4 ms·

It's pretty amazing what you can put them through too. As a MacBook owner Lenovo's dust tests have me wincing: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hazDhYq8YOo htt

It's pretty amazing what you can put them through too. As a MacBook owner Lenovo's dust tests have me wincing: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hazDhYq8YOo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hazDhYq8YOo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hO5LGICeOuk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hO5LGICeOuk And the waterproofing is kind of incredible: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ig3xI8dUdm0&t=1650s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ig3xI8dUdm0&t=1650s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KmdcutSxmn0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KmdcutSxmn0 Now that they make a solid, thin, repairable, upgradeable 15" laptop for creative types (ThinkPad X1 Extreme), it's becoming increasingly tempting to switch as a MacBook owner, even if I have to ditch macOS.

_emacsomancer_ 8y ago
I've seen reports of people successfully Hackintoshing Thinkpads, so you wouldn't necessarily have to ditch macOS (though there are better options for Thinkpads anyway, IMO).
- Fnoord 8y ago
  Back in those days, ThinkWiki was an excellent resource. Not sure nowadays? I ran Mac OS X (as it was called back then) on my ThinkPad R61 back in the days (2008 or so?). Everything worked, but I did have to replace the Intel WiFi with an Atheros one and fiddle with all kind of options (it is likely easier these days). One or the other supported packet injection. Mac OS X (I think it was 10.6 or 10.7?) did boot a bit slower than 'Linux' though (probably ran Ubuntu with GNOME 2 back in those days; with a more lightweight WM/DE it'd have been even quicker). The TrackPoint is one of those amazing tools I miss on a Mac. However, the Magic Trackpad 2 works on Linux and Windows. See this HN discussion [1] for details. Together with a HHKB with BT I have an excellent keyboard and pointer device supporting BT and USB. I even have carry bags to protect both devices. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18273559 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18273559
  - _emacsomancer_ 8y ago
    The ThinkWiki still seems to be a good source of information, though pretty much everything 'just works' on ThinkPads under Linux. I'm not sure it has information on Hackintoshing, but I've seen detailed instructions elsewhere[1], though I've never tried it. I seem to be incapable of using Touchpads/Trackpads properly without getting frustrated. It was only after I 'discovered' ThinkPads that I was able to use a laptop as a device that sat on top my lap (rather than having to have somewhere I could use a mouse). Whenever I have to try to use a colleague's Mac laptop, I feel like a clumsy idiot trying to use the touchpad. [1] E.g. http://x220.mcdonnelltech.com/ http://x220.mcdonnelltech.com/
    - Fnoord 8y ago
      The newer Macbook Pro's (Macbook's as well AFAIK) contain a larger touchpad. Apart from the horrible butterfly keyboard (that was before breadcrumbgate or whatever it was called; the noise alone, horrible!) I ended up mistakenly touch it numerous times and if it sits on your lap I suppose you could end up touching the trackpad mistakenly at that point because it sits very close near the edge (small 'bezel'?). The Apple Magic Trackpad 2 however is the same size as the trackpad on older MB(P)s, and it has Bluetooth and USB (lightning). You can put it on the left side of your keyboard or laptop if you wish to, just like you'd put your mouse. I cannot compare it to Apple Magic Mouse though; but I can say I had a wired Apple mouse (one button) which I used with a Mac Pro G5. Not my cup.
      - _emacsomancer_ 8y ago
        On my ThinkPads which have touchpads, I just physically open up the machine and unplug it - I only ever accidentally use the touchpad, so prefer to forestall that physically. I've never used the Apple Magic Trackpad (1 or 2), but the issue would be – even if I managed to be able to use it – it would be back being non-ideal for actual use on top of my lap.
        Fnoord 8y ago
        Yes, I did that as well my ThinkPads but my accuracy with the TrackPoint isn't as great as with the Apple Magic Trackpad 2. Forget the multitouch; that alone makes it worthwhile (on a side note, vertical mouse scrolling however might be interesting against RSI). Although if you primary use keybinds it isn't that important I do find it important whilst browsing the web. Which is probably why I got into the AMT2. I use a HHKB and AMT2. Both can be used wired and wireless. I don't need the device near me; both of these can be used remotely.
mcv 8y ago
ThinkPads have always been known for their extreme reliability. Not officially ruggedised, but close enough for most people. MacOS isn't as good as it used to be, in my opinion. I currently have a 2011 Macbook Pro, but I'm pretty sure my next laptop is not going to be a Macbook. I'll use this one until it wear out, but after that, ThinkPad is definitely high on the list. I'm just looking for a Linux distro that does basically what OS X does. Or did. I'm not happy with Apple's direction lately.
- modernerd 8y ago
  I intend to slug it out with Windows 10 if I switch from MacBook to ThinkPad. I love Linux (Arch/KDE enthusiast) but there are benefits to Windows too: it generally has better support for gaming, gamedev (all the gamedev live streamers I follow seem to be perfectly productive with Windows), C# development, Adobe apps, and deeper hardware integration (biometrics/Windows Hello and touchscreen support). There still seems to be a huge stigma with using Windows in some developer communities, but I think I can live with that…
  - mcv 8y ago
    Does Windows come with a better command line shell yet? That's the big thing keeping me away. There's just so much unix-based tooling (works on both Linux and Mac) that I don't want to go without.
    - modernerd 8y ago
      Yes, there is the Windows Subsystem for Linux (WSL), which is a compatibility layer for running Linux binaries natively on Windows: https://www.hanselman.com/blog/TheYearOfLinuxOnTheWindowsDesktopWSLTipsAndTricks.aspx https://www.hanselman.com/blog/TheYearOfLinuxOnTheWindowsDes... https://github.com/sirredbeard/Awesome-WSL https://github.com/sirredbeard/Awesome-WSL https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/wsl/install-win10 https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/wsl/install-win10 I haven't switched to Windows 10 full-time yet, but WSL works remarkably well whenever I've tried it. Cmder (http://cmder.net/ http://cmder.net/) and ConEmu (https://conemu.github.io/ https://conemu.github.io/) are pretty decent terminal emulators and Terminus (https://eugeny.github.io/terminus/#header https://eugeny.github.io/terminus/#header ) looks promising too. (It's hard to beat iTerm, though.) My other concern with Windows 10 was security and viruses. Last time I used Windows every day (~1999!) that was a huge concern, but it seems to be less of one now. Most seem to consider using the standard Windows-supplied virus checker just fine if you're not torrenting dodgy stuff and opening strange email attachments. The following guide (from the @SwiftOnSecurity twitter author) was helpful: https://decentsecurity.com/#/securing-your-computer/ https://decentsecurity.com/#/securing-your-computer/ It contains much the same advice for Windows that you'd expect to see for keeping macOS secure too — keep stuff up-to-date, encrypt your drives, don't try to disable User Account Control or Device Guard (like Gatekeeper on Mac). I've found that chocolatey (https://chocolatey.org/ https://chocolatey.org/) is a great replacement for brew, Laragon (https://laragon.org/ https://laragon.org/) is a good alternative to Valet, and Autohotkey (https://autohotkey.com/ https://autohotkey.com/) is unrivaled for general system automation. (See Tom Scott waxing lyrical about Windows and AHK here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lIFE7h3m40U https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lIFE7h3m40U ).

_emacsomancer_ 8y ago

I've seen reports of people successfully Hackintoshing Thinkpads, so you wouldn't necessarily have to ditch macOS (though there are better options for Thinkpads anyway, IMO).

Fnoord 8y ago
Back in those days, ThinkWiki was an excellent resource. Not sure nowadays? I ran Mac OS X (as it was called back then) on my ThinkPad R61 back in the days (2008 or so?). Everything worked, but I did have to replace the Intel WiFi with an Atheros one and fiddle with all kind of options (it is likely easier these days). One or the other supported packet injection. Mac OS X (I think it was 10.6 or 10.7?) did boot a bit slower than 'Linux' though (probably ran Ubuntu with GNOME 2 back in those days; with a more lightweight WM/DE it'd have been even quicker). The TrackPoint is one of those amazing tools I miss on a Mac. However, the Magic Trackpad 2 works on Linux and Windows. See this HN discussion [1] for details. Together with a HHKB with BT I have an excellent keyboard and pointer device supporting BT and USB. I even have carry bags to protect both devices. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18273559 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18273559
- _emacsomancer_ 8y ago
  The ThinkWiki still seems to be a good source of information, though pretty much everything 'just works' on ThinkPads under Linux. I'm not sure it has information on Hackintoshing, but I've seen detailed instructions elsewhere[1], though I've never tried it. I seem to be incapable of using Touchpads/Trackpads properly without getting frustrated. It was only after I 'discovered' ThinkPads that I was able to use a laptop as a device that sat on top my lap (rather than having to have somewhere I could use a mouse). Whenever I have to try to use a colleague's Mac laptop, I feel like a clumsy idiot trying to use the touchpad. [1] E.g. http://x220.mcdonnelltech.com/ http://x220.mcdonnelltech.com/
  - Fnoord 8y ago
    The newer Macbook Pro's (Macbook's as well AFAIK) contain a larger touchpad. Apart from the horrible butterfly keyboard (that was before breadcrumbgate or whatever it was called; the noise alone, horrible!) I ended up mistakenly touch it numerous times and if it sits on your lap I suppose you could end up touching the trackpad mistakenly at that point because it sits very close near the edge (small 'bezel'?). The Apple Magic Trackpad 2 however is the same size as the trackpad on older MB(P)s, and it has Bluetooth and USB (lightning). You can put it on the left side of your keyboard or laptop if you wish to, just like you'd put your mouse. I cannot compare it to Apple Magic Mouse though; but I can say I had a wired Apple mouse (one button) which I used with a Mac Pro G5. Not my cup.
    - _emacsomancer_ 8y ago
      On my ThinkPads which have touchpads, I just physically open up the machine and unplug it - I only ever accidentally use the touchpad, so prefer to forestall that physically. I've never used the Apple Magic Trackpad (1 or 2), but the issue would be – even if I managed to be able to use it – it would be back being non-ideal for actual use on top of my lap.
      - Fnoord 8y ago
        Yes, I did that as well my ThinkPads but my accuracy with the TrackPoint isn't as great as with the Apple Magic Trackpad 2. Forget the multitouch; that alone makes it worthwhile (on a side note, vertical mouse scrolling however might be interesting against RSI). Although if you primary use keybinds it isn't that important I do find it important whilst browsing the web. Which is probably why I got into the AMT2. I use a HHKB and AMT2. Both can be used wired and wireless. I don't need the device near me; both of these can be used remotely.

mcv 8y ago

ThinkPads have always been known for their extreme reliability. Not officially ruggedised, but close enough for most people. MacOS isn't as good as it used to be, in my opinion. I currently have a 2011 Macbook Pro, but I'm pretty sure my next laptop is not going to be a Macbook. I'll use this one until it wear out, but after that, ThinkPad is definitely high on the list. I'm just looking for a Linux distro that does basically what OS X does. Or did. I'm not happy with Apple's direction lately.

modernerd 8y ago
I intend to slug it out with Windows 10 if I switch from MacBook to ThinkPad. I love Linux (Arch/KDE enthusiast) but there are benefits to Windows too: it generally has better support for gaming, gamedev (all the gamedev live streamers I follow seem to be perfectly productive with Windows), C# development, Adobe apps, and deeper hardware integration (biometrics/Windows Hello and touchscreen support). There still seems to be a huge stigma with using Windows in some developer communities, but I think I can live with that…
- mcv 8y ago
  Does Windows come with a better command line shell yet? That's the big thing keeping me away. There's just so much unix-based tooling (works on both Linux and Mac) that I don't want to go without.
  - modernerd 8y ago
    Yes, there is the Windows Subsystem for Linux (WSL), which is a compatibility layer for running Linux binaries natively on Windows: https://www.hanselman.com/blog/TheYearOfLinuxOnTheWindowsDesktopWSLTipsAndTricks.aspx https://www.hanselman.com/blog/TheYearOfLinuxOnTheWindowsDes... https://github.com/sirredbeard/Awesome-WSL https://github.com/sirredbeard/Awesome-WSL https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/wsl/install-win10 https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/wsl/install-win10 I haven't switched to Windows 10 full-time yet, but WSL works remarkably well whenever I've tried it. Cmder (http://cmder.net/ http://cmder.net/) and ConEmu (https://conemu.github.io/ https://conemu.github.io/) are pretty decent terminal emulators and Terminus (https://eugeny.github.io/terminus/#header https://eugeny.github.io/terminus/#header ) looks promising too. (It's hard to beat iTerm, though.) My other concern with Windows 10 was security and viruses. Last time I used Windows every day (~1999!) that was a huge concern, but it seems to be less of one now. Most seem to consider using the standard Windows-supplied virus checker just fine if you're not torrenting dodgy stuff and opening strange email attachments. The following guide (from the @SwiftOnSecurity twitter author) was helpful: https://decentsecurity.com/#/securing-your-computer/ https://decentsecurity.com/#/securing-your-computer/ It contains much the same advice for Windows that you'd expect to see for keeping macOS secure too — keep stuff up-to-date, encrypt your drives, don't try to disable User Account Control or Device Guard (like Gatekeeper on Mac). I've found that chocolatey (https://chocolatey.org/ https://chocolatey.org/) is a great replacement for brew, Laragon (https://laragon.org/ https://laragon.org/) is a good alternative to Valet, and Autohotkey (https://autohotkey.com/ https://autohotkey.com/) is unrivaled for general system automation. (See Tom Scott waxing lyrical about Windows and AHK here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lIFE7h3m40U https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lIFE7h3m40U ).