting him redeem PTO for 2x its value by applying it to week where he already worked overtime - whether those long, hard hours actually translated into clean BART stations, or were just roundabout compensation for being physically present but ineffective Once you have that full picture, I'm pretty sure the typical person's initial reaction will be closer to right than wrong.
- kamaal 8y ago
  I don't think the problem is compensation. The problem is awarding overtime only in the last year, so that your pay and benefits can go up forever till you are entitled to pensions. This creates a situation where your pension + benefits can be in the ballpark of half a million dollars all life. No one, no investment, no taxation can pay for something like that. More here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1638926 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1638926 http://www.latimes.com/projects/la-me-el-monte-pensions/ http://www.latimes.com/projects/la-me-el-monte-pensions/ https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14083193 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14083193 >>Pensions are a fine tool but they have to be funded responsibly And who is going to fund them? As of now California tax payers are paying for pensions. Surely this is not a sustainable way of running things?
  - rtkwe 8y ago
    > And who is going to fund them? As of now California tax payers are paying for pensions. Surely this is not a sustainable way of running things? Why not the rest of public sector employees compensation comes out of tax revenues. The only reason pensions are unsustainable now is because in order to hide the cost of pensions the budgets underfuneded pensions years ago and the funds they did allocate they assumed extremely high returns on.

by kamaal 8y ago

rtkwe 8y ago

The thing the galls me the most about that article is it doesn't once stop to try to say or find out how much the guy is working to bring in that much, spoiler it's going to be a lot of hours given it's overtime and his base compensation is only 50k. Pensions are a fine tool but they have to be funded responsibly, states liked to use them as an incentive but then refused to properly fund them banking instead on large returns. Companies did the same thing for a long time but they've been allowed to cut benefits to retirees when they run dry and have since moved on to 401ks if they offer any thing at all.

SilasX 8y ago
>The thing the galls me the most about that article is it doesn't once stop to try to say or find out how much the guy is working to bring in that much, spoiler it's going to be a lot of hours given it's overtime and his base compensation is only 50k. You're right, it deceptively leaves out such vital information. It also leaves out: - how productive he actually was for each of those 80 hours - how many workers "only" at 1.5x time were willing to take those shifts but denied because of seniority - how much of the compensation came from the non-standard practice of letting him redeem PTO for 2x its value by applying it to week where he already worked overtime - whether those long, hard hours actually translated into clean BART stations, or were just roundabout compensation for being physically present but ineffective Once you have that full picture, I'm pretty sure the typical person's initial reaction will be closer to right than wrong.
kamaal 8y ago
I don't think the problem is compensation. The problem is awarding overtime only in the last year, so that your pay and benefits can go up forever till you are entitled to pensions. This creates a situation where your pension + benefits can be in the ballpark of half a million dollars all life. No one, no investment, no taxation can pay for something like that. More here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1638926 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1638926 http://www.latimes.com/projects/la-me-el-monte-pensions/ http://www.latimes.com/projects/la-me-el-monte-pensions/ https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14083193 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14083193 >>Pensions are a fine tool but they have to be funded responsibly And who is going to fund them? As of now California tax payers are paying for pensions. Surely this is not a sustainable way of running things?
- rtkwe 8y ago
  > And who is going to fund them? As of now California tax payers are paying for pensions. Surely this is not a sustainable way of running things? Why not the rest of public sector employees compensation comes out of tax revenues. The only reason pensions are unsustainable now is because in order to hide the cost of pensions the budgets underfuneded pensions years ago and the funds they did allocate they assumed extremely high returns on.